Work of a Madman !!

RichBrew

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2010
Messages
5,022
Reaction score
7,661
This is not a case of bi-polar disorder (unless they just want to lump it in), but clearly a sociopath.

I appreciate that. I was merely pointing out that mental illness - in all its guises - more often than not goes undiagnosed, let alone untreated, and the available help for such a condition is very thin on the ground, no matter where you live.

RichBrew
 

Mark C

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 6, 2009
Messages
2,419
Reaction score
5,185
We had a good thread going on this that got deleted. Lame.

The father: "Why did Chris die? Chris died because of craven, irresponsible politicians and the NRA. They talk about gun rights, what about Chris' right to live?"

Wow, shifting the blame much? I feel for the guy, I truly do. But YOUR SON is responsible.

A victim's father said that, not the father of the shooter.
 

Tone deaf

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 12, 2011
Messages
37,547
Reaction score
86,492
"I don't know why you girls are so repulsed by me,"

"I know exactly where their house is and I've sat outside it in my car to stalk them many times,"

I'm not making light of this situation. It is a huge tragedy for all involved. I haven't read all the articles and don't have the background on this kid but, I don't think that his oddness was a secret. I found the juxtaposition of the two passages, above, to be illuminating.
 

Tone deaf

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 12, 2011
Messages
37,547
Reaction score
86,492
A victim's father said that, not the father of the shooter.

Regardless of who said what or the fact that most of the victims were assailed with things other than guns (car, knife), the focus will be on the guns because that is the agenda. What someone says in the midst of soul-crushing grief and pain is not off limits for those pushing that agenda. Had he said that it was the fault of the state, he probably would have been arrested.

Severe, mental illness is a huge burden on the families that chose to shoulder it. When they don't take on that responsibility, the burden it often metastasizes to many other, innocent families.

[Edit:]

I just read an article about the statement released by the killer's family. My main take away was this:
This country, this world, needs to address mental illness and the ramifications from not recognizing these illnesses.
The attorney went on, later, to say that the family was in favor of gun control. I didn't get the impression that the family was blaming guns so much as the media.

The media is stating the story as if he shot all seven of his murder victims. As far as I can tell, he stabbed three, shot three and the cause of the death of the seventh is unclear. He also wounded four with his car. Does anyone really think that if he had access to zero guns he wouldn't have hurt anyone?
 

James Carney

V.I.P. Member
Joined
May 19, 2010
Messages
7,420
Reaction score
15,730
What was he responsible for?
Being in a deli at the wrong time.
He was the last one shot.

Shooter> Elliot Rodger
Last victim> Christopher Michaels-Martinez

Good call, my bad. When I read the article and saw "the father" I thought they meant the shooter's father. D'oh!
But still, certainly not the NRA's fault...
 

artis_xe

Christopher
Joined
Jan 15, 2013
Messages
23,911
Reaction score
108,230
This is not a case of bi-polar disorder (unless they just want to lump it in), but clearly a sociopath.

so difficult to tell , or make a diagnosis __ just from a set of videos . the bad acting and flatness could be a symptom of many different psychological disorders . everything from bi-polar to schizoaffective . and the idea of sociopath vs psychopath __ who knows ?

I'm just curious how the kid passed these videos off to the authorities . even someone that makes that kind of threat ( in jest ? ? ) __ needs some serious help
 

Barcham

Elitist Club Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
10,603
Reaction score
19,986
Here in Canada, posting any such videos or even threats on Facebook or other social media site will trigger an arrest and an in depth investigation. Police would have taken his apartment apart and found his weapons and this guy would have spent quite a long time in a mental facility.

Leaving the decision to a couple of patrol officers was negligent. At the very least, he should have been seen by a shrink.
 

Blackie

Banned
Joined
Mar 24, 2010
Messages
12,805
Reaction score
37,718
.. The killers family or lawyer has said he was under the care of several doctors or psychologists or therapists .. or councilors .. and he had high function Aspergers syndrome .. whatever that is .. I will look it up ..

High Functioning Asperger's Symptoms | LIVESTRONG.COM

"they do exhibit particular difficulties with give-and-take social interactions that go beyond simple faux pas"

.. got to be more going on ..
 

Barcham

Elitist Club Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
10,603
Reaction score
19,986
I see a number of wrongful death lawsuits being filed in the near future, both against the killer's family as well as the police department.
 

Roberteaux

Super Mod
V.I.P. Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2010
Messages
34,895
Reaction score
163,066
The police are in no way qualified to make any judgement as to whether anybody needs to be sectioned or not.

In Florida, we have a law known as the Baker Act, which allows police officers to subject an individual to involuntary commitment to a psychiatric medical facility.

The criteria for this action is that the patient must be dangerous to himself as a result of self-neglect rising from a psychiatric condition, or is dangerous to himself or others in a more proactive fashion, because of his psychiatric condition.

The neglect cases are easy to substantiate... but when it comes to whether or not to take a person into custody because he or she is violent as a result of his or her psychosis, the rationale becomes quite a bit trickier. In Florida, at least, it is not enough that somebody might be dangerous-- they must also be imminently dangerous... and this is not always the easiest thing to convince the intake personnel at the hospital of.

In my former career, I probably served over a dozen orders to take a patient into custody that were issued by a judge after a family applied for a Baker Act writ on behalf of a troubled family member... but over an eight year period, only took a couple or maybe three people into custody right off the street under the provisions of the Baker Act.

The police in Florida are often reluctant to perform a Baker Act on a citizen because they know that bed space is limited and the chances that the intake physician might refuse to accept the patient are high, if only for that reason. But also, it has to be very clear to everyone who will examine the patient and his or her case that the patient is suffering from a profound psychiatric malady, and that the he or she was definitely about to harm himself or somebody else as a result of suffering from mental illness. This isn't always the easiest thing to prove to intake personnel who were not at the scene when the cop decided to invoke the Baker Act, as even the most fey have a habit of calming right down and appearing to be reasonable once they see that they're about to be confined as such. In addition, the cop is forced to almost predict the future, and to justify the belief that the patient really was about to do something drastic to himself or somebody else.

Typically, instead of trying to get a subject locked down on a Baker Act, the cops around here just find a reason to arrest the subject on some criminal charge or other, no matter how cheesy a charge it might be, just to get them off the street and to allow whatever situation they were causing to die away as a result of their removal. As a result, there are plenty of people to be found in jails who really should be receiving psych help in a secure facility.

Had this case taken place in Florida, the police would have been hard-pressed to justify the involuntary commitment, as verbal threats are not really seen as being all that effective as criteria for the Baker Act. To seize and confine a person because of his or her psychiatric condition is rightfully seen by the courts as amounting to a substantial curtailment of the civil rights of the patient-- while arresting somebody is much, much easier to accomplish.

And so that's what the cops tend to do: just make an arrest, and put the subject on ice via a criminal charge.

--R
 

Laggspike

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2013
Messages
7,648
Reaction score
10,780
he should have shot him self to start with, then the problem wouldent be this big :(

I feel sad for the other people who died :(
 

Tone deaf

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 12, 2011
Messages
37,547
Reaction score
86,492
Don't people pay prostitutes for sex anymore?

I thought that in practice one was actually paying them to leave (after sex) as opposed to paying for sex.

Either way, the same thought had occurred to me. I'm guessing that while he may have justified his hate with the fact that he was a loathesome loser his action were driven by a deeper mental defect.
 

Mule Train

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2010
Messages
9,636
Reaction score
10,554
He was a coward, it's that simple. He couldn't live with the shame of being a coward.

My heart goes out to the victims and their family's.
 

HenryHill

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2010
Messages
16,239
Reaction score
40,406
If he'd have made threats on his own life, they'd have locked him pronto, 3 days minimum.

Threaten the President even, and you just get a talking to.

That ain't the gun or knive's fault. :cool:


Ever notice how often these nut case mass murderers are so often very well off, poorly adjusted young men?

Are the parents just oblivious to how nuts they are, are they just continuing to not pay attention or not care, until the nut case becomes an icon for mental health treatments?

Him and Lanza were both spoiled sons of wealthy fathers whose business or career was very time consuming.
 

El Pablo

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2014
Messages
1,605
Reaction score
2,303
Proper treatment of mental illness typically goes beyond most parent's capabilities. However, I do believe most parents have the capability to know when a child's behavior isn't rational. If you have a sick child, it is your responsibility to help them get treated. If you think your child may be a danger to yourself or others, it is your responsibility to try and protect them and others from them. Start with a counselor for goodness sakes!

I have been surrounded by 'crazy' my entire life. There is no cure. On-going monitoring with counseling and/or prescription meds is a must.
 

Scooter2112

Double Platinum Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2008
Messages
23,991
Reaction score
34,817
Apparently in this "everyone gets a trophy" society, not everyone gets a trophy.

Learn to deal with life's inconsistencies and stop thinking that society owes you something.

Rot in hell....dick!!
 

James Carney

V.I.P. Member
Joined
May 19, 2010
Messages
7,420
Reaction score
15,730
At least James Holmes was too much a pvssy to successfully kill himself, and is being monitored 24x7 to ensure he rots away and suffers the rest of his life.
I wish the same could be said for these other clowns.

Then again, I can never get over the fact Mark David Chapman is still alive, so I guess I'm torn.
 

Barcham

Elitist Club Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
10,603
Reaction score
19,986
In this case the parents did contact police regarding his videos and behaviour so they were not totally oblivious to things. The police made the choice to do nothing.
 

Latest Threads



Top