Where did my thread "Whos using Virgil Arlo" go ?

AcVox

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The Virgil Arlo thread was (in my opinion) an entirely healthy attempt on my part to bring together those already using these popular PAF style humbuckers, with those curious to learn more about them (myself included).
The content, to the best of my recollection was good natured, courteous, informative and balanced.

This is the second thread to dissappear. My "Whos using Tone Specific" posed a truly open ended question with no agenda other than to gather views from our forum brothers and sisters, that might inform those considering buying these pickups..
 
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ARandall

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There has been a bit of......concealment......maybe, about the whole TS vs VA association. First there was vehment denial about the shared origins, then later when evidence came to light there was a reluctant admission, then an overt defensiveness and diverting behaviour (which continues to this day seemingly with these recent threads).

Seemingly VA the person is a ghost.....or was - I haven't honestly been bothered to keep up with it. Generally speaking as a business owner you at least put up a front of a visible persona. The way it appeared was that VA was just a sock puppet.

For mine, the way TS has set themselves up is with a lot of hyperbole and grandiosity....taking a leaf from the Stephens Designs playbook. There is no sense of a personal connection to owner the way you get with a genuine knowledgeable person like James at Rewind, or the Davids at Zhangbucker and Sigil, or Craig at Vineham. Even Jon from Throbak - who does tend to get very nerdy - has the product and the facts to back him up.
These exude a quiet confidence that you get from a true craftsman who cut through the BS and have a product to deliver, not a marketing spiel.
It is for this reason that the aforementioned winders get a lot of business here.
 

VictorB

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It’s as simple as this: when these threads turn into sales threads, they go bye bye.

When the Vendor pops into these threads and begins the hard sell, with links, etc… well we don’t allow that here.Vendors and Sponsors have their own area to advertise.

Spamming the forum is a no no for everyone.

Oh, and Antigua? You’re gone buddy. For the 1000th time. You’ll never learn apparently.
 

Duane_the_tub

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There has been a bit of......concealment......maybe, about the whole TS vs VA association. First there was vehment denial about the shared origins, then later when evidence came to light there was a reluctant admission, then an overt defensiveness and diverting behaviour (which continues to this day seemingly with these recent threads).

Seemingly VA the person is a ghost.....or was - I haven't honestly been bothered to keep up with it. Generally speaking as a business owner you at least put up a front of a visible persona. The way it appeared was that VA was just a sock puppet.

For mine, the way TS has set themselves up is with a lot of hyperbole and grandiosity....taking a leaf from the Stephens Designs playbook. There is no sense of a personal connection to owner the way you get with a genuine knowledgeable person like James at Rewind, or the Davids at Zhangbucker and Sigil, or Craig at Vineham. Even Jon from Throbak - who does tend to get very nerdy - has the product and the facts to back him up.
These exude a quiet confidence that you get from a true craftsman who cut through the BS and have a product to deliver, not a marketing spiel.
It is for this reason that the aforementioned winders get a lot of business here.
There is a ton of truth in this post, but I disagree with the inference that Dave isn't at - or above - the same level as those other guys. Sure, his marketing is aggressive to the point of obnoxiousness, but his pickups are absolutely the real deal.
 
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cooljuk

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I could have been more graceful, in the first thread. I could have also just kept my mouth shut. Neither of which, I'll admit, are strengths of mine. I apologize, particularly to Vic, if I contributed to a mess he had to clean up.

I was less then professional to throw the guy under the bus with those photos of the insides of his pickups. I confess that it pushed my buttons when he blamed his customers for pickup failures when I had personally seen assembly flaws that caused DOA pickups. I probably should have bit my lip, though. It could have been me that made those mistakes.

If I ever do something that, you guys hold my feet to the fire the same way and make sure I man up and own it / fix it!
 

ToneSpecific

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I had personally seen assembly flaws that caused DOA pickups. I probably should have bit my lip, though. It could have been me that made those mistakes.

If I ever do something that, you guys hold my feet to the fire the same way and make sure I man up and own it / fix it!
It's good practice not to question the motives of other people, but it is curious that a competitor would show up on a forum in what appeared to be an attempt to damage another outfit. It seems to be a bit of a pattern but others have done the same thing.

Regarding the photos that were posted & claims that were made, the story doesn't add up. The damage to the pickup likely occurred during removal of the cover. Mr. Arlo's pickups all went through sound tests before they shipped out.

If he damaged the coil during installation of the cover, the pickup would have never shipped. If the pickup did somehow get past his QC tests and arrived to the customer DOA, then the customer would have certainly reached out in frustration & the pickup would have been replaced the pickup for free.

His excellent customer service was well known by his customers and well documented in a thread over on TGP in which the poster explains a set of his pickups sold and damaged on the secondary market that were replaced free of charge.

It might be possible that one of Mr. Arlo's customers reached out to you for customer service instead of contacting the maker directly but nearly impossible that a pickup in that condition left Arlo's shop.

In any event, you appear to be well liked in these circles and we wish you continued success.
 
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Neffco

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Well here’s the neck pup in a 335 through a twin. I believe I had the twin a little loud for the phone.
Just to keep things in one spot, here’s the same pup through a Marshall. Hybrid picking and a few chords. I have no dog in the fight but i do have a TS pickup.
 
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cooljuk

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It's good practice not to question the motives of other people...
Can't say I personally agree with that. I think motives are important. In a interesting coincidence, a fellow named "Virgil" wrote a poem titled The Aeneid about a city named Troy who accepted a "gift" of a large wooden horse. That horse, if you don't know the story, resulted in the destruction of Troy, as it was full of Greek soldiers, having actually been a secret weapon and never a gift, all along. Motives overlooked, city fell.
 

ARandall

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And to quote Red Dwarf
"From this particular phase in history we derive the phrase, "Beware of Greeks bearing gifts," when it would be much more logical to derive the phrase, "Beware of Trojans, they're complete smegheads!"
 

AcVox

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Guitarists like details, clear and transparent.. Facts that can be independently verified, demonstrable and repeatable.

The purpose behind my Virgil A, and in particular the Tone S thread was to bring those using these humbuckers together with those curious but cautious about them in a non confrontational, but factual dialogue. and examination of the objective qualities of these humbuckers for which there is a woeful lack of clear, and transparent technical detail.
 

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