Weight relief

[1allspub]

I think it's more in the mind of knowing than in the actual guitar. I bet you couldn't tell a traditional weight relieved from a non weight relieved if you didn't know.

Yep. I have played Non-Weight Relieved Trads (2013 & 2014) and Traditionally Weight Relieved ones (2011, 2012, & 2016) one right after they other while Trad shopping at local stores. The weight relieving (or lack thereof) did not make or break a guitar tonally. Sometimes the TWR'd ones were better, sometimes the NWR'd ones were better. It was more about the individual guitar(s) as a whole. One thing I can say is typically, TWR'd Trads are indeed lighter than NWR'd ones (shocking, I know! )

And thus, I have come to prefer the TWR'd simply because, it's easier to find a lighter weight Trad that is TWR'd than one that isn't. Not saying there aren't some light NWR'd ones out there or some heavy TWR'd ones (there are!). It just depends on the individual piece(s) of mahogany making up the guitar. But just logically... take any given LP and if it's weight relieved it's going to weigh less than if it were not.

That said, some people just really dig the idea of NWR... I get it... the same way that some people just really dig the idea of a 1-piece back. They just want them that way because they do... the heart wants what the heart wants (I want sub 9lbs LPs if I can have them, that's important to me and I go out of my way to find them if possible).

 

[SingeMonkey]

Chambering makes a pretty clear difference on most guitars. Weight relief far less so. Probably none at all. The pickups are still sitting on a solid block running from the bridge through to the neck. Most of the bulk of the guitar is solid (much too solid when it comes to my 6kg weight relieved LP).

And yes, the only way you could test would be to build an LP, test it, steam the top off, weight relieve it, glue the top back on and then test it again.

 

[edro]

Chambering makes a pretty clear difference on most guitars. Weight relief far less so. Probably none at all. The pickups are still sitting on a solid block running from the bridge through to the neck. Most of the bulk of the guitar is solid (much too solid when it comes to my 6kg weight relieved LP).

And yes, the only way you could test would be to build an LP, test it, steam the top off, weight relieve it, glue the top back on and then test it again.

Folks would then argue for a couple of years the glue was different....




Oh, in reference to earlier comments:

BBQ maple IS da cheeze and me likey Bakelight boards long time too....

So there... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[GT08]

I use a 2008 Les Paul Standard (chambered) into a Marshall TSL 100 and 1960a 4x12 cab.
Both live on stage and in the studio at home, I very rarely experience any unwanted feedback, and trust me, I play bloody loud.

 

[TheX]

Yes. Compare a chambered LP to a true solid-body LP.

*yawn*

 

[MikeyTheCat]

All joking aside, the 2017 lineup will have an "ultra modern weight relief" option....
This new weight relieving architecture did NOT affect wave forms on a computer...

So what does that mean exactly?

Well, to my brain it says that weight relief options they had been using DID affect sound wave forms which meant sound/tone was altered...
Otherwise, why test and implement a new "ultra modern weight relief" option...

The fact Gibson was using wave form analysis suggests sound(eg tone) was affected by pre-2017 weight relief techniques...

-Chris

Or just marketing.

Anyway everyone knows it's the format of the serial numbers that effects tone the most.

 

[Mr. Satchmo]

I have owned 6 Gibson Les Pauls in my life

one was chambered, one has modern weight relief, two have traditional weight relief, and one is sold body. They all sound the same, like a Les Paul, they all have tons of sustain. The only difference is that the chambered one and the modern weight relief one have more feedback that's all.

Tell me which is which

note: I sold the chambered studio a while back

 

[ehamady6]

I might hear an insignificant difference between a chambered and non-chambered when they're unplugged, but they sound the same to me when the pickups take over.

 

[edro]

In the chambered, some of the sound gets trapped in the hole and can't get out so when it does that and it bounces around all over the place inside the chamber while some of the sound that ain't trapped all bouncing around gets out but some don't and that's why. Pickguard especially the binding wrapped around the guitar takes off the mass and I would say the nut. Simple.

 

[Mindfrigg]

Thanks professor.

 

[edro]

You is welcome.

 

[SingeMonkey]

I have owned 6 Gibson Les Pauls in my life

one was chambered, one has modern weight relief, two have traditional weight relief, and one is sold body. They all sound the same,

I've never heard two LPs that sound exactly the same–let alone weight relieved vs. chambered. I've definitely heard the difference on the chambered ones. The "airiness" people refer to. A bit like the similar Duo-Jet.

The best LPs I've ever heard have been solid. But I think that's coincidence and had more to do with the thickness of the necks on them and the tightness of the neck joint.

Edit: I'm totally GASsing for a White Penguin. But that's supposed to sound that way. I like my LPs solid for preference. My 2010 Tokai LP, with a 1pc solid back is a lot more resonant and vintage sounding than my 1984 weight-relieved Gibson LP Deluxe. It's lighter too.

 

[JCM900MkIII]

Wow.
How basic do we have to get?


Stadard tuning guitar frequency range:
~100 Hz - 2000Hz (roughly)


Wavelength in feet and inches or metres and centimetres
20Hz 56.5ft 17.22m
50Hz 22.6ft 6.89m
100Hz 11.3ft 3.44m
400Hz 2.83ft 0.86m
1,000Hz 1.13ft 0.34m
5,000Hz 2.71in 6.89cm
10,000Hz 1.36in 3.44cm
20,000Hz 0.68in 1.72cm

As you can see in this table, 1000Hz requires a distance of AT THE VERY LEAST 1.13ft or 34cm or 0.34m to make a full cycle.

How big do the holes/chambers need to be to have ANY kind of resonance inside the holes/chambers??? (you need to stack waves to create resonance, so you need the holes/chambers to be of a size of 2x the wavelength).
Emmenthaler style weightrelief (cheese) has holes of ~1 inch? The resonant frequency would be somewhere between 10kHz and 20kHz (well outside the frequency range of a guitar)
Chambered? Those holes are 3-3.5 inch? Now we are getting close. But still out of the frequency range of our guitars (2000Hz)


(For the record)

(Lower freqs, means bigger holes/chambers to create "resonance". higher frequencies require a smaller space. (It doesn't happen. You can stop calculating. This is theoretical).

FWIW what people hear as resonance is string resonance or speaker resonance. No such thing as "chamber resonance" (chamber = chambered guitar) in a solidbody electric guitar.




(toanwoodz anyone?)

 

[ARandall]

Chambered is much larger than what you say. The largest distance being from front of guitar to back......maybe 30cm. Maybe you are mistakenly thinking of modern weight relief.

And its never the fundamental but the harmonics. Its always the harmonics in electric guitar.....which then brings even the modern into the frame using your calculations.

 

[JCM900MkIII]

Chambered is much larger than what you say. The largest distance being from front of guitar to back......maybe 30cm. Maybe you are mistakenly thinking of modern weight relief.

And its never the fundamental but the harmonics. Its always the harmonics in electric guitar.....which then brings even the modern into the frame using your calculations.

I most certainly did mix up.
And yes, it seems it would be possible with a real chambered guitar (not the weight relief types which I was thinking of)

 

[Mats A]

Then how solid is what's called a solid Les Paul? There is the pickup switch cavity, pickup cavities, wire cavity and control cavity.

 

[1allspub]

Then how solid is what's called a solid Les Paul? There is the pickup switch cavity, pickup cavities, wire cavity and control cavity.

Precisely.

 

[mgenet]

Hmm.

Don't know. Don't care. If I like the way it plays, feels and sounds
I'll buy it...

in the end...is it a keeper?

 

[dro]

Do they not ALL sound different from one another? Every one I have had has sounded different.

 

[MSB]

^ lol its just that "good" wood.