Tuning issues: ES 335 1964 Reissue Murphy Lap

Aero84

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Hi everyone

I got an ES 335 1964 Reissue Murphy Lab with the vintage Kluson tuners.

They do work fine on the low E, A and D strings but I have an issue on the higher 3 strings: G, B and E

When I tune up, I need to turn the tuner keys about a quarter turn until the strings start to increase the pitch - basically nothing happens during the first quarter turn, only past that point everything works well.

Any ideas?

Thanks.
Aero
 

dc007

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I need to turn the tuner keys about a quarter turn until the strings start to increase the pitch
Do you get a pop after the quarter turn? If so definitely the nut. Is the tuning peg turning when you are turning the tuning key or is there a delay in the peg moving as well?
 

jenton70

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I've had many Klusons that were loose like that. And I'm guessing they've always been a bit dodgy if the number of original Gibsons that were changed to Grover is any indication.
 

mdubya

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It is the nut.

Use No. 2 pencil lead (graphite) or Big Bends Nut Sauce to lube the nut slots.

You can have a luthier/tech address the nut, too, but you will still need lube to be sure.

I have used a so called world class luthier for several guitars. He has insisted on making bone nuts for most of my guitars. He still lubes the nut slots, even with his "world class" nut.

The Graphtech nut on my LP Special is quite incredible and I have not needed to lube it one bit.

I would recommend you stick with the stock nut, though. Nothing wrong with it, just needs lube.

There is definitely nothing wrong with your tuners.

And, yes, I realize this is probably a troll a$$ thread started by a manic care giver. :doh::wave:

No :photos: no guitar.
 
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gitmohair

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I've had many Klusons that were loose like that. And I'm guessing they've always been a bit dodgy if the number of original Gibsons that were changed to Grover is any indication.

I've heard of this issue, but never seen it to be fair - to be expected from worn tooling etc I'd guess and they did make a lot of them. However, the OP's guitar (if stock) won't have the original "original Klusons", it'll have the WD korean ones, which AFAIK they re-tooled to make. And all three treble side ones having the same problem? Anything's possible but surely the nut is the place to start looking here.

If I'd spent the sort of money on a guitar these things cost the first thing it'd have seen is a decent luthier (I might have given it a couple of months at home to bed in first, but I wouldn't be wondering about non-catastrophic problems then, just noting them) but that's just me. But it does sound to me like this guitar just needs setting up.
 

Aero84

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Thanks all for the feedback. True, the nut but be causing this, but in my case definitely not.

When turning the tuners, there is no resistance in the first quarter turn - as soon as they grip I can feel resistance and the strings then increase in pitch.

Knowing Gibson customer service, they will support mento get it fixed - they never let me down on any of my custom shop guitars.

Just wanted to know if this is « common ». At this point I only have an R7 and R9 that I can use for comparison, but they do not exhibit the problem I have on the 64 ES335. However I used my ES much more than any Gibson I currently own :)

I know many folks do not like the Kluson tuners, thus many guitars got other tuners fitted back then - wondering if this is the cause.

Thanks all
 

Aero84

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It is the nut.

Use No. 2 pencil lead (graphite) or Big Bends Nut Sauce to lube the nut slots.

You can have a luthier/tech address the nut, too, but you will still need lube to be sure.

I have used a so called world class luthier for several guitars. He has insisted on making bone nuts for most of my guitars. He still lubes the nut slots, even with his "world class" nut.

The Graphtech nut on my LP Special is quite incredible and I have not needed to lube it one bit.

I would recommend you stick with the stock nut, though. Nothing wrong with it, just needs lube.

There is definitely nothing wrong with your tuners.

And, yes, I realize this is probably a troll a$$ thread started by a manic care giver. :doh::wave:

No :photos: no guitar.
Do you get a pop after the quarter turn? If so definitely the nut. Is the tuning peg turning when you are turning the tuning key or is there a delay in the peg moving as well?
As mentioned in my previous post, nut is fine. The peg is moving but without any resistance until it grips.
 

ARandall

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If you are turning the post and the shaft the string attaches to is not rotating, then you are in the 0.1% of cases where the tuning issue might just be fixed by replacing the tuners.
 

RufusTelestrat

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The nut may not be the primary problem but I am hard to understand why lubing it with pencil lead or graphite or even nut sauce is a bad idea. In my experience this makes the tuners work better, even if they are struggling to tighten the string.
 

gitmohair

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The nut may not be the primary problem but I am hard to understand why lubing it with pencil lead or graphite or even nut sauce is a bad idea. In my experience this makes the tuners work better, even if they are struggling to tighten the string.

Certainly not a bad idea at all, I use (soft) pencil lead on all mine, just good practice, slows nut wear and helps coping with my particular playing style. But then the nuts on mine have been fixed where necessary...

Tuning issues with stock (ie "not set up for the individual player's string choices/style") nuts? Fairly common in my experience. Tuning issues caused by decent tuners on high-end guitars? Not so common, again IMHO.
 

Shelkonnery

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As many already stated, it's highly unlikely that all 3 tuning pegs on the same side are faulty or badly installed in such a high end instrument (although with Gibson there's always a first I guess).

You mentioned the problem is with the high unwound strings.
Are they properly strung?

Could it be when you first turn it, the string slips a bit before gripping enough to start turning?

It should look like something like this.

IMG_0087 copy.jpg
 

uncle mud

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As mentioned in my previous post, nut is fine. The peg is moving but without any resistance until it grips.
I say replace the tuners and move on. Nobody needs this kind of frustration, when all you want to do is play.
 

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