Trying to downsize! How do I replace my Marshall Vintage Modern Head with a smaller head?

[skelingtony]

I am trying to downsize to smaller gear. Downsized from large heavy cabs, smaller pedalboard (still pretty large), getting rid of guitars that do not get used... But amplifiers are proving hard.

My favourite amp is a Marshall Vintage Modern head. In low dynamic mode it is a great clean pedal platform, in high dynamic mode it has amazing overdrive/distortion - pretty much the sound I have in my head when I write songs, and the sound I try to get from pedals with other amps.

It sounds great loud (and it is LOUD) but I can also turn it down to home practice levels using the master volume, where it doesn't sound as good but is still very useable.

But it is too large. I really want a head that is roughly similar in what it can do, just smaller.

I like my fuzzes into a cleanish amp, not an overdriven or edge of breakup amp so I need something with lots of 'clean' volume - that takes pedals well with lots of uncompressed clean headroom.

But I also want the amp to do the overdrive/distortion thing well without pedals.

I play doom/stoner/alt rock/ambient stuff in my current band, with a hard hitting drummer.

I have tried:

Orange Micro Dark - not enough clean headroom, needs an EQ and a reverb in the effects loop to work well for me as the simple 'shape' control was problematic with my setup, and just isn't loud enough with a drummer if used as a clean pedal platform. Still have this one as a spare.

Marshall DSL heads - great distortion tones, but not much clean headroom, sounded squashed or compressed if I hit with a fuzz, especially playing loud live. Got rid of this.

Fender Bassbreaker - really didn't like this one for my needs

Orange CR120 Super Crush - almost there. Great clean pedal platform, and almost great for overdriven/distorted tones - but those tones have (to my ear) and unpleasant solid state fizz on note decay, and when playing quieter for dynamics - like an overdrive pedal rather than an amp distorting. Still have this one.

Marhall Origin 20 - does half the job. Possibly the best 'pedal platform' amp I have ever used. Beautiful cleans, and takes fuzz pedals amazingly, with lots of clean uncompressed headroom. Incredible. BUT does not actually get distortion and overdrive unless run very very loud, and when it does it is not the slightly angular, cutting 'vintage aggressive' sound I like to use with the Vintage Modern.

Any suggestions? Anyone else using a smaller valve head both live and at home both as a clean pedal platform, and overdriven/distorted?

I liked the look of the Marshall Studio Vintage but have been told it doesn't get drive/distortion at home volume levels like the vintage modern can (is this true?), and the Marshall Studio Classic but have been told that this just doesn't have enough clean headroom and clean volume for a band if gain is set to c2.5 as I typically would for a JCM800 using fuzzes. It's hard to test the Studio Classic without bringing an OpAmp muff and playing at gigging volume at the store, which they would not appreciate.

I am about to give up and just use pedals for my overdrive sounds, as it feels like I am keeping a large, heavy full sized valve head just as a big distortion pedal, albeit a very very nice one.

 

[skelingtony]

Apologies for the the longest post I have ever made, ever.

 

[TXOldRedRocker]

Apologies for the the longest post I have ever made, ever.

No apology necessary. It's a very good question. I've not had a VM, and don't have any good advice for you. I use three JCM 800's, a 1987x, and two Fender's.

 

[DeafDumbBlind Kid]

sounds like the amp you have is the one you need, you've already found that the readily available stuff doesn't do what you want. Sometimes there aren't any substitutes. You will likely be less than satisfied and regret letting the VM go.

embrace the largeness.

 

[ErictheRed]

I'd try the Studio Classic, if you aren't playing with a full band it should have enough headroom. Possibly the Studio Silver Jubilee.

 

[Elmore]

I had the same problem, but I kept my Marshall head. I put two Celestian greenbacks into a Vader 2x12 cabinet. Marshall logo added for stage use.

 

[searswashere]

Sounds like OP loves his amp, keep it.

 

[Big John]

VM 2x12 combo?

 

[dc007]

I never found an amp to do what my VM did. But it became too much as far as floor space and volume. With pedals the Egnater Rebel 20 got me a good smaller rig.

 

[Note Milker]

Once you get rid of that amp.... You'll be looking for it. And the next exact same one won't do it. You love that damn thing. Careful..... I'm worried about you, don't do it.

 

[Tiboy]

I have a VM and companion 412 cab. I also have a Suhr PT15 and companion 212 cab. I use them differently, but I’m guessing the PT will give you most if not all of what you’re looking for in a smaller package. Downside is the cost.

 

[LPTDMSV]

The Vina

VM 2x12 combo?

You can find those pretty cheap now, they're not fashionable.

The Vintage Modern is rather unique by Marshall standards in its gain structure, controls and channel separation. Most other Marshalls there's now a compact 20W equivalent but not the VM.

 

[LPTDMSV]

I'd probably keep it, find a modern lightweight cab like a Barefaced

 

[searswashere]

if the 212 is stored horizontally, its not really a space savings imo. I had two 212s and now I have two 412s - not much real estate difference if the 212s had been side by side.

I still vote OP keeps the amp though!

Edit: people buy amps for their overdrive and/or distortion, using one for that purpose is usually why its built in the first place.

@skellingtony do you need less *volume* or a smaller physical amp, or both? If the former, use that volume knob if the latter, a smaller headshell wont move the dial much unless its half the size.

 

[LPTDMSV]

Think like a double-bass player - no it’s not very handy, but no other way to get that sound …

 

[skelingtony]

Thanks for the replies.

I do need the volume - we play loud in the band, and I need to be heard over a loud drummer.

I don't 'love' the Vintage Modern's tone - I mean it sounds great, but I would be happy with something a bit different sounding... I just love that it does loud clean AND loud dirty AND high headroom clean pedal platform without getting compressed.

I just hoped a smaller sized amp head was an option, and that I was being old fashioned having a giant Marshall head and not realising that there were better (easier to move and store) options.

I was just hoping one of the modern smaller amp heads might do what I need.

I am intrigued by the Studio Classic (I have used a JCM800 in combo form in the past) but worried it will not be loud enough used clean.

The VM head is going nowhere for now. You guys are right - I'd just wish I had kept it.

 

[Goodcleanfun]

Mesa Mini Rectifier? Built better than any Marshall, loud enough for a full band, can be carried with one hand without any real struggle.

 

[Gridlock]

I’d recommend a Marshall JTM ST20 head or combo. I’ve owned two Marshall Vintage Modern amp, a 2266H and a 2266C and a JTM ST20C.

The Studio JTM sounds very similar to a VM in LDR mode. They take pedals well and has big and full sound with good bottom end. You might be able swap out the 5881’s with KT66’s (not sure) to get even closer sounding to the VM.

I also own a Marshall Astoria Classic that is hand-wired, 30 watts, and KT66 powered. It can definitely do VM LDR mode. I imagine that another Astoria would be hard to purchase since they have discontinued for some time.

 

[searswashere]

Get the dimensions of the VM and then get the dimensions of the smallest 50w heads you can find. 30W or less is probably not gonna do what you want, way less headroom.

Custom small (circuit allowing) dual KT88 something may do the trick.

 

[ReWind James]

How about a Fryette PS100 Power Station for a power amp. 100W of 6550s and super small. You could stuff 3 or 4 of them in a backpack. Plus, you get a bonus attenuator (it can attenuate itself!), two channels of settings for solo / boost or whatever, FX loop, etc.

Then, run the preamp(s) of your choice. Couple be pedal format, outboard gear, IR loader, DIY tube kit, modeler, whatever.