Top wrap no bridge?

[Static]

Me and a small crew rented a van and took a Saturday road trip to Dave's Guitar in LaCrosse Wisconsin - from St Paul.

Dave's is an extraordinary store. The main floor has a huge selection of top tier guitars from all the major manufacturers. But the main attraction is the second floor where Dave has his collection of classic and rare guitars. I can't even venture a guess to how many vintage axes this guy has, 3 or 400 at least. Several of his guitars are among the top 20 most valuable guitars in the world.

Obviously there are many Les Pauls. I was shocked to see several original Gold Tops that had no bridge. We wondered out loud how these guitars could possible ever be in tune???

Clearly some model years later the tune o matic bridges appeared. Has anyone here ever played one - or rather tried to tune one?

 

[chasenblues]

Obviously there are many Les Pauls. I was shocked to see several original Gold Tops that had no bridge. We wondered out loud how these guitars could possible ever be in tune???

Clearly some model years later the tune o matic bridges appeared. Has anyone here ever played one - or rather tried to tune one?

That's not the "original/first" bridge/tailpiece used on the first LP's.

Gibson Les Paul Goldtop guitar Gibson gold top LP info electric vintage 1952 1953 1954 1955

 

[X–Ray]

That's not the "original/first" bridge/tailpiece used on the first LP's.

Gibson Les Paul Goldtop guitar Gibson gold top LP info electric vintage 1952 1953 1954 1955

Picky picky picky....

 

[Static]

That's not the "original/first" bridge/tailpiece used on the first LP's.

Gibson Les Paul Goldtop guitar Gibson gold top LP info electric vintage 1952 1953 1954 1955

As you can see in the 2nd photo Dave has several LPs with the trapeze type tail piece too - but at least those had what appeared to be adjustable length.

 

[deadbeat]

...I was shocked to see several original Gold Tops that had no bridge. We wondered out loud how these guitars could possible ever be in tune???

Welcome to 1954; that is the bridge. Actually, it's called a wrap-around tailpiece. They guitar is designed with the bridge at an angle so as to compensate for the different string lengths needed for proper intonation. Although not 100% accurate, (no guitar ever is), the subsequent design change in 1956 to a two-piece bridge/tailpiece system allowed for better intonation.

Companies do make compensated wrap-around tailpieces as well, to improve intonation. For example, this is a pretty sweet piece from MojoAxe. See the ridge than runs along the top side of the bridge to allow for better intonation?

 

[ARandall]

Of course it has a bridge. Its just that it is combined with the string anchoring in one unit.
And the wrap has adjustable length too......the grubscrews on the back allow for forward back movement as well as angle adjustment.

Depending on your setup, it can be just as well intonated as a TOM. My 54RI is about as well adjusted as a few other LP's I have.

 

[Lloyd_m]

My Junior and Melody Maker have wraparound bridges. The intonation is good and they stay in tune without any problem.

 

[LJGriggs]

When I was in high school back in the early 1970's, I had a '55 Les Paul with the wrap-tail stopbar/bridge. The guitar had really great sounding P-90s and played very well, but intonation was an issue. Not so much an issue with getting the guitar in tune or keeping it in tune, but it required some tweaking every time you changed strings to get the intonation right at the nut and the 12th fret. (I sold that guitar in 1978 to a guy in Marietta, GA. I wonder what ever became of it...)

 

[geezberry]

i love my wraparound, it sustains beautifully, harmonics abundant.

 

[bossaddict]

Those first appeared in 1953 and were the only bridge available on Goldtops (Customs had a T-O-M) from mid '53 to mid '55. Wraptails are my favorite guitars!

They are not a precisely intonated, but I find the tone and feel to be better than a T-O-M. YMMV

Here's a side-by-side of my early '54 and my 2010 R5...

 

[bossaddict]

My wife got me a framed print of this as a gift a couple of years ago...

 

[Droog]

I've got a couple guitars ( both vintage and modern ) with wrap around tail pieces. They play and sound great.

 

[Cjsinla]

1956 was the year that gold tops got a 'regular' bridge.

 

[ddh101]

I love the simplicity and sound of my 2002 Junior with an angled wraparound tailpiece. It's simple goodness.

 

[sk8rat]

Those first appeared in 1953 and were the only bridge available on Goldtops (Customs had a T-O-M) from mid '53 to mid '55. Wraptails are my favorite guitars!

They are not a precisely intonated, but I find the tone and feel to be better than a T-O-M. YMMV

Here's a side-by-side of my early '54 and my 2010 R5...

holy sh*t! the one on the right

 

[Static]

I obviously am not up on the history of Les Pauls, but honestly am astonished that these are still in wide use and based on the comments here they are loved!

MyLesPaul forum is a learning experience. Thanks everyone.

I do recommend if ever in the upper Midwest pay a visit to Dave's Guitar. You won't be disappointed.

 

[bossaddict]

1956 was the year that gold tops got a 'regular' bridge.

Sometime in 1955, actually.

 

[ARandall]

I obviously am not up on the history of Les Pauls, but honestly am astonished that these are still in wide use and based on the comments here they are loved!

Well, the whole guitar industry is backwards pointing......reissues/historics becoming more like standard models and valve amps still working on 50's designs.

There is nothing inherently bad about a wrap. I mean its way better for intonation than a vintage Tele for example. From a physics point of view too, not dividing your anchoring points makes for a 'better' coupling to the body - as there is less lost in the interfaces.

 

[John Vasco]

I obviously am not up on the history of Les Pauls, but honestly am astonished that these are still in wide use and based on the comments here they are loved!

Why?

Last Sunday's gig:

A single P-90 in an LP Junior is superb on clean, and an absolute monster when overdriven!

 

[Wraptail]

Wraptails are okay I guess....