So, you just spent 2-3 grand...

Torren61

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Sentry you make some excellent points. Wouldn't it be amazing if Gibson sold just the body-neck and let us customise to preference? It's not gonna happen but I'm sure some forum members would like that.

OMG...WHAT A GREAT IDEA! Seriously. How cool would it be to just buy the neck/body with Gibson logo headstock and either order it with what you want or add what you want yourself? Man, great idea. You listening, Gibson? Gimme that axe for about $1000 in Standard model and $1500 for knock-you-on-your-ass finish and ebony finger board. Oh yeah...with nibs, too.

:fingersx:
 

The_Sentry

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Perhaps it's the regurgitating that makes your thread seem trollish. I get the impression you like to stir the pot, and play both sides of the fence. If these comments are really routinely made, is there really a good reason to continually rehash them with new threads at a Gibson Les Paul enthusiast forum. It just seems like Harmony Central would be a much more appropriate forum for that fodder.

You're damn right I like to stir the pot....

:wtf:

Should some more threads be created because we need to address chamberingand pickguards for the millionth time? :laugh2:

PS: I am of the impression that as far as discourse towards Les Pauls, it's not a question of liking them or hating them so much as just...discussing them, no matter what one's preference is.

I also believe that if a vendor is going to sell a guitar for that much, they outta take care of the little shit....that's fair.
 

TK LP

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You're damn right I like to stir the pot....

:wtf:

Should some more threads be created because we need to address chamberingand pickguards for the millionth time? :laugh2:

PS: I am of the impression that as far as discourse towards Les Pauls, it's not a question of liking them or hating them so much as just...discussing them, no matter what one's preference is.

I also believe that if a vendor is going to sell a guitar for that much, they outta take care of the little shit....that's fair.

Wow, almost a month to respond, you must be bored.
 

zplapplap

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Shame on you, Sentry. Every apologist is entitled to a prompt response. :laugh2:
 

JW123

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...On a killer guitar. A Les Paul.

Right?

:hmm:

OK, maybe it's just me, but if I was to take everyone's word on "what needs addressing" on these guitars, you'd think that the following components were substandard:

1. The guitar isn't setup, thus unplayable.
2. The wiring (pots and caps) are garbage.
3. The pickups are no good.
4. The nut is crap and needs to be replaced.
5. The Kluson tuners won't hold their tuning.
6. It's chambered in some cases, and it's not a "real" Lester.
7. The strap pins won't do the job...you're gonna need straplocks...

...and on and on it goes....

So....you're here, right? You've got this beautiful guitar in the corner of your eye after finding this site.

Question: How seriously do you take all of this talk? And, in your opinion...for that price shouldn't that guitar be smokin' hot and ready to go as is? Or, is it a case of no matter what the price of a guitar, and no matter who makes it, it's going to have a bunch of crappy components on it, and it's not going to be ready to play right off the showroom floor or right out of the box?

I play LP Classics, a friend of mine just bought a LP on my advice. He plays in a little group, he called me the other night and said come to our practice and play my new guitar I spent $2500 on it. I get there and its a beautiful guitar, some sort of historic model, I dont know all the names of them. But I go to play it and the strings are way too high and Im fighting this guitar to just play it. I told him to get it set up by someone that knows what they are doing. I know htis guitar will play well once its setup, but he is all stoked about this guitar and it plays like hell.

I ussually buy my guitars used and the first thing I do is put fresh strings on them and play them. Then ussually I will take them to some one who I trust to do a good setup. Ive tryed but either Im not patient or dont really know what Im doing, its just a lot easier to give it to someone and spend 50-100 dollars to have it set up.

A good setup on allmost any guitar can make a world of difference in the way they play. This isnt just limited to LPs but to any guitar.

I guess the question is shouldnt they be set up when I buy them new for 2-3000 dollars. Yea they should be, but Im sure most arent. They may not have the string gauge you are used to. You may do alternate tunings.

I got to sit in a Ferrari once and you know what the seat and steering wheel didnt feel good to me til I adjusted them, what makes you think a guitar is any different?
 

v8ko

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sorry, I skipped from the first page to the last.

to the OP

Where the hell are you buying your LPs from???? haha.

OK, some LPs have some issues but the couple tweaks it generally takes to straighten things out is no big deal.

I will agree that the 2-3+ thousand mark is pretty high for a guitar. Actually pretty darn foolish but if you love them damn things (like I do) its generally worth it.

Ill go back to the racecar analogy. The lower end (cheaper) racecars you can pretty much hop into one and race it around the track, woohoo your racing. The more expensive cars require more set-up and a lot more understanding about cars and racing to get the most out of them.

Does Gibson charge to much for there guitars? Not really considering that you gotta wait 2-4 weeks on some models I reckon sales are good. Should they lower there price? Well that would be the nice thing to do.

its late I doubt anything I just wrote made any sense lol.
 

v8ko

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double post <sue me lol>

BTW You know theres nothing at all wrong with the tuners right? Just do whats in my sig and you should never have a problem. :dude:
 

Satch0922

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here we go again....

1. Guitar purchasers should always have a setup done to make it fit an individual playing style.(check out this online article: myrareguitars.com >> guitar articles >> that is not my guitar until... It is setup to my specifications)

2. Wiring is adequate for its intended purpose. Many les paul owners are perfectly satisfied with their stock guitar.

3. Pickups are fine, but maybe not for every style or preference.

4. Nut is adequate for its intended purpose. It holds the strings in place.

5. Kluson tuners are fine, and do hold tuning.:rolleyes:

6. What does chambering have to do with whether or not a guitar is a 'real' 'lester'?:rolleyes:

7. They are the same strap 'pins' that they have come with for over 50 years. Schallers are always a good idea, anyway.

Why are so 'anti-gibson'? You never have anything nice to say about them?

amen!
 

Satch0922

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double post <sue me lol>

BTW You know theres nothing at all wrong with the tuners right? Just do whats in my sig and you should never have a problem. :dude:

Exactly. I too "used" to think I had Klusons that would not "hold their tune" and then I got educated. Because of the design itself, the tuners wont move even if you tie a rope to your monster truck and try to pull them (unless of course you completely break them).

Proper filing of the nut is where it's at. End of story.
 

MesaBoogie

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Great post as usual Sentry. I agree on some points most guys make on here, less on others.
[To the guy who said that Sentry likes to "stir the pot": that's what forums arefor. It's not like he's stirring to stir. But I get where you are coming from...]
Now let me address them one by one:

  1. The guitar isn't setup, thus unplayable. This is a common problem, as stated earlier. Most shops in my country do offer a free setup (minus the strings) if you buy the guitar and some even try to keep 'em in tune (a big kudos to those). The way I see it is that the main manufacturers have a "standard" for factory set up which doesn't meet player set up standards.
  2. The wiring (pots and caps) are garbage. Don't really agree.
  3. The pickups are no good. Yeah, contact me if they make one size fits all pants.
  4. The nut is crap and needs to be replaced. My only gripe about Gibson. Hell, the nut on my MIA Strat and Taylor is great and they cost a lot less than my LP so what's up with that Gibson???
  5. The Kluson tuners won't hold their tuning. As stated earlier: matter of preference. I like them and tuning issues mostly arise from other parts (nut, bridge, old strings, temperature changes etc...)
  6. It's chambered in some cases, and it's not a "real" Lester. I get where this comes from, although I don't agree.
  7. The strap pins won't do the job...you're gonna need straplocks... They ARE awfully small IMO.

Grtz,

Mesa.
 

theodessakid

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Glad I found this string....After reading all the bitching about the crappy electronics in the Les Pauls I thought I must be the dumbest guy around. I have to get a vintage wire kit to make the guitar sound good even though I think it sounds great as is. I bought a used 05 R8 and I think it sounds awsome. Previous owner swapped the BB pickups for 57 Classics and that is fine with me. Everything else is stock. So...I am happy to know I'm not the only person who likes the guitar as is.:dude:
 

theodessakid

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Glad I found this string....After reading all the bitching about the crappy electronics in the Les Pauls I thought I must be the dumbest guy around. I have to get a vintage wire kit to make the guitar sound good even though I think it sounds great as is. I bought a used 05 R8 and I think it sounds awsome. Previous owner swapped the BB pickups for 57 Classics and that is fine with me. Everything else is stock. So...I am happy to know I'm not the only person who likes the guitar as is.:dude:
 

leftylover

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If gibson would stop putting cheap electronics and other things in them to try and cut cost corners, we wouldnt have this problem
 

The_Sentry

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Great post as usual Sentry. I agree on some points most guys make on here, less on others.
.

Well, I have to admit that a bit of that was tongue-in-cheek. I'll be honest...I really don't take everything I read here to heart. How could I?

Now as far as some of the stuff...I'll admit it...I wish it was more laid out for easier customer use (like the PCB board in the '08 Standards)....but to a large degree...nah, on most of the stuff there's nothing wrong with the Gibby at all. As far as their electronics go....sheesh....I actually rewired my Epi Sheraton with Gibby Pots and couldn't be happier. I have Gibby pots in my Norlin and I think it sounds great.

It's kinda the same thing with the maintenance....if someone did EVERYTHING they read about here as far as maintaining their guitar, they'd be so busy servicing it they'd probably never have time to play the guitar!! :laugh2:

And as far as those major chains? Yes, I do think they should include a setup. Seriously. I get the point of having the adjust the seat in a Ferrari, but it shouldn't cost someone 100 dollars or more to get it right. Especially on a guitar that does cost this much.

Anyways...peace out. It's time for me to take my spoon and stir somethin' else up here. :naughty:
 

RedBetts

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Interesting....none of that applies to my LP's. They are each superior guitars in every way.
 

dspelman

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1. The guitar isn't setup, thus unplayable.
2. The wiring (pots and caps) are garbage.
3. The pickups are no good.
4. The nut is crap and needs to be replaced.
5. The Kluson tuners won't hold their tuning.
6. It's chambered in some cases, and it's not a "real" Lester.
7. The strap pins won't do the job...you're gonna need straplocks...

...and on and on it goes....

1. You don't gain anything by getting a PLEK'd Gibson; I think I'd much rather have a coupon for a PLEK setup to my own specs, because I'm going to have to do one with the new guitar anyway... All factory PLEKing does for you is insure that the frets were level *when they left the factory*. Since Gibson does a sort of medium action setup on all their guitars (Carvin, for example, guarantees their action (and it's low), where Gibson does not), and since Gibsons can sit around for quite a while before they actually get sold, virtually all of them need a setup when you buy it. If you like the frets glued (makes better contact, insures that they won't be lifting with humidity changes) and the action low, you're going to pay an additional ~$200 for a setup with PLEK.

2. I dunno about the pots and wiring. They're not bad. They're not the best you can get. I think that for $2000-3000, they *should* be the best you can get, but Gibson saves a few cents here. Why, I have no clue.

3. Pickups aren't better or worse; they're a matter of taste. I'm shaking the burstbuckers out of a new Axcess and replacing them with something else, but I wouldn't consider that an upgrade, necessarily -- it's just that I like what I'm putting in better.

4. A plastic nut on a $2000-3000 (and up) guitar is, frankly, cheaping out. I doubt if anyone would object like this if it were a bone nut. The difference in cost puts some bucks in some execs' pockets, but does little to advance the image of Gibson as a premium product. Hard to find anyone who replaces a bone nut with a plastic one like those that Gibson uses.

5. Again -- no idea why they'd use these things. Carvin's stock tuners are Sperzel locking tuners. Some other Gibsons come with good, solid tuners. The only reason I can think of for using the cheap Kluson is that this is what was used 50+ years ago. Again, these get shucked and replaced, but shouldn't need to be on a $2000-3000 guitar.

6. Chambered, swiss cheesed, whatever. I happen to prefer solid bodies, but the Axcess has a tummy cut, a cut down neck heel, a thinner body, a chambered interior and a bigass hole for the Floyd springs. Why anyone would even mention the words "tone wood" around these guitars is a mystery to me <G>. These guitars are not real Les Pauls; they only retain the general shape. No big deal to me if I like how they sound after they're set up...

7. Again, I have no idea why Gibson doesn't put straplocks on the guitars from the get-go. The guitar portion can certainly be used with standard guitar straps if you've a mind to. Again, Gibson would probably be seen to be more of an upscale maker if they took the initiative here, and I can't imagine anyone objecting to them in any way. It's always easier to pull the straplocks and put in the old style if you've got a mind to, since the screws on the old style are larger diameter. Not quite as easy to go to a straplock from a standard strap button screw...

Gibson is laying off a chunk of their workers, has a reputation for being one of the worst companies to work for (5th, according to a recent survey, I think) and currently has a Custom Shop that you can hear bats fly through.

They way I see it, if I want Gibson on a headstock, and I have any experience with them at all, I fully realize that I'm going to be spending another grand or so to make it a guitar that I like. There are, of course, truck drivers who take theirs stock and love them. Thing is, it's less often that I give a damn what's on the headstock and care more about the quality of the guitar (regardless of the price). No one I know listens to the headstock.
 

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