sh55 seth lovers vs antiquities?

[Axeman16]

in the market for a pickup upgrade. not going to spend the ridiculous cost of boutique winders, not worth it in my opinion for the cost difference.

looking to regain some of that classic late 60's british blues tone, think kossoff, clapton, mccarty, bloomfield among others!

see no reason why i wouldnt go with duncan. the guy was personal friends with seth lover himself.

so my question is aside form the obvious spec differences of the aging and .3kohm between sets. what are the differences?

mainly asking the differences tonally between the seths and the antiquities.

i have a some pre 06 57 classics in it right now and have never disliked them.

if you own both could you explain the differences to me?

just picked up a single channel boutique marshall 1974x clone. the 57s sounds great through it but obviously looking to go the extra mile.

what do you love/ hate about the seths /antiquities?

realize the 57s arent in the same ballpark but please give me your thoughts if you have first hand experience between the with either of those duncans.

in comparison to the 57s would also be nice!

thanks!

 

[ARandall]

I don't know how much Duncans go for in your neck of the woods, but both Vineham and Zhangbucker go for less if I just compare ebay prices for duncans vs direct prices for both of those.

I've had Antiquities. They were about only long enough for my first set of Zhangbuckers to arrive. They got sold off, mainly as they just seemed duller than the Pagey 2 set I got from Zhang.
A lot of people from the Duncan forum seem to think they are lower output compared with the Seths, and softer. Both probably due to the degaussed A2's in them.

All Duncans are symmetrically wound coils. Unlike the PAF which got random coils wound by a couple of different machines each with multiple spooling arms (to wind many coils at once). The upshot is that the Ants and Seths are designed to the Seth Lover design spec......any PAF clone will differ due to the actuality of how the winding machine actually worked in reality. So Seths and Ants will have a much more round honky tone.......slightly less open and airy than any PAF clone.

However this might work for you.....if the 57's are in the right ballpark, then Seths might be the way forward. They would be most like the early 90's 57's perhaps......before they got molested by the $$$ crunching at Gibson.

 

[AJK1]

I had a set of Antiquity HB and i liked them a lot, very musical and sweet sounding, but remember, they are based on 57 era pickups so they are more like a telecaster sounding pickup with no hum. If you want a 59 sounding pickup the antiquities won't do it for you, and that's why i sold them, just too thin, bright and no guts.
If you like clapton, kossoff, page etc you need something beefier
SD Pearly gates come to mind
Or Dimarzio Paf Master A4 mags (i own a pair and they nail 60's Paf sounds)
I had a set of Gibbo 57's and they were horrible in comparison
Good luck with your search

 

[rclausen]

I found the Antiquities to be very bright, but in the right guitar they can sound great. I was also under the impression that they are just an aged Seth Lover. If you have a good wiring harness in your guitar, I'm not sure you're going to get much of a difference between the pre-06 57's and the Antiquities imo.

 

[Zoobiedood]

Well, Seths sound like you traveled in a time machine and bought a pickup 60 years ago and brought it back. The Antiquites sound and look like 60 year old pickups.
Basically, the Antiquities are slightly degaussed, which alters the already-complex mids. Some say they are brighter, and essentially, they are, but with maybe some strange, but good sounding midrange filtering going on. I like both, but if you have an already mid-focused guitar, go for the Ants (also if the aging process is your thing). If you have a more balanced sounding guitar, go for the Seths.

 

[Stuff]

I've had a set of Seths. Bought them to replace a set of 57s Classics. The Seths are articulate - especially the neck pickup. Downside for me was that the bridge pickup had no balls whatsoever. Might want to consider something like a Pearly Gates bridge to pair with a Seth neck.

 

[AJK1]

I've had a set of Seths. Bought them to replace a set of 57s Classics. The Seths are articulate - especially the neck pickup. Downside for me was that the bridge pickup had no balls whatsoever. Might want to consider something like a Pearly Gates bridge to pair with a Seth neck.

Yes, that would be a good matchup

 

[RangerJay]

I just got a new guitar with Antiquities, and while they are really good sounding pickups, they just don't give great crunch. You can get crunch out of them, but it ain't the creamy, juicy crunch like you'd get out of a Pearly Gates set.

I also would not rule out a Whole Lotta Humbucker in the bridge spot. While a WLH is kinda hot, it is more in the line of a Pearly Gates than some sort of distortion PU (I'm looking at you, JBs). Very articulate, sound "vintage-like," but give excellent crunch. It actually balances well with any number of neck pickups, as long as they are 7K or above.

If you have tried pickups that drive you right up to the edge, the WLH will help you to drive off the cliff, in a good way. If you are going with SD pickups, keep in mind that they have a 21 day return policy. If you don't like what you purchased, you can exchange them for something that works for you.

I like the sound of the Antiquities, and I will probably keep them in that particular guitar, just for variety. But for a "bridge with balls," either a Pearly Gates or a WLH will probably do the trick. In fact, they might amaze you. There are lots of choices out there, and SD makes some pretty good stuff.

EDIT: I just plugged in the guitar with the Antiquities, and they will indeed give up the goods. It is more of an "articulate" crunch than a WLH or '57 Classic Plus. It definitely leans to a more stereotypical "PAF" crunch. Not that there's anything wrong with that. But if you are looking for real balls, I don't think they quite give great crunch.

 

[AmpliFIRE]

Has anyone ever tried an Antiquity bridge pickup in the neck with a Seth Lover in the bridge? Seems like an interesting combo...

 

[RangerJay]

Has anyone ever tried an Antiquity bridge pickup in the neck with a Seth Lover in the bridge? Seems like an interesting combo...

Doubtful. For one thing, an Antiquity bridge is hotter than a Seth Lover bridge or neck. It's weird, but true (lots of people assume that they are the same pickup, only with some aging on the Ants; not true). It is not typical to have a hotter pickup in the neck position, unless by accident. Nothing "wrong" with it, if it sounds good. The main reason that people tend not to put a hotter PU in the neck than the bridge is that the middle switch position is more difficult to manage. The strings are "louder" to a pickup in the neck than the bridge. Combine that with a hotter neck PU, and it will overwhelm the bridge PU in the middle position.

Of course, none of this is set in stone. It's just "customary" to not do that. Not right or wrong. That said, this "tradition" did not happen by accident. Real guitar players found that having a matched set is easier to manage.

You can do what you want to your guitar. You can put any pickup in any position, if that sounds good to you. If you only ever use one pickup at a time, it is easier to manage. The problems arise when you want to use all three pickup positions with the switch. You can get some profound volume changes with a mismatched setup. In a live situation, that mismatch can be difficult to manage. In a recording or jamming situation, not so much.

 

[AmpliFIRE]

Thanks for the reply. I only thought of that because I heard that the Antiquity bridge was weaker/thinner sounding than the Seth bridge.

 

[LtKojak]

Has anyone ever tried an Antiquity bridge pickup in the neck with a Seth Lover in the bridge? Seems like an interesting combo...

Not really. Even with a degaussed magnet, the bridge Ant will sound a lot louder than the Seth bridge, making difficult, if not impossible, to setup for balance.

Both Ant and Seth sets take mag swaps very gracefully, so, using the same full-charged mags in both sets, the Ant set will sound fuller and louder than the Seth set, which has a lighter wind, producing a slightly smaller output.

For Kosoff and Bloomfield, A4/A4 Seth set. For Clapton, A3n/A2b Ant set.

Strange, these two tones are polar opposites? Solution: A4/A4 Ant set, and make ample use of the tone knobs.

HTH,

 

[AJK1]

Not really. Even with a degaussed magnet, the bridge Ant will sound a lot louder than the Seth bridge, making difficult, if not impossible, to setup for balance.
Oh really, i hope you are talking from real world experience with these pickups because from my experience you are totally wrong here.

 

[LtKojak]

the bridge Ant will sound a lot louder than the Seth bridge, making difficult, if not impossible, to setup for balance.

Oh really, i hope you are talking from real world experience with these pickups because from my experience you are totally wrong here.

Only fifteen years of experience in repairing and modding guitars and p'ups, mate.

It's alright if you disagree; I stand by my statement.

 

[Axeman16]

kojak if i have any more specific questions ill pm you directly. you know your sh*t when it comes to pickups.

 

[NotScott]

kojak if i have any more specific questions ill pm you directly. you know your sh*t when it comes to pickups.

Yes he does!

 

[AJK1]

Only fifteen years of experience in repairing and modding guitars and p'ups, mate.

It's alright if you disagree; I stand by my statement.

And i stand by mine...

 

[freefrog]

Has anyone ever tried an Antiquity bridge pickup in the neck with a Seth Lover in the bridge? Seems like an interesting combo...

My two cents (and it's also an answer to the OP): although there's not much difference in DCR between Seth's and Ant's, the Ant bridge exhibits more inductance (something like 5.1 to 5.4H while I've measured only 4.3H or 4.4H on bridge Seth's).

All other parms being equal, more inductance tends to bring more mids and more perceived output...

So, an Ant bridge in neck position would probably do what LtKojak said because 5.1H must overpower 4.4H as long as the overall architecture of the pickups is the same.

Side note about degaussed mags: IME, degaussing affects the EQ, sometimes drastically... but it doesn't necessarily change the output level. For example, the last UOA5 mags that I've measured with a lab teslameter were the most gaussed of a sample of Alnico bars... but they didn't make a same P.A.F. clone louder than with a much weaker A3 mag.

All that being said, anyway, the same pickup won't sound the same in two different guitars so, all we can give is general indications - or testimonials based on our necessarily unique personal experiences...

 

[LtKojak]

And i stand by mine...

Of course you are!

 

[Axeman16]

Well, Seths sound like you traveled in a time machine and bought a pickup 60 years ago and brought it back. The Antiquites sound and look like 60 year old pickups.
Basically, the Antiquities are slightly degaussed, which alters the already-complex mids. Some say they are brighter, and essentially, they are, but with maybe some strange, but good sounding midrange filtering going on. I like both, but if you have an already mid-focused guitar, go for the Ants (also if the aging process is your thing). If you have a more balanced sounding guitar, go for the Seths.

the thing is the whole 60 year old pickup doesnt mean anything to me.

all of the tones i love and am shooting to get closer to were recorded when these pickups were 5-20 years old.