SG value question

[skydog]

I've always loved the feel of a nice SG. The necks, the light weight, the responsiveness, all add up to make fine instruments. The necks, with all that fret access, always felt like a bass neck to me! Luckily, I'm fortunate enough to own a really nice Epiphone SG LQ from their Lacquer series, made for the Japanese domestic market (JDM). I find myself playing it more than my R7, which is also a fine instrument. Because of this, I've been thinking of selling and/or trading these instruments for a premium SG. My main concern is that it seems like SG's just don't hold their value as well as a Les Paul does. What's the opinion with folks here with respect to value? And, do you think I'm nuts for not just sticking with what I have?

 

[Crotch]

I'm not a huge SG guy but I have had 2 and I liked them both and kept one. They were both signatures. (Derek Trucks & Robby Krieger) I heard the Wildwood SG's are something special. BigDipper here has one for sale currently ZI think still. I've never played one but hear only good things. I really like R7's. your call at the end of the day.

 

[Kris Ford]

I don't think Historic SGs are worth the premium price..
IMO, you get more value in a USA model..
Or if you don't have some absurd "Norlin" bias, '73-'79 SGs are KILLER.

 

[skydog]

I don't think Historic SGs are worth the premium price..
IMO, you get more value in a USA model..
Or if you don't have some absurd "Norlin" bias, '73-'79 SGs are KILLER.

I agree; short of easily replaced electronics, what warrants the large price variance?

 

[rclausen]

I agree; short of easily replaced electronics, what warrants the large price variance?

The same thing that makes your R7 more expensive than a USA production goldtop. Better woods, better construction, etc. That said, if you already have an SG that you really like, why do you want something else? I would recommend trying out the higher-end SG's before coming to a decision

 

[indravayu]

I don't think Historic SGs are worth the premium price..
IMO, you get more value in a USA model..
Or if you don't have some absurd "Norlin" bias, '73-'79 SGs are KILLER.

I totally disagree - Custom Shop SGs are far superior to USA models.

 

[skydog]

The same thing that makes your R7 more expensive than a USA production goldtop. Better woods, better construction, etc. That said, if you already have an SG that you really like, why do you want something else? I would recommend trying out the higher-end SG's before coming to a decision

Yes & no. There's more involved (materials and labor) in the construction of a LP vs. a SG. That's one of their most endearing qualities IMO.

 

[BigDipper15]

I sold my WW Spec SG last week. It was truly a great guitar but I just couldn't live having so much invested in an SG that barely got any play time. I gig with a LP and a strat and occasionally a tele. All my LPs, strats and teles hit the rotation but the SG just never seemed to. So I sold it and picked up an INSANE 2016 PRS Custom 24. If the tax refund is good this year I'm going to look for a used 2013 SG standard which is basically a 61 reissue.

 

[TheX]

Yes & no. There's more involved (materials and labor) in the construction of a LP vs. a SG. That's one of their most endearing qualities IMO.

He compared your R7 to a production goldtop. Their both LP's.

Buying a historic SG makes just as much sense as buying a historic lp.

 

[BigDipper15]

Historic SG's are really great guitars. Just ask yourself as I did if you will play it more than your LP's. If not a good SG Standard or 61 reissue will do the trick just fine.

 

[toymaker]

To the OP - to an extent yes, building a SG can be simpler than building a LP...but that doesn't mean that the price they charge or the perceived better resale is reflective of the labor involved - by that logic, 335's should be priced at double a comparable LP and acoustics would much higher too..both more labor intensive and skill demanding to build.

Resale has to do with supply/demand - a LP is always easier to resell than an acoustic, because more people want to buy LPs. An SG from the CS is a great thing - but as with anything, there is the law of diminishing returns as you move up the food chain..you gain less and less once you breach certain price points.

Would I trade a R7 and a SG I loved for a "better" (relative term here) SG - nope. I'd stick to what I have and search out a good deal on a used CS SG - they are out there. Not sure if Chuck Levin's still has it - but I know Stephen posted a nice '06 CS SG - new and unsold, on here for 2k recently. I would hit him up and see what he can do for you there - good shop to deal with in the DC area.

 

[Kris Ford]

I totally disagree - Custom Shop SGs are far superior to USA models.

Not value wise, and sorry if you believe this..
USA is better bang for the buck hands down from a TONE perspective, but if all you do is look at it then yes.
Could you tell one apart from the other on a recording?

 

[Kris Ford]

Look at resale value of a CS SG...it ain't pretty. Just taking one home easily knocks a grand RIGHT off..
Anything that takes a $1200-$1900 hit for resale is NOT a value IMHO.

 

[PermissionToLand]

Not value wise, and sorry if you believe this..
USA is better bang for the buck hands down from a TONE perspective, but if all you do is look at it then yes.
Could you tell one apart from the other on a recording?

Strictly speaking of value, an Epiphone blows any Gibson out of the water. Value always has diminishing returns.

Look at resale value of a CS SG...it ain't pretty. Just taking one home easily knocks a grand RIGHT off..
Anything that takes a $1200-$1900 hit for resale is NOT a value IMHO.

Do tell where is the magical land where used CS SGs go for $1100...

Don't mind Kris, he has a thing against CS SGs because he apparently got a dud.

 

[RandyRhoadsLesPaul]

I sold my WW Spec SG last week. It was truly a great guitar but I just couldn't live having so much invested in an SG that barely got any play time. I gig with a LP and a strat and occasionally a tele. All my LPs, strats and teles hit the rotation but the SG just never seemed to. So I sold it and picked up an INSANE 2016 PRS Custom 24. If the tax refund is good this year I'm going to look for a used 2013 SG standard which is basically a 61 reissue.

I have a 2014 '61 Reissue SG. They are fantastic and they feel great! Good luck and happy NGD!

 

[TheX]

Not value wise, and sorry if you believe this..

An IMHO would make this more valid. Value to YOU means nothing to anyone else.

 

[Kris Ford]

An IMHO would make this more valid. Value to YOU means nothing to anyone else.

Uh, I did.

I don't think Historic SGs are worth the premium price..
IMO, you get more value in a USA model..
Or if you don't have some absurd "Norlin" bias, '73-'79 SGs are KILLER.

I'm not the only one in this thread that thinks this..
Further clarified with the rest of my statement..FROM A TONE PERSPECTIVE...
Why just quote part of what I said?
Can you tell a USA apart from a CS on a recording?
Can anyone?? My point is you DO NOT have to pay CS $$ to get SG tone.
Please say the same thing to the guy who declared "Custom Shop SGs are far superior to USA models.", thus trying to make his opinion the RIGHT one.
Please call him out too.
Otherwise it really looks like you're singling me out..not cool.

 

[Playyouraxeon11]

Hi, Skydog! BigDipper15 has it right - the 2013 reissue of (basically) a '61. Name is -

Gibson 60's Tribute SG Standard, Burstbuckers 1&2. Truss rod cover bears "60's Tribute".

Hard to find limited run, buy on sight. Very cheap new price, scummy grunge finish, no scratch plates, lozenge markers but no binding on the fret board and 24 fret arrangement that makes it feel that you are driving a tower crane when you strap it on, that's ridiculous, Grovers, silk screen head details. Some, not all, have automatic tuning on the back of the head. Cherry, white, black, chocolate. The "see-through" finishes aren't necessarily handsome, wood grain can look like dog poop on some. Never a posh guitar, no need to trade in if you can find one but it's all high quality where it counts. Should be a few hundred bucks, not more.

Not subtle - forget about jazz or cocktail stuff. It's an SG, no? Check "Fresh Cream", the 1966 album featuring Eric Clapton, that's what it does (although that may not have been any SG, I don't know). And Led Zeppelin 3 - Immigrant song, Since I've been loving you, and all that stuff. Fabulous neck, screamingly, screamingly good guitar. Good luck with that.

I have one and it's not for sale, ever. Cheap Gibson bought online new, arrived perfectly set up, needs no mods, only change the strings. My other 'lectric is a Custom Shop ES335.

Failing this '60's job, Custom shop stuff is better than off the peg, no doubt, and the 73-79 that is mentioned is really good if you can live with the two-part scratch plates on those guitars (unpopular at the time). They have "Dirty fingers" pups, not the same as 60's, better behaved at higher volumes (but we don't get near that any more). They can be found second hand reasonably easily so haggle the price.

Resale stuff is your baby. I don't buy to resell, I buy for what I want to do and that's all about either making music or a heck of a racket. So I don't know the value of my guitars in money really but I know how good it is to wring their necks when I get the mood. I've also occasionally made a little money doing it and that counts too.

I like the SG a lot. If I didn't have one that really hits the spot, I'd take my time and look at all that's out their. Used CS looks like a good place, CS is definitely better made. The only thing I'd rule out is a 2015 job.

Look for a 60's Tribute re-issue is my advice, 70's are killer too. Vintage stuff isn't for playing - hard to find, expensive and usually knackered.

All the best. The SG is a seriously under-estimated animal, isn't it?

Sky Ford, hi! No, I can't tell this-from-that on a recording. I'm not sure anyone can, there are so many interventions and variables. I don't know what Eric played on "Fresh Cream". I can tell the difference between my ES335 and my SG through an amp in a room or hall, or any other stuff like the Kramer or Strat that the other guitarist in our band uses, same as I can choose an AC30, a Marshall, an Ampeg or a Yamaha THR. For that matter, I can tell between an off-the-peg current 335 and my vos re-issue job, no question about this. Chalk and cheese, that's why I bought it - in the early 70's I'd borrowed a 335 for some months and played it mostly through an AC30. That's what I was looking for and the new stuff wasn't delivering it. BB's don't sound the same as PAF's, do they? At least, not when you stand in front of your amp and listen and the band noticed it too, no trouble. Who goes by recordings when choosing these things? That can only ever give you a rough idea, do you think? For me, it's about what happens when I stand in front of my amp to adjust things and then it's the audience, what happens when I move a control. How do you assess this from a recording and there are so many guitar players that hardly touch their controls anyway? It could be that some underestimate the importance of good controls on a guitar but there's no way you'll ever check that through a recording. That's often where money is saved, isn't that right?

So that's why - recordings don't come into this. At home, in rehearsals, gigs where I know we have a stage, I use the 335 and it satisfies in every way but IT'S A BLOODY BIG AND EXPENSIVE GUITAR and one would be crazy to use it in a pub where one sets up in the corner, amps on the floor and no room to move on a Saturday night. That can go wrong, it's obvious and I don't think 335's suit "relic" treatment. That's why I bought the SG (apart from always liking them and having owned two of them before). The punters probably don't know the difference but I do and so does the band (even the drummer). I looked a long time for my 335 and I didn't buy it from listening to recordings, no sir! It's for me to enjoy. If you hear it through some manky three-inch speakers after some Charlied-out producer has bunged everything through Pro-Tools, what's it got to do with me if you don't know that it's not a Les Paul or a Burstbucker-loaded present day 335? Is this right?

Yes, there's life on Mars? Stop (&^$^&*& swearing!