New Les Paul. Possible fake pickups? Tampered? Debating returning.

diogoguitar

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Thanks, how much of a discount can I reasonably expect?
I used their Presidents day 15% off coupon, the day I bought it. So it was discounted to $2125 when I bought it. Can I ask them to discount it further?

I could have easily ordered a brand new mint model online with the same discount that weekend. So I feel like they should offer something extra on top for this one. I’d love to keep it even if they give a small discount or something.
Holy smokes, that's a sick deal!
Nah, I wouldn't bother them. They declared bankruptcy last year... I'm not saying you should have mercy on big corporations, but you wouldn't be helping them keeping this awesome selection, pricing and return policy.
 

PageSide84

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Every returned guitar should be listed as such and resold with a small discount. Then the buyer is getting what they paid for and what they are expecting. To sell me a guitar listed as “brand new” that could have been sitting in somebody’s house for a month or more getting played every day is a fraudulent business practice. That’s not a new guitar. Not saying I still wouldn’t buy it, but not for the same price as one that is actually new.

If I buy a new 60s Standard, play it for a two hours a day for 30 days, could I come to the classifieds here and with any integrity at all list it as brand new and expect to get a brand new price? Nah. It’s a lightly used guitar, most likely in excellent plus condition, and I‘m gonna lose 300-400 bucks. I don’t think we the consumer should end up paying for the vendor’s return policy. It’s a cost of doing business for them, not me.
You realize that this happens everywhere, not just guitar shops, right? You won't win this suit, because you'll need to show that the guitar is in different condition than it would be sitting on the sales floor, being groped by 12 year olds playing Smoke on the Water and Enter Sandman.
 

PauloQS

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Thanks, how much of a discount can I reasonably expect?
I used their Presidents day 15% off coupon, the day I bought it. So it was discounted to $2125 when I bought it. Can I ask them to discount it further?

I could have easily ordered a brand new mint model online with the same discount that weekend. So I feel like they should offer something extra on top for this one. I’d love to keep it even if they give a small discount or something.
You’re already very close to the limit they can give you. I don’t think they can give you more. Just enjoy your guitar.

The tech there sounds a bit inexperienced, as others have mentioned. Once you’ve done it a couple of times, you get a hang of dealing with those pesky springs and shouldn’t look hard at all. Either that or could also be some stage fright going on. You do something ten thousand times very smoothly and ninja like, on the 10,001st time you’re all thumbs just because someone is looking, kind of thing.
 

InTheEvening

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The cavity looks good...i was worried for you that the guy had swapped the pups out and then swapped them back in, then it surely wouldn't be new if the factory wiring was altered. i wouldn't worry about it, you got a good deal and you definitely like the guitar so rock on. Life is too short to stress over a backwards pup.
Thanks for taking a look, I feel much better having double checked with you guys. I really don’t mind a pickup being flipped, but a pickup change or messing with the wiring or some other tampering was a big concern. So I feel much better knowing all of that is intact and the way it was when it left the factory.

The manager at the store was actually really good about helping me out and took the time to take the pickup out, make sure it was original and place it back in the correct position for me so now the guitar pretty much looks like new top.
I’ll still ask them what my options are, if they’ll give a small discount on this or some store credit or allow a full exchange just to know my options. But unless I find a guitar that looks and plays as good as this, I’ll prob keep this one. End of the day, I just want the best playing, looking and sounding guitar, whatever history it may have.

To me looks like absolutely the original solder joints. Very clean, actually. Good to see it from Gibson.
Thank you, really glad and relieved to hear that.

Holy smokes, that's a sick deal!
Nah, I wouldn't bother them. They declared bankruptcy last year... I'm not saying you should have mercy on big corporations, but you wouldn't be helping them keeping this awesome selection, pricing and return policy.
Yeah, i was shocked they let me use the coupon on something this pricey but they didn’t even question me when I showed it to them. ISo, i really don’t expect them to offer me much more of a discount if any.
But they might let me keep this discounted price and do a direct exchange for another standard 60’s that’s in mint condition. Not sure if an exchange is really worth it though, since this thread confirmed the pickups and wiring are all original and not tampered with, which is what I really cared about. I might play a few others Standard 60’s, but if my current one ends up being the best playing one of the bunch I won’t give it up,
 

InTheEvening

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You’re already very close to the limit they can give you. I don’t think they can give you more. Just enjoy your guitar.

The tech there sounds a bit inexperienced, as others have mentioned. Once you’ve done it a couple of times, you get a hang of dealing with those pesky springs and shouldn’t look hard at all. Either that or could also be some stage fright going on. You do something ten thousand times very smoothly and ninja like, on the 10,001st time you’re all thumbs just because someone is looking, kind of thing.
Yeah, at this point I got close to their used Les Paul price. So I prob won’t get much more off, which I’m okay with.
I’m just happy to know the pickups and wiring are all original and mot tampered. That’s really what I was concerned about, if someone had swapped pickups or tampered with the wiring id want a refund. But I feel better having gone over photos with everyone here.

They might offer a direct exchange for another standard 60’s. If they do, I’ll try a few out to see if I like any of them as much as I like this one. But if this is still the best playing guitar, I’ll keep this and not look back.
 

jskidder

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Given the price you got, I'd say you're good given that everything seems to be sorted with the guitar. A 15% discount is about the best you could do on a new LP in any market, and in this one where supply is constrained it's outstanding. At the current moment, the $2250-2300 range is as good as it gets based on my recent experience, and even that is getting harder to come by. Sounds like you got a good one and you like the guitar so I'd probably just move on and start enjoying it. Playing some other examples and considering an exchange is just going to have you overthinking it.
 

PauloQS

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Yeah, at this point I got close to their used Les Paul price. So I prob won’t get much more off, which I’m okay with.
I’m just happy to know the pickups and wiring are all original and mot tampered. That’s really what I was concerned about, if someone had swapped pickups or tampered with the wiring id want a refund. But I feel better having gone over photos with everyone here.

They might offer a direct exchange for another standard 60’s. If they do, I’ll try a few out to see if I like any of them as much as I like this one. But if this is still the best playing guitar, I’ll keep this and not look back.
Just be careful to not over analyzing or have an inherent bias against the one you currently have because of its history. I almost made that mistake myself, but luckily I chose wisely.

I bought a 2017 LP Standard T in one of those guitar-a-thon, back when discounts were ridiculously good. The guitar had a small blemish in its biding. Guitar-a-thon over and a bunch of other LP standards show up. I tried every single one of them, between 2016 and 2017 standards, there were like 7 options to choose from. I’m offered the guitar-a-thon price on any Standard T. The thing is that none played a smooth as mine, I thought that mine sounded the best and had better sustain than all of them. I came close to getting one without the cosmetic imperfection, but chose otherwise.

Here‘s the blemish in question

 

FingerLakesFan

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You got 15% off that? Yeah, that is a win. Keep her, play her, enjoy her and never look back. You do realize that many places are now sold out of that model and won't be getting any in soon.
 

1matchleft

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Trying to figure this out is costing you time. How did the seller not see this? Is it their first time selling a guitar?

In general this seems to happen to me all the time. I spend my money and something is invariable off or odd.

Can you have the shop call the former owner and ask? For leverage you can tell them you’ll be posting their name on this forum, good or bad.
 

stevie777

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Have a look at the Pots to see if the soldering looks amateurish.

There would be no reason to tamper with the wiring unless the previous owner decided to wire it differently. If it looks like the original factory soldering then all is good..No?
 

lespaul1648

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Email Gibson's customer service. Every time I did they got back to in a few days and the response was helpful. Include the numbers on the stickers that are on the bottom of the pickups...they may be able to tell if they were the ones put in your guitar.
 

skydog

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What makes everyone so sure it did not leave Gibson like that? I mean, this is Gibson we are talking about. The Rhythm/Treble switch on my 2010 Les Paul purchased new from a GC store was reversed (so 'up' was bridge pup, and 'down' was neck pup). Even though it was purchased from a GC store, the thought that it was anything but Gibson never even crossed my mind. I know that is different than what is being discussed here, but there are parallels ...
You should read the OP before responding…
 

PeteNJ75

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I’m sure they’re totally fine, I’m not reading the whole thread to see if you’ve done this already, but just check the solder joints to make sure they haven’t been removed and replaced. As long as the solder joints are intact and unmolested just flip the pickup around and play the f—ker. I would also try to use it to get a small extra discount from GC. You shouldn’t have to deal with that on a brand new guitar and they should have definitely fixed that before you bought it. If the pickup has been actually resoldered, that’s a different story. In that case, you’re totally justified in returning it or paying used prices, not new.

I don’t blame you at all for missing it especially if it’s your first Gibson, and this is a forum so of course you’ll get shit for it, but I wouldn’t sweat it at all. If there are no other issues with it and it plays and sounds great, count your blessings. The USA line can be hit or miss.
 

Jimmy The Snake

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Stickers match, that’s good. The Gibson USA stamp isn’t there, but I guess that can vary?
I used to work at a consumer audio electronics company I know you all have heard of. I was involved with engineering & manufacturing of radios, home theaters, & car stereos. What concerns me is the lack of the "Gibson-USA" stamp in the metal. Stickers are easy to produce and fake, but we used to do things like metal stamps or stickers of a Hologram nature to make sure that it was our gear for warranty purposes. I would look at the solder joint of the PU wire to the POTs in the guitar to see if they still look factory fresh, a 1 time only factory solder joint would look real clean. The PU in backwards is a huge warning flag as that tells us somebody tampered who did not know what they were doing. I'd ask for a refund/replacement and make sure the PUs look right on the next one.
 

southpaw219

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No I appreciate you bringing it up. I’m not bothered by the flip but I want to make sure everything is original and as it should be.

Yeah, I got is new. I got a small discount for their Preidents Day sale but it was sold as brand new.

Like I said, if those are the original pickups I won’t return it. But in my other thread someone said it might have been replaced with fakes and I just want to be sure that’s not the case here.

That’s why I’m asking here. If the pickups seem fine, I’m most likely keeping it. I really don’t care if someone flipped it but since the whole story behind it is odd, I want to make sure I’m getting the original pickups and nothing else major is wrong.
I'd be pissed to have been sold as "new" a guitar obviously tampered with that the vendor *admitted* had been bought and returned. That's some real bullshit, right there.

At the very least, I'd demand a partial refund par with used prices for that item. And perhaps a bit lower due to the tampering.

Like someone else said, though, I think this might weigh on your mind if you don't just return it and get a full refund. That weight would sap a lot of the joy you could have gotten from the thing.

Ultimately your call, of course, but you've been played in a number of ways and you should demand satisfaction in the form of either a partial refund for the guitar being used and tampered, or a return and a full reimbursement.
 

jtees4

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It's a nice looking guitar, the pickups seem legit....I'd keep it if it plays and sounds great. It also has a nice dark fretboard which is a plus, at least for me.
 

SamMoor

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People do all kinds of stuff to their guitars in hope to "get that special uniquer signature tone". I used to do the same early on. Flipping pickups around, soldering them on backwards to change polarity (I still don't know if that evern works that way). Peopla like Jimi Page and Brian May have all those switches to get these options, so the original owner probably just tried to do something special.
If he'd nicked the original pickup and exchanged it for a fake he'd probably been smart enough to put the fake one in the right way.
Plus it seems like a huge stretch to buy a guitar, change the pickups and send it back, just to steal a pickup.
Also, you're talking about a 2499$ guitar and a 175$ pickup.If you like the guitar, keep it. Because, finding a guitar that feels right for you is much harder than finding a genuine Gibson pickup. And if that remaining bit of uncertainty keeps bugging you, you can still buy an original pickup from Gibson and put that in and then you have cetrainty.
And if none of this makes any sense to you or you keep on thinking "yeah, but..." I guess it would be best to take it back.
 

Stratmagik87

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Read through the thread -

Good fit and finish on a Gibson with playability that makes you happy is not the easiest find. That’s a factor.

That being said - do NOT pay full retail price for a guitar that GC admits was bought, tinkered with, returned, and shipped to their store. You did not buy a factory new guitar and paying retail on that is bonkers. GC is selling these used from $1800-$2100 online.
 

JTPhinney

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Hi guys! So a few of you might know I recently got a new Les Paul standard 60’s from Guitar Center. It’s an awesome guitar, but after bringing it home I found out the bridge pickup was put in backwards, as seen here.


At first I assumed this was a Gibson QC issue or factory mistake but I got the suggestion the check baby picture and turns out the pickup was in the correct position from the factory.


I just got back from the Gutiar center and they confirmed the guitar was bought and returned once before to a store in a different state, they don’t know how it got to my store and is a bit fishy. We still don’t know who flipped it or why.

My biggest concern is if someone took out the original pickups to sell and put in some fakes.
They were nice enough to open up the guitar for me at the store to confirm the pickups are still original and we took photos of the undersides.
They seem legit. But what do you think? Do these look like the original 61R/T pickups? The stickers seem to match up but it’s still odd. Should I just return it and take the refund? I can order another standard 60’s but this one looks and plays great, so if pickups look to be original and everything seems okay, I would just keep this one. But the whole story is odd, even the staff were perplexed. They said it’s up to me if I want to exchange or return.

My question would be... Why the PAF sticker for a 61 reissue? Gibson had received the patent number by then and was using that sticker... I saw the same sticker on the new SG pick ups on reverb... Does anyone know why the PAF sticker is being used on a 61 reissue?
 


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