New Gibson Les Paul Standard 50’s

amgomez

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Recently, I had to sell my Les Paul to cover medical, and car troubles costs. I decided to save some money, and order another Les Paul. It came in yesterday. It plays flawlessly and weighs 8lbs and 12oz. Everything is perfect as far as playability. Anyhow, I contacted AMS, to see if they could give me a discount on it because it came with blemishes. I work at an instrument factory and I’m having the repair guy give me a quote. What does anyone think this is? I speculate it’s either super glue or lacquer that seeped past the painters tape. It also came with a couple of dents. What do you think would be fair as far as a discount goes? I feel they’re going to lose money on it if they just have me exchange it. Part of me doesn’t want to exchange it because it’s perfect in every other way.
 

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amgomez

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Also, the pictures aren’t the best, but the substance is smooth, hard, and has a semi gloss shine. At first, I thought it was the grain, but it’s not.
 

jskidder

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AMS isn't going to lose money on it if you exchange it, they will probably just resell it as a demo or send it back to Gibson.

As far as a fair discount, how much did you pay for it in the first place?
 

amgomez

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I’m sure they’ll resell it as a blemished product, lose a few or a couple hundred dollars. I think, or you might be right, maybe they’ll send it back. $2700 something that’s including taxes. I mean I’m not looking for 50% or something absurd. I was thinking, maybe I can fix it myself, and both parties can save the trouble. I’m not even expecting to be reimbursed as if it were a blemished product, which it is. Maybe around $100 bucks if it’s irreparable. Technically speaking, it’s a cosmetic flaw, and I’m assuming whomever ok’d it as it was being distributed knew that.
 

jskidder

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I’m sure they’ll resell it as a blemished product, lose a few or a couple hundred dollars. I think, or you might be right, maybe they’ll send it back. $2700 something that’s including taxes. I mean I’m not looking for 50% or something absurd. I was thinking, maybe I can fix it myself, and both parties can save the trouble. I’m not even expecting to be reimbursed as if it were a blemished product, which it is. Maybe around $100 bucks if it’s irreparable. Technically speaking, it’s a cosmetic flaw, and I’m assuming whomever ok’d it as it was being distributed knew that.
If I paid full retail I'd just send it back straight up. But if you're looking for $100 you should be able to get that easily. Most dealers will give you at least $200 off retail on a new Standard anyway if you negotiate upfront.
 

amgomez

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That’s the thing, I’ve had very bad luck with all of the Gibsons I’ve bought in the last 2 years. Everyone raves about the quality control being better, but I’ve been unlucky. I’m tired of returning things. Other than cosmetics, the guitar is awesome. Nut cut perfectly, got it low with no buzzing action, binding scraped well, saddles cut well.. a bunch of stuff that I know can be a pain in the ass to adjust. I want to keep it, but yeah if they don’t work with me, then with a heavy heart I’ll return it.
 

redking

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Because it's kind of blotchy, it leads me to believe that it might be some sort of adhesive that soaked in and dried in that pattern. CA glue, wouldn't do that I don't think as I have drizzled CA glue into the fret slots in a couple of guitar kits I have built and it is not really noticeable, and if anything gets darker. I suppose it could be a natural inclusion in the rosewood but i have never seen that before. The sap wood is a lighter color than the heart wood, but it doesn't really look like that. I would return it unless the guitar plays like a mofo - in that case I would be tempted ask for a discount and see if it could be dyed darker to match.

I would also ask for opinions over in the luthier section. If it is an adhesive, I would say it is unlikely that it could be dyed, because it wouldn't absorb in that spot.
 
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MusiKfir

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At first I thought maybe it's uneven sanding or scratches from tools they use or something went wrong with the glue there, but if you say it feels smooth and shines then it sounds like you're right, it's either glue or lacquer. I think that lacquer is less likely cause it's pretty high above the fretboard and how they stain with the lacquer doesn't get to these positions usually.
About a discount, it's really up to them, but as the one above me said, they can handle with an exchange. I'd say, try another one in the store and see if it feels as good as this one(it probably would cause these guitars are most machine manufactured).
 

amgomez

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Because it's kind of blotchy, it leads me to believe that it might be some sort of adhesive that soaked in and dried in that pattern. CA glue, wouldn't do that I don't think as I have drizzled CA glue into the fret slots in a couple of guitar kits I have built and it is not really noticeable, and if anything gets darker. I suppose it could be a natural inclusion in the rosewood but i have never seen that before. The sap wood is a lighter color than the heart wood, but it doesn't really look like that. I would return it unless the guitar plays like a mofo - in that case I would be tempted ask for a discount and see if it could be dyed darker to match.

I would also ask for opinions over in the luthier section. If it is an adhesive, I would say it is unlikely that it could be dyed, because it wouldn't absorb in that spot.
That’s the thing, it plays flawlessly. I’ve haven’t had the best luck with Gibson when it comes with playability. When I say playability, I don’t mean set up. I set up my own guitars. What I mean is quality of the instrument... where the neck has too much af an angle, or not enough.. the frets are not truly level, or the nut slots are too deep and or uneven.. which I’m tired of dealing with. Guitars are temperamental, and there are so many variables in making one, and this is the best one I’ve had in a very long time. Haha. Sorry for the rant.
 

redking

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I hear ya! This is the third LP this week on the forum with QC issues. I have one on hold right now so I'm getting nervous for the day I get it in my hands now lol!!
 

amgomez

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I hear ya! This is the third LP this week on the forum with QC issues. I have one on hold right now so I'm getting nervous for the day I get it in my hands now lol!!
Well, I wish you the best of luck with that! Hopefully, it comes with no problems whatsoever!
 

jskidder

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I hear ya! This is the third LP this week on the forum with QC issues. I have one on hold right now so I'm getting nervous for the day I get it in my hands now lol!!
I think that just underscores the importance of buying from reputable independent dealers as opposed to the big box stores like GC, Sweetwater, AMS, etc. The ability to have them handle and thoroughly inspect the guitars, play them, send detailed images, etc. is invaluable in avoiding issues like this. Not to mention the fact that you'll almost always pay less, support a small business, and usually get a quality setup included. I'll honestly never understand why people buy guitars from those big mass retailers.
 

redking

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I think that just underscores the importance of buying from reputable independent dealers as opposed to the big box stores like GC, Sweetwater, AMS, etc. The ability to have them handle and thoroughly inspect the guitars, play them, send detailed images, etc. is invaluable in avoiding issues like this. Not to mention the fact that you'll almost always pay less, support a small business, and usually get a quality setup included. I'll honestly never understand why people buy guitars from those big mass retailers.
I would tend to agree. Many Gibsons that are sold are probably never even unboxed by the retailer. They must still have a bit of a morale problem at the factory if issues like the ones seen here this week are getting through, because they are fairly obvious things to anyone looking at a guitar for a few minutes.
 
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Gitter

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OP - have you tried using any fretboard cleaner/conditioner and/or zero grade steel wool?

As far as Gibson's QC....it may seem worse than it is when you consider most people are quick to point out issues (rightfully so). But consider the thousands of guitars each month that roll out their doors that you never hear boo about.

Even though they lowered their daily production, they're still turning out 350 guitars per day (at least that's the last number I heard). That's a lot less than before, but still like 10,000 guitars a month. Even if 100 a month have issues, that's still only like 1%.

I'm no fanboy and not defending them by any means. In fact, I refused to own a new Gibson for over 15 years. The true last line on QC is the retailer. If Gibson is letting something get by, the retailer should catch it and hold them accountable for it, not just pass it on. Afterall, it's the retailer who is buying it from Gibson, not the consumer. I know if I had a shop there's no way in hell I'd accept a guitar with blatant flaws from a manfacturer let alone ship it out to a customer.
 

amgomez

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I think that just underscores the importance of buying from reputable independent dealers as opposed to the big box stores like GC, Sweetwater, AMS, etc. The ability to have them handle and thoroughly inspect the guitars, play them, send detailed images, etc. is invaluable in avoiding issues like this. Not to mention the fact that you'll almost always pay less, support a small business, and usually get a quality setup included. I'll honestly never understand why people buy guitars from those big mass retailers.
I live in San Diego. There aren’t many mom & pop kind of guitars stores here. The ones that I have available to me, tend to only have very little in stock. They also always offer to order one for you, but they also have no idea in what shape it will arrive. There’s a particular store here in La Mesa, that marks up the price. They always sell them at the list price. Anyhow, I understand and agree with supporting small businesses.. but buying a guitar in general for me isn’t so black and white.
 

jskidder

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I live in San Diego. There aren’t many mom & pop kind of guitars stores here. The ones that I have available to me, tend to only have very little in stock. They also always offer to order one for you, but they also have no idea in what shape it will arrive. There’s a particular store here in La Mesa, that marks up the price. They always sell them at the list price. Anyhow, I understand and agree with supporting small businesses.. but buying a guitar in general for me isn’t so black and white.
I'm talking about buying online from someplace like Wildwood. Places like that are a dream to deal with and will provide you with any info you need via email and/or phone.
 

redking

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OP - have you tried using any fretboard cleaner/conditioner and/or zero grade steel wool?

As far as Gibson's QC....it may seem worse than it is when you consider most people are quick to point out issues (rightfully so). But consider the thousands of guitars each month that roll out their doors that you never hear boo about.

Even though they lowered their daily production, they're still turning out 350 guitars per day (at least that's the last number I heard). That's a lot less than before, but still like 10,000 guitars a month. Even if 100 a month have issues, that's still only like 1%.

I'm no fanboy and not defending them by any means. In fact, I refused to own a new Gibson for over 15 years. The true last line on QC is the retailer. If Gibson is letting something get by, the retailer should catch it and hold them accountable for it, not just pass it on. Afterall, it's the retailer who is buying it from Gibson, not the consumer. I know if I had a shop there's no way in hell I'd accept a guitar with blatant flaws from a manfacturer let alone ship it out to a customer.
I guess one thing you could try is to to take a razor blade and see if you can scrape a tiny amount of it off - hold the blade parallel to the board and don't stick the point into the board, but maybe it will come off.
 

heavypic

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OP - I've read complaint on this forum about questionable quality of FB on LPs of late. Looking at your pics...Is that perhaps an attempt to fill/cover large FB pores or defects in the FB? If that can't be scrubbed off and the FB better evaluated, I'd return it for another or refund. I can't imagine how that would look if you were to apply some mineral oil to FB. Like others have commented, if online purchase is the only alternative, look to online vendors that post good quality pics of guitars. Good luck!
 

LesPaul60sTribute

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I also have had similar experiences in the last 12 months with Gibson Les Pauls. My 2019 Standard arrived with very odd wavy binding, a chipped fret, and a rough fingerboard. I ordered a 2020 Les Paul Classic and it arrived with the oddest finish flaws I have seen yet around several sides of the neck joint. I finally have a keeper (2020 Les Paul Standard) but it took a while.

I used to live in San Diego - I loved it there and miss it quite a lot. The first Les Paul I ever bought new was in downtown San Diego in 1993. That guitar was flawless :)

Here are a few pics of my QC issues

PHOTO_20201223_035134.jpg thumbnail_IMG_20200109_024503.jpg Flaw1.jpg
 
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amgomez

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I guess one thing you could try is to to take a razor blade and see if you can scrape a tiny amount of it off - hold the blade parallel to the board and don't stick the point into the board, but maybe it will come off.
I think I’ll try that. I’m gonna at if with some fine steel wool first, and the blade second!
 


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