Need immediate help on identification of a 90s R9. Identified: R6 60 Reissue

Dan7

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Hey all! I have the fortunate circumstance of living in Japan and finding rare guitar gear on the cheap due to some of the resell stores not researching true value of guitars & gear. Yesterday, I ran into this beauty, which is listed in the store as "Gibson Les Paul 59 Reissue HDSB 1992". There is more Japanese written on the plackard and in the middle of the description, the word "Classic" appears (translated it and it was in reference to the pickups).

My questions are:
1) is this truly a 59 reissue? I looked it up in the serial number decoder and it came back as a 1992 Les Paul Classic.
2) Would this be worth picking up and taking home with me today?

Any other info would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance, good people of this awesome forum!

Edit: the neck pickup cavity has HDSB stamped and the bridge has R6 in red with 30 Nov 1992. This is a late ‘92 1960 reissue, not an R9 or a classic, classic plus, or classic premium plus. Between 90-92, there were reissues and 93 was the first year of the historic collection, which is why this is usually dubbed as a prehistoric.

Edit 2: additional better photos added to the Imgur link
 
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mono

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Smart move. That's a real looker. I love them when they've been played and show their age / badge of honour!
 

01GT Eibach

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I am not the expert on such matters. But the back of the headstock appears to have a center seam with no wings. Is that okay? Or am I just not seeing correctly?
 

DanD

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Looks like a '92 '60 Classic Plus or Premium Plus from here.

Pull the neck pup and look for writing. Should be some black marker under the clear.

I've seen LPCP or LPCPP to denote which level of top the guitar received.

Good looking top on a Classic. They are out there but the really nice tops are few and far between.

That model was closer to 'Historic' spec than the same year Pre-Historics.

That's why Gibson started dumbing down the specs on this model in '93.
 

calieng

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The brown back plates look correct for the "Historic" version with black plates on the "Classic".

Also the logo appears more gold where the Classic was more silver color.

The two guitars were virtually identical from what I understand other than perhaps selection of wood and neck shape. No long tenon on either. I believe that started '93.

Someone please correct me if mistaken.

Thanks.
 

DanD

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Early Pres had rounded inlays....

The pups were swapped at some point. It's common for early Classics to be pawned off as Pre Historics.

Prolly why Gibson dumbed them down in '93.
 

sparky2

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I am not the expert on such matters. But the back of the headstock appears to have a center seam with no wings. Is that okay? Or am I just not seeing correctly?


I studied the back of the headstock in that one good photo.

I can make out the 'wing' on the left side, for sure.
Too much lighting glare to make out the right side.

And the center seam looks a bit like natural wood grain to me, and it's not symmetrical, which sort of supports the natural wood grain theory.

But I can't see shit on a good day, so what do I know?

:(
 

markguitar

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The brown back plates look correct for the "Historic" version with black plates on the "Classic".

Also the logo appears more gold where the Classic was more silver color.

The two guitars were virtually identical from what I understand other than perhaps selection of wood and neck shape. No long tenon on either. I believe that started '93.

Someone please correct me if mistaken.

Thanks.

The brown back plates could have also been swapped out at some point. That guitar has a lot of changed parts and aging done to it. Possibly some finish work also. The toner over the neck binding is very suspect to me. The neck binding has a dark tint to it that was added. There was no binding bleed back then and especially from a brown back color. The face of the headstock also looks to have been over sprayed. Tuner buttons also sprayed with something to age them along with other plastic parts. There was no actual “Historic” guitar of ANY kind in 1992.
 

calieng

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There was no actual “Historic” guitar of ANY kind in 1992.

Whether you want to call it Historic or not there was apparently a version of the '59 Reissue in 1992. A lot of references to it out there.



 

rockstar232007

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The brown back plates could have also been swapped out at some point. That guitar has a lot of changed parts and aging done to it. Possibly some finish work also. The toner over the neck binding is very suspect to me. The neck binding has a dark tint to it that was added. There was no binding bleed back then and especially from a brown back color. The face of the headstock also looks to have been over sprayed. Tuner buttons also sprayed with something to age them along with other plastic parts. There was no actual “Historic” guitar of ANY kind in 1992.
There was, they just were't as "vintage-accurate", as modern RI's

The Custom, Art, and Historic, division (now known as the "Custom Shop")was created in the early '90s, but they were just regular-production guitars, with slightly better appointments (highly figured tops, better electronics, etc).

Not to mention, that the Classic line (1990) was created as sort of a "poor-man's Reissue". Hence the "1960" model designation. In fact, the original, official title of that model is "Gibson Les Paul Classic 1960 Reissue".
 
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markguitar

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Of course I know there were ‘90’s 1959 reissue guitars! There were also ‘59 reissues in the ‘80’s that came with real original PAF’s from Guitar Trader in Red Bank NJ. This IS what I specialize in for a business. The term “Historic” was used. so my simple point was that there were NO ”Historic” reissues in 1992.
 

Clint

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Would probably be called a "pre-historic" if came before the Custom, Art and Historic Division was putting out guitars starting in '93.
 

Dan7

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That is correct. I perused the forums for a ton of knowledge after I picked up the guitar. All guitars dated 92 and earlier are not in the “historic” line, but were still called reissues, which were made alongside the normal line of Les Pauls since the historic line and custom shop weren’t established until 93. In 90-92, the “classics” had a 60s neck on a 59 body. The main difference of the reissues, denoted by a “REISSUE”, R6/R9, or LPR-6 in the bridge cavity, were the maple tops and the price tag. Most classics had LPC, LPP, or LPPP written in the bridge cavity.

The stamps denoting model could’ve been a black rubber stamp, red marker/ink, or black ink from examples I’ve seen and read. It was highly inconsistent as there was no standard notation. From what I’ve read, the reissues were also the only ones that had HDSB/HCSB color code in the neck pickup for the R9 and R6.

For the R9, the neck had the thicker 59 neck. The R6 had the 60s neck. To further confuse people, the classics also had a 60s style neck. The classic models had “classic” written on truss rod cover, “1960” written on the top of the pickguard, GIBSON in silver font (reissues were gold), uncovered pickups, and early classics had “Les Paul Model” written on the headstock whereas all of the other ones after mid-1993 had “Les Paul Classic” along with wider cutaway binding to prevent people and dealers to pass classics off as historic reissues.

Generally speaking for the inlays, classics had pointy inlays and the reissues had rounded inlays, but not ALL reissues had rounded inlays. In fact, I’ve seen more reissues have pointy inlays than rounded ones. Since the classics and reissues were made alongside each other, some started out as a classic and became a reissue depending on the top or to simply fulfill an order. The same was true where some reissues became classics. This is why you’ll sometimes see a classic with an absolute killer top, or markings inside of a pickup cavity scratched out.

It would be nice if there was one stickied definitive information thread compiling all of the info for this era of Les Pauls.
 
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rockstar232007

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Of course I know there were ‘90’s 1959 reissue guitars! There were also ‘59 reissues in the ‘80’s that came with real original PAF’s from Guitar Trader in Red Bank NJ. This IS what I specialize in for a business. The term “Historic” was used. so my simple point was that there were NO ”Historic” reissues in 1992.
Funnily enough, I didn't even realize it was you, when I hit the quote button, lol! Was just offering a general comment.

Definitely have a lot of respect for you, and your knowledge, Mark.
 

Mini Forklift Ⓥ

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Hmmmm, what an interesting thread. So has this all worked out in the buyers favour or is there still more that needs to be unearthed before we can come to a conclusion? it certainly has a nice top on it
 

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