Need an R9 education

[krauthammer]

Hi guys,

I've always wanted an R9, and I think this may be the year. What I didn't realize, is that all R9's are not created equal. Been reading on this forum trying to educate myself, but only getting more confused. Can you give me some pointers of what I should be looking for in an R9? I see the prices have recently spiked dramatically, hoping that these overpriced guitars don't move, and the prices settle back into more traditional territory.

Was thinking I'd like a Flame top Bourbon burst, but open to other possibilities.

Is there a certain range of manufacturing years that were better?

What's a "CC" when talking about R9's?

Is the Brazilian board a "must have?"

Would it be possible to get a worthy, used R9 for $3500 to $4000?

Anything else I need to know, pup's, tuners, tenons, etc?

TIA

 

[CaptainT]

Play it. Like it. Buy it.

Play it. Don´t like it. Don´t buy it


CC is Collector´s Choice, a run that copied specific guitars like Greeny, mostly Les Pauls, but not necessarily R9s.

Brazilian Board is historically correct. But there were only a few actual runs with Braz Boards, like 2003 or 2018. The majority of R9s doesn´t have a Braz Board.

R9s are as different as are the real bursts, so try some out and buy the one you like best.

If a R9 is too expensive go for a R8 with some flame, they are usually much cheaper (at least here in Germany)


Cheers,

Thorsten

 

[bossaddict]

Lots of people really like 2013-present Historics due to a lot of the changes that were implemented starting in 2013 (hide glued fretboard, naked truss rod, aniline dyes on the back, etc.). Some people really like 2007 as well for whatever reason and the '90s are also generally highly-regarded. You can find a great R9 from any year, though.

CC stands for Collector's Choice. Gibson started doing these in 2012. It's basically a special run of guitars made to emulate a specific Burst. For example, CC#8 was a run of 300 guitars were built and aged to look as much like Bernie Marsden's 1959 Les Paul as possible. CC's have been done on 1957-1960 Les Pauls. I wouldn't really call one that was done for a 1959 an R9, though; it's kind of its own thing.

Braz boards are really nice, but it's something you just have to decide is worth what you're going to pay for it. They will come with limited availability (limited runs in 2003, 2017, and 2018) and at a premium. You can get or buy a used Historic Makeover with a Braz board as well.

$3500-$4000 would be a pretty nice deal on a used R9. I've gotten one in that range before, but you might have to look around a bit.

Last question is pretty open-ended.

 

[rockinlespaul]

For the money you want to spend, your looking at a regular R9. No CC, no braz, etc.... good luck in your search!

 

[krauthammer]

For the money you want to spend, your looking at a regular R9. No CC, no braz, etc.... good luck in your search!

Thank you. Had no idea there were so many R9 variants. I guess I'll be looking for just a plain old R9 then. North of $6000 is not gonna happen, if I plan on living at home after the purchase...

 

[Duane_the_tub]

Why an R9 over an R8? There used to be very distinct differences between the two (neck profile, flame top), but those have gotten blurred so much at this point that the only real difference is $.

 

[krauthammer]

Why an R9 over an R8? There used to be very distinct differences between the two (neck profile, flame top), but those have gotten blurred so much at this point that the only real difference is $.

My ignorance will undoubtedly shine through here, but I'm looking for a guitar built to the fabled 1959 specifications, and with a comfortable neck.

I have played several different Les Pauls. The fat 50's necks are nice, I'm not that comfortable with the slim 60's necks. But I have a 1991 Standard, and the neck is perfect. From what I can tell, it's the 1959 profile, so that's why an R9 vice an R8. I'm thinking (guessing?) that the R8 has the thicker neck. If I'm mistaken, please set me straight.

 

[Frogfur]

My ignorance will undoubtedly shine through here, but I'm looking for a guitar built to the fabled 1959 specifications, and with a comfortable neck.

I have played several different Les Pauls. The fat 50's necks are nice, I'm not that comfortable with the slim 60's necks. But I have a 1991 Standard, and the neck is perfect. From what I can tell, it's the 1959 profile, so that's why an R9 vice an R8. I'm thinking (guessing?) that the R8 has the thicker neck. If I'm mistaken, please set me straight.

You and 50,000 other guys.

 

[DrSte31n]

I'm thinking (guessing?) that the R8 has the thicker neck. If I'm mistaken, please set me straight.

I believe that is the case for some production years. I think I read somewhere (most likely this forum) that for 2017-2018 the neck profile is very similar if not the same between R8 and R9 (Carmelita, maybe?).

 

[ARandall]

My ignorance will undoubtedly shine through here, but I'm looking for a guitar built to the fabled 1959 specifications, and with a comfortable neck.

I have played several different Les Pauls. The fat 50's necks are nice, I'm not that comfortable with the slim 60's necks. But I have a 1991 Standard, and the neck is perfect. From what I can tell, it's the 1959 profile, so that's why an R9 vice an R8. I'm thinking (guessing?) that the R8 has the thicker neck. If I'm mistaken, please set me straight.

Original 59s and 58s are exactly the same build spec - apart from neck profile 'on average'. Plenty of overlap though. Flame is the other difference, but equally there are very flamey 58's and plain 59's.
So given the more recent R8's and R9's are practically the same in average neck size, and there are very highly flamed R8's now, the difference is the first number of the serial stamp. Oh and a much cheaper guitar as an R8.

 

[krauthammer]

Original 59s and 58s are exactly the same build spec - apart from neck profile 'on average'. Plenty of overlap though. Flame is the other difference, but equally there are very flamey 58's and plain 59's.
So given the more recent R8's and R9's are practically the same in average neck size, and there are very highly flamed R8's now, the difference is the first number of the serial stamp. Oh and a much cheaper guitar as an R8.

I had no idea, thanks for pointing that out. Looks like I need to expand my search to include R8's. Glad you guys are willing to take the time to explain all of this, because I wasn't getting very far trying to learn it on my own.

 

[jktxs]

The 2018 R8 is supposed to have smaller frets than the R9, if Gibson's 2018 historic flyer is to go by.

 

[Banned]

2009 was the year of the most changes I believe.
Some R8's have smaller, necks, some bigger.
My R8 has nearly identical size/shape to my original '59 lp junior...my 1st R8 had a huge neck.
A bigger neck can always be reshaped & resprayed if absolutely necessary, by a competent luthier/refin shop...only wood.

 

[Bluplirst]

http://www.mylespaul.com/threads/fs...-cond-price-drop-to-3800.408619/#post-8648523

Buy this one.

 

[ARandall]

The 2018 R8 is supposed to have smaller frets than the R9, if Gibson's 2018 historic flyer is to go by.

Oh wow......so they're actually trying to do 1 'hidden' original spec correctly. Pity they've gone away from the neck dimension variances - but most players can't deal with fat necks.

 

[krauthammer]

http://www.mylespaul.com/threads/fs...-cond-price-drop-to-3800.408619/#post-8648523

Buy this one.

Yes, I am considering that one. It meets most of my criteria. Just wish the flame was a little more pronounced, seems a little washed out to me compared to the others I've seen. I saw one with a flame I was crazy about for a decent price, but it sold in a day.

 

[CaptainT]

Yes, I am considering that one. It meets most of my criteria. Just wish the flame was a little more pronounced, seems a little washed out to me compared to the others I've seen. I saw one with a flame I was crazy about for a decent price, but it sold in a day.

A higher flamed guitar will not necessarily sound better

No offense intended, but I think you don´t know much about Les Pauls, or Historics in that case. I wouldn´t spend almost $ 4.000 without testing or playing the instrument.

Nice pictures are nice pictures...nothing more. The best sounding Les Paul I every played was a Class 5 special run in Europe, that looked like a subtle flamed R8. I was sure I played an R8 till the store clerk told me what it really was Damn thing was 1.500 € cheaper than a R8, but I didn´t have money to buy it back then. When I had the money it was gone.

So don´t buy based on looks alone, you might end up disappointed.

 

[DanD]

A '91 Standard usually has a neck much closer in size to an R0. At least all those I've had in hand did.

My advice, should you choose to accept it, is to take a second and measure your '91 Standard neck before spending large on an R9.

 

[krauthammer]

No offense intended, but I think you don´t know much about Les Pauls, or Historics in that case. I wouldn´t spend almost $ 4.000 without testing or playing the instrument.

None taken, that's why I came here, to get an education.

Of course, you are absolutely correct. Who cares what a guitar looks like, as long as it feels right and sounds right.

I've made that mistake once, and been lucky once. Bought a Norlin that looked gorgeous, and now I don't like the way it feels. Bought a 91 Standard with a top that I would probably pass on had I seen it today, and it's my "numero uno" guitar.

My dilemma, is that where I live (US Northeast) everything is overpriced. So it's difficult to find a guitar for a fair price. Most fair priced guitars are listed on the internet, which makes it difficult, if not impossible, to see them in person and play them first.

I get the impression, that the overwhelming majority of Forum members are straight shooters, so buying from a fellow forum member may very well be my best course of action. Again, that leaves me with making the purchase based almost solely on looking at pictures.

Anyway, I'm in no rush, and I'm getting a solid education. I appreciate everyones posts.

 

[krauthammer]

A '91 Standard usually has a neck much closer in size to an R0. At least all those I've had in hand did.

My advice, should you choose to accept it, is to take a second and measure your '91 Standard neck before spending large on an R9.

I agree. Now I need to get smart on how to do just that. Because all of my babbling about neck size is pure conjecture on my part.

I'm unable to do so at this time due to work obligations, but will google the standard neck measuring practices and become educated on the subject. At which point, I'll be able to compare apples to apples, rather than just painting with a broad brush and saying "59 neck."