Master volume

[Alekseriator]

I just dont get the thing about it a little. does master volume make a 20W amp sound good at bedroom volume?

 

[Barber]

what is not to understand?

pre amp volume, sometimes called gain, controls the volume of the preamp section,
master volume controls the power ouput tube volume,

if you crank the gain, and keep the master low, you get a nasty harsh brittle overdrive,
if you crank the master (power section) and keep the gain low, generally speaking you get smooth creamy, desirable overdrive.

crank both if you like high gain!

 

[Iancognito]

That's the idea behind it. When you say "sound good at bedroom volume" it sort of depends what sounds you're after. Clean tone? Blues overdrive? Thrash metal? There's some stuff here about it.

Guitar amplifier - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It also has this interesting picture of Jeff Hanneman's stack.

 

[Saljam]

This is actually a pretty good topic. I recently bought a EPI Valve Sr just for home use. It's 20 watts and is way too loud. I've found that with the gain cranked and master way down, the distortion is not to my liking. I recently bought a OD pedal and keep the master cranked and gain down. Is this typically the best way to get warm distortion at low volumes? It sounds much better to me. In fact I have to get, a new distortion pedal to go along with the OD. Thanks

 

[guysmiley]

turn some knobs at home and find out what you like. Wow, its like masterbation really.

 

[Iancognito]

It sounds much better to me.

That's the most important bit

If I'm playing at low volumes and want a bit of crunch I use a TS-808 into my Vox AC4TV. I prefer the tube sound but even though it's a small practice amp it can be quite loud so sometimes I need a pedal.

 

[dwagar]

I use an attenuator at home, A Dr Z Airbrake, on my JTM60, I can adjust the MV higher that way and not be stuck with strictly preamp gain.

 

[imsilly]

Master Volumes are for people who forgot to buy an amp with the right wattage and speakers.

 

[Birdy]

Master Volumes are for people who forgot to buy an amp with the right wattage and speakers.

Ummmm....yeah.....ok.....whatever

 

[fetz]

master volumes do NOT make an amp sound the way it does loud at low volumes, never going to happen. at bedroom volumes, the closest you will simulate a good sounding amp is actually pedals. at least you can have fun there with pedals, even though it is not the same as an amp cranked.
and really, even a 10 watt amp is too loud for the bedroom when cranked, right?

 

[The DUDE]

Master Volumes are for people who forgot to buy an amp with the right wattage and speakers.

 

[L60N]

master volumes do NOT make an amp sound the way it does loud at low volumes, never going to happen. at bedroom volumes, the closest you will simulate a good sounding amp is actually pedals. at least you can have fun there with pedals, even though it is not the same as an amp cranked.
and really, even a 10 watt amp is too loud for the bedroom when cranked, right?

The Vox Valvetronix (30W upwards) have an output (Watts) power dial round the back, so you can still crank the gain, master, and volume to what ever you like, then turn down what is outputted through the speaker to a tolerable level, no pedals required.

 

[Iancognito]

Master Volumes are for people who forgot to buy an amp with the right wattage and speakers.

What you should do is superglue all the controls into a certain position, then buy lots of amps. Then swap amps when you need to use different tone settings, volumes, etc. I can't see a reason why someone would want to use an amp in a small venue and a bedroom and have it at different volumes.

 

[eaglewolf]

I've got the Blackstar HT-5 and Vox Night Train. Both sound pretty good at low volumes, but frankly both sound better to my ears when cranked. The Vox has a 15W/7.5W selector, but sounds better at 15W. So I use the master volume to get what I'm looking for when I want more overdrive. Both can get very loud for home use if you turn them up, but not nearly as loud as the 100W Roadster head with a Rectifier 2X12 that I used to have.

Then you start going up in wattage - especially with tube amps - and it gets virtually impossible to recreate the sound from what you hear from the same amp cranked. It's frustrating for those of us who have the same amps for gigging and playing in our bedrooms, but I guess that's the burden we have to bear!

The idea of a second amp isn't a bad one. I'm still thinking about one that has both EL34 and EL84 tubes in the same amp, with switchable volume that cuts the level by changing tubes. (6L6 and 6V6 would work as well.) I don't know how feasable this is, but maybe this would be a good idea - or maybe not. When I have the money to spare, maybe I'll look into it.

Then there is the cabinet. I don't believe speakers that are designed to sound their best when cranked with a 100W amp are also the ones that sound the best from a 5W (or 15W for that matter) head. So then you would need multiple cabinets to get the most out of each. (There is something to be said for a simple combo.) Maybe this is less of an issue for the 20W amp you originally asked about, but I still think it applies. You just don't get the speaker breakup at the lower volumes considered acceptable for most bedrooms.

David

 

[journeyman73]

you know, ive just given up and accepted this.

i think almost everyone would agree that nothing TRULY sounds as satisfying (or 'good') as a cranked tube amp. output section distorting, clipping, speaker movement/distortion, etc. etc.

attenuators, pedals, master volumes - it is just not going to be the same as the above, if you are trying to get down to home volume levels...just accept it - i have. even this new low wattage craze...i mean, if you live somewhere where you can dime a 5w amp, you are in a fortunate living arrangement - i cant.

what that acceptance has brought me, though, is a palpable sense of liberation...and i recognize that it was my own stubborness or whatever that has made this such a long road to ho BUT....once i accepted that it just wasnt going to be the same, instead of asking questions like 'does it sound like a 50 watt plexi full stack dimed' im able to ask more basic questions like 'does it sound good'.

no, its not going to sound exactly like a marshall stack dimed - but that doesnt mean its not going to sound 'good'. it is its own sound. as soon as i made this idiotic revelation i was able to just freaking play and enjoy what i was hearing.

i use a MV amp now sometimes..and i use a pedal in front of my non master volume amp. they probaly dont sound as good as they probably would if i could just crank them (though since im a poor player anyway lower volumes are probably doing me a favor) but they can still sound plenty good for my ears.

 

[dwagar]

no, its not going to sound exactly like a marshall stack dimed - but that doesnt mean its not going to sound 'good'. it is its own sound. as soon as i made this idiotic revelation i was able to just freaking play and enjoy what i was hearing.

 

[fetz]

The Vox Valvetronix (30W upwards) have an output (Watts) power dial round the back, so you can still crank the gain, master, and volume to what ever you like, then turn down what is outputted through the speaker to a tolerable level, no pedals required.

that seems like it would have some fun sounds in that, at low levels. but also as well, there is the speaker overdrive interaction that power attenuaters cant replicate, and even if they could, there is something about sound pressure that really only happens at loud levels-such as with a cranked marshall (you know that 'thud' thing?). i dont mean to invalidate getting great tone at low volumes, but rather, when 'replicating' for fun, anything goes.

 

[River]

This is what you need, Aleks. Just order it.

Mercury Carr Amplifiers

Power 8, 2, 1/2, 1/10 watts Tubes 2 12AX7, 1 12AT7, 1 EL34 Channels 1 Controls Volume, Treble, Bass, Reverb Switches 3-position Boost, Treble Cut, 4-position Output Power Footswitch No Reverb Yes Effects Loop No

 

[TKOjams]

Master Volumes are for people who forgot to buy an amp with the right wattage and speakers.

That was a very helpfull post, thank you for participating.