Makeover going in for a re-makeover

[Mike60]

I see nothing wrong with doing a makeover madeover again...

and he isn't the first guy to do so.

 

[frankv]

So, this is what I don't get. It seems that the number one reason for the makeover, according to the OP over at the LPF, is for the neck reset. People are piping in about how the neck reset is the "biggest factor in any tonal change". I can't help but wonder...how the hell would anyone possibly know that? Has anyone ever had a neck reset done to a Historic, and nothing else? If you have a neck reset done, don't you often remove the fingerboard first (I realize it can be done without removing the board)? And if you're doing a neck reset with hot hide glue, and have the fingerboard removed anyway, wouldn't you also likely reattach the fingerboard with hot hide glue too?

It's more likely that those who have had their necks reset, have also had the fingerboard and truss rod replaced, and the truss rod sheath removed, all at the same time (with a Braz board). And everything reassembled with hot hide glue. So, how does one then determine that it was the neck reset that made all the difference? I suppose this could actually be a good test case, since this guitar has already had its fingerboard and truss rod replaced, but didn't have the neck reset done.

All I can say is that I've had two Package "D"s performed by DJ on a couple of guitars, which includes only the replacement of the fingerboard with Brazilian, along with the truss rod replacement and sheath removed. No neck reset, and no refin. And boy, what a huge difference it made to the guitars tonally. And now both of these guitars ring acoustically, and vibrate like crazy. They've really come alive. It obviously wasn't the neck reset...since it wasn't done. Heck, it may not have even been any of the aforementioned upgrades to the guitar. Maybe it's the result of an outstanding fret job, with frets that are actually seated and glued properly. I've had more than one guitar that's come to life just as a result of a pro fret job and setup.

Anyway, I wish the LPF OP all the luck in making that guitar everything he dreamed of. And am really looking forward to hearing a report on the difference the neck reset made.


Frank

Great post Frank...

 

[pinefd]

I see nothing wrong with doing a makeover madeover again...

and he isn't the first guy to do so.

I agree, Mike. I don't want people to read my post above and think that I'm opposed to this re-makeover. I've actually had two of my guitars redone twice. I just wanted to vent re: the whole neck re-set issue, and the lack of evidence (as far as I know) for all these lofty claims.


Frank

 

[7gtop]

^^

 

[VictorB]

For the amount of money sunk into that guitar, he could have probably picked up a really nice conversion.

 

[7gtop]

absolutely V!c


Now fellas ... wh0se opposed to op!ni0n

 

[RAG7890]

I agree, Mike. I don't want people to read my post above and think that I'm opposed to this re-makeover. I've actually had two of my guitars redone twice. I just wanted to vent re: the whole neck re-set issue, and the lack of evidence (as far as I know) for all these lofty claims.


Frank

Frank, if I may, I'll pass on what my Luthier has said to me on many occasions.

Charles's opinion is based on the actual neck joint itself. If the neck joint is made properly, you do not need much glue to hold it in place............Titebond does a great job in this case & you have hardly any Glue in the joint.

Now his custom Guitars sustain "forever" for want of a better term because his neck joints are a perfect fit...............seen them many times. There is no slack or movement or sloppiness..........wood to wood.

However, in mass production it is impossible to get this perfect wood to wood fit (IMHO anyway). A lot of Titebond does a great job filling the gap...........hence the "rubbery" pics we often see here.

So, like you, I like the idea of Hide Glue in the neck joint but on a properly made Guitar we are really splitting hairs here & it is not necessary.

Cheers, Rudi

 

[Deus Vult]

For the amount of money sunk into that guitar, he could have probably picked up a really nice conversion.

or be like Tim and spend big bucks on a 100% accurate replica.....and then realize it doesn't sound any better than a Historic.

 

[VictorB]

The original price of the guitar, plus pickup and plastic upgrades...

2 Makeovers...

The shipping costs for those makeovers...

Phil said it best, when cranking through an amp, and the drummer kicks in, who the hell is going to hear a difference?

ESPECIALLY concerning the neck angle????

It's his money, let him go nuts, maybe that one guy in the back of Johnny's Bar and Grill will say, "hey, that guy's guitar sounds so damn good! I bet he had the neck re angled!"

 

[RAG7890]

For the amount of money sunk into that guitar, he could have probably picked up a really nice conversion.

+ 1, my thoughts exactly. This is the way to move forward IMHO.

 

[pinefd]

Frank, if I may, I'll pass on what my Luthier has said to me on many occasions.

Charles's opinion is based on the actual neck joint itself. If the neck joint is made properly, you do not need much glue to hold it in place............Titebond does a great job in this case & you have hardly any Glue in the joint.

Now his custom Guitars sustain "forever" for want of a better term because his neck joints are a perfect fit...............seen them many times. There is no slack or movement or sloppiness..........wood to wood.

However, in mass production it is impossible to get this perfect wood to wood fit (IMHO anyway). A lot of Titebond does a great job filling the gap...........hence the "rubbery" pics we often see here.

So, like you, I like the idea of Hide Glue in the neck joint but on a properly made Guitar we are really splitting hairs here & it is not necessary.

Cheers, Rudi

Makes perfect sense, Rudi. And what I didn't mention previously, is that the two guitars that I had the Package D performed on were a '97 and a '98. There weren't nearly as many guitars produced back then as there are today. And most will agree that the quality of the guitars produced back then were quite high. So, perhaps those guitars had very tight neck joints to begin with.


Frank

 

[RAG7890]

Makes perfect sense, Rudi. And what I didn't mention previously, is that the two guitars that I had the Package D performed on were a '97 and a '98. There weren't nearly as many guitars produced back then as there are today. And most will agree that the quality of the guitars produced back then were quite high. So, perhaps those guitars had very tight neck joints to begin with.


Frank

Agree, based on the quality of my '97 R0, it was astounding. Really well made instrument.

Cheers, Rudi

 

[Bobby Mahogany]

For the amount of money sunk into that guitar, he could have probably picked up a really nice conversion.

For the amount of money sunk into that guitar, he certainly picked up a really nice conversation.

Fixed!

 

[mcoLP]

Care to elaborate on what you found with your R6?

Maybe a bit later. My fingers are too sore to type from all the playing I've been doing on this thing.

 

[jpftribe]

Frank
Are those the two at Mark's now?

 

[RAG7890]

Frank
Are those the two at Mark's now?

Yep, these are Frank's two makeovers at Mark's Guitar Loft.............'97 & '98..........really nice Guitars.

 

[pinefd]

Frank
Are those the two at Mark's now?

One of those at Mark's now is one of the Package D guitars mentioned above (the '97 R9). The other guitar at Mark's is a full makeover. The other Package D guitar that I mentioned above (which I'm holding onto for now) is this one (a '98 R9):

Frank

 

[RAG7890]

Frank, shouldn't you be asleep now?

You wont believe this but we hit 107.6°F again today...............

Nice '98 R9 you posted. Mind you the other two for sale are nice as well.

Cheers, Rudi

 

[pinefd]

Thanks, Rudi! And yes, I'm headed off to sleep now. Good night!

 

[jpftribe]

One of those at Mark's now is one of the Package D guitars mentioned above (the '97 R9). The other guitar at Mark's is a full makeover. The other Package D guitar that I mentioned above (which I'm holding onto for now) is this one (a '98 R9):



Frank

If you ever decide to get rid of this one, let me know.