LP/SG wiring changes a history

onehippie

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get to know your SG friends original vocal circuit configuration
pre changes

starting with a '59 L P TV special thru 72 SG



'59 LP TV special


'61 LP TV special


61 les paul sg


62 sg standard 50s


62 gibson sg junior
if the tone 1 lug was hooked direct to the vol wiper lug would it be 50s wired with piggy back cap the tone to me should only be removed from thr wiper not the source before it gets to the wiper
or the cap hooked to tone 1 lug ran to vol wiper then ground wiper lug to back of pot leaving the vol source lug open for just the pup +



62-special


64 sg reverse 50s




65-special


66 sg standard reverse-50s



66 sg standard reverse-modern
curious output stage these 2 shots


67 SG Standard (guitar owned by b-squared)


68 sg standard



oh the changes
 

Papa

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Onehippie,

Interesting pics, to say the least!
Thanks for posting.

What I find interesting as I compare them is cap placement. Are those all stock setups?

They look very similar to the type of pics I take. Are those your own guitars?
I'm surprised if you were able to find such good and consistent stock shots.
Either way, nice collection of pics.

If they are your guitars, consider me extremely jealous!

Papa
 

onehippie

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would be nice
though none are i was researching for '62 SG Standard stock
wiring for a "rewire" im starting this winter with Jonesy
ended up more a history of sorts
glad youve found it interesting as well right on
you hit it clean
they are all stock setups as far as i could gather
i hoped that spirit would come thru
im going with 50s as in '62-'63 it was stock as far as i can tell
no metal plate

research source was here

1962 SG Special
 

onehippie

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the last image above is a '72 Standard
sorry about that

now here we arrive
from '53 GoldTop through juniors toward '71 SG deluxe


53 Gibson LP Gold Top


57 Gibson Les Paul Junior


69 Gibson LP Deluxe Gold


71 Gibson SG
 

tonedragon

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Wow I can finally have change the switch in my SG3 faded thanks for the great photos.
 

onehippie

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B-Squared Thank you for your contribution to our record needed a '67 special

ToneDragon im glad youve found it useful
 

b-squared

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Added my pic to the original post, so there's some better context.

Great thread!

BB
 

onehippie

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right on now its improved well placed
its one from us members many :D

and timely too
 

chrisalchin

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Got a question regarding vintage vs modern wiring. I've recently don't the vintage wiring mod to my 95 lp standard and the difference is night and day.... It was like taking a pillow out from in front of my amp, it's so much more "bell" like.... My question is why did gibson switch to modern wiring? It's like down grading for no good reason...
 

onehippie

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i believe this had something to do with it


""The 1960's was a period of incredible growth for the music business in general and Gibson in particular. The explosion of rock and roll, jazz and folk music produced unprecedented demand for guitars of all types. Back-orders were as long as two years on many models. Major makers - including Gibson -

began to experiment with new materials, designs and production changes in an effort to speed production and improve profits.

CMI was acquired by Norlin Industries in 1969, and in 1975, Gibson opened a new factory in Nashville, Tennesse.""

may have been when they turned from braided wire
everyone went to modern and tiny wires
and experimenting with pot types
ground points tin box
 

gtr-tek

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Got a question regarding vintage vs modern wiring. I've recently don't the vintage wiring mod to my 95 lp standard and the difference is night and day.... It was like taking a pillow out from in front of my amp, it's so much more "bell" like.... My question is why did gibson switch to modern wiring? It's like down grading for no good reason...
My take on this as I don't profess to be an expert...

The behavior of 50's wiring between the tone and volume pots causes the taper to shift when both are turned down a bit. The tone pot also begins to act as a volume pot when the volume pot is turned down a ways. My best GUESS is that there were complaints of this behavior and Gibson fixed it by using modern wiring (moving the tone cap to the pickup lug on the volume pot from the switch lug). That did indeed make the volume taper consistent but at the loss of high frequencies as the pot is turned down. This is why I believe a multitude of guitarists leave their guitar controls dimed all the time. I was one of them, so I guess I would know about that at least. :hmm:

No free lunch here...

Treble bleed cap and resistor combos placed across the switch and pup lugs on the volume pot help this but it still lacks the beauty of the 50's circuit in it's tonality. You just need to choose which method suits your ears and playing style.
 

CRAZYokiSKATER

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Is the 50s wiring worth doing in a Epiphone? Big difference? I am thinking about doing it, but I don't want to redo it...again
 

onehippie

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there are a number found
to be done for an epi stock
improvement indeed to systems
wiring nut frets bridge the like

a vocal circuit must breathe
in a contoured environment
might get with Jonesy
good stuffs educationally and other
also River has had fine results with easyy change connects
all goes to reaction not really betterer\worse
not to give to a tit for tat
with modern and volume on 5
5o% or more of original signal is shunting to the volumes ground
the tone pot lug 1 is hooked to this
configuration
the tone is also shunting some to its ground
unless on 10
basically two grounds per tone session
loosing signal to ground
with tone on 10 and vol down this even before the tone pot and its ground lug has a chance to properly
contour the bleed off to ground of treble
so by this the signal remaining is by default more darker and thinned than really needed
the solution always play at ten across the board
not good this
imho if certain business changes werent made back when
the wiring would have possibly
never changed from original 50s configuration
was a cost cut situation there are other theories on it
all your doing is bringing it to a more original design

for me all the early albums i dig had a certain era of instrument friends
that were mostly stock 50s configuration
so i just set it to the default specs for those years
why totally reinvent the wheel
there are many systems coexisting on a guitar
all with a specific task designed around each other
50s vocal circuit was the configuration chosen to represent
these variables with contouring
and interplay between tone and volume was a perk
also modern is a downsizing of components in alot of cases
wires pot values quality are sub level
its enough wiring to move it out the door without holes in body open wide
and play for customer not really react optimal

all my instr. friends were used and older models i see them as unfinished
projects that just happened to be from a guitar factory
i got lucky they were also of quality had that hum

i also noticed a marked change in the reaction and feel of the stock pups
with 50s
if you suspect the pups are at fault check for modern wiring
could be the cause of woes to you
the pup usually will tell the tale

ymmv

if your happy with the way it is now then make no changes
 


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