Let's Talk Glue

Paranoia

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Fair warning, I've not built anything with wood since shop class in high school, and even then, there wasn't much in the way of gluing, so some of this may be a little rudimentary to you. Looking to get my vintage LP build started and then on to my other, more unique ideas!

Google tells me that LPs back in the day were glued together with urea formaldehyde between the maple cap/mahogany body, and hide glue at the neck.

The trouble is... I live in Australia.

Every Australian website I've come across that used to sell the urea formaldehyde doesn't any more, and over the pond won't ship it in. Shipping the hide glue in is a risk - our customs apparently does catch it coming in on occasion and rejects it based on it being an animal product.

I've only found one brand of hide glue already within the country, appropriately named ubeaut, but there's no mention of gram strength or quality (though the FAQ mentions that 'it stinks', which reportedly isn't a good sign, apparently the 'good' stuff doesn't have this problem so much).

Now, I'm not set on these glues purely for tradition's sake. If there's quality alternatives with similar properties, or if it doesn't matter, I'm all for giving it a go. I like the idea of these ones because they dry hard like glass and don't suffer from 'creep'. I like the idea of them, most importantly, because they won't be rubbery at all!

So, my questions to you - what glues do you use? Are there any other glassy, creep-free glues out there? And most importantly - does it even matter at all? I could just grab a bottle of Titebond III or something... Assuming I can even get that in the country too, lol. Just gave the first overseas website a look see and it's a no-go there :slash:
 
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Gibson use Tite-bond on all their guitars now, just use Titebond I for fretboards, it's a tad easier to remove, and unless you've worked with hide glue regularly, it's not the easiest to work with
 

tigger

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(<--pekelnik in HCEG Hi Ratae!)

I was afraid of hide glue, but completely love hide glue and fish glue now. The reason is that if you want to be really precise, hide glue allows you to align the two boards after touching them together, but this is harder with titebond in my limited experience. Fish glue is great where you don't care about strength but want to have an invisible glue line and easy clean-up. And I think you should stay away from Titebond III and stick to I for guitar building, I've never used it but that's what people say, apparently III will creep.

Note that I was lucky enough to find a disused crockpot at home that I'm using to warm up the glue.. It could be that without it it would be much more of a hassle as Ratae says though putting the container under running hot water would perhaps do the trick.
 

Blackstar1099

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Frogfur

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In San Francisco they really like good old model glue in a brown paper bag.
Discreetness is everything.
 

strömsborg

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(<--pekelnik in HCEG Hi Ratae!)

I was afraid of hide glue, but completely love hide glue and fish glue now. The reason is that if you want to be really precise, hide glue allows you to align the two boards after touching them together, but this is harder with titebond in my limited experience. Fish glue is great where you don't care about strength but want to have an invisible glue line and easy clean-up. And I think you should stay away from Titebond III and stick to I for guitar building, I've never used it but that's what people say, apparently III will creep.

Note that I was lucky enough to find a disused crockpot at home that I'm using to warm up the glue.. It could be that without it it would be much more of a hassle as Ratae says though putting the container under running hot water would perhaps do the trick.
So fish glue is weaker than hide glue? Is there any application on a guitar where fish glue isn't recommended?
I used only fish glue on the one build I've finished so far and the neck hasn't popped off yet.
 

LtDave32

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Fair warning, I've not built anything with wood since shop class in high school, and even then, there wasn't much in the way of gluing, so some of this may be a little rudimentary to you. Looking to get my vintage LP build started and then on to my other, more unique ideas!

Google tells me that LPs back in the day were glued together with urea formaldehyde between the maple cap/mahogany body, and hide glue at the neck.

The trouble is... I live in Australia.

Every Australian website I've come across that used to sell the urea formaldehyde doesn't any more, and over the pond won't ship it in. Shipping the hide glue in is a risk - our customs apparently does catch it coming in on occasion and rejects it based on it being an animal product.

I've only found one brand of hide glue already within the country, appropriately named ubeaut, but there's no mention of gram strength or quality (though the FAQ mentions that 'it stinks', which reportedly isn't a good sign, apparently the 'good' stuff doesn't have this problem so much).

Now, I'm not set on these glues purely for tradition's sake. If there's quality alternatives with similar properties, or if it doesn't matter, I'm all for giving it a go. I like the idea of these ones because they dry hard like glass and don't suffer from 'creep'. I like the idea of them, most importantly, because they won't be rubbery at all!

So, my questions to you - what glues do you use? Are there any other glassy, creep-free glues out there? And most importantly - does it even matter at all? I could just grab a bottle of Titebond III or something... Assuming I can even get that in the country too, lol. Just gave the first overseas website a look see and it's a no-go there :slash:

Aliphatic resin glue (Titebond) bonds with the cellular structure of the wood. It may be a bit slick at first, but it creates a good bond. And it cleans up with water.

If you're gluing up a fret board to a neck, it's best to use a couple of brads driven into the neck gluing surface as "locating pins" so it doesn't creep. One up near the nut, one down below at the heel. Chop them off with some cutters to leave a sharp nub exposed, press your fret board in place (with no glue, just to get a dent), give it a tap on each end with a plastic mallet, and you've got your indexing. When you glue it up, you'll feel the pins go in the holes.
 

SlingBlader

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Gibson use Tite-bond on all their guitars now, just use Titebond I for fretboards, it's a tad easier to remove, and unless you've worked with hide glue regularly, it's not the easiest to work with
Gibson uses a variety of glues including hide glue depending on the model line. Also, a hide glue joint is far easier to separate than a Titebond joint... by a country mile.
 
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Freddy G

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and don't suffer from 'creep'.
Aliphatic resin glue (Titebond) bonds with the cellular structure of the wood. It may be a bit slick at first, but it creates a good bond. And it cleans up with water.

If you're gluing up a fret board to a neck, it's best to use a couple of brads driven into the neck gluing surface as "locating pins" so it doesn't creep. One up near the nut, one down below at the heel. Chop them off with some cutters to leave a sharp nub exposed, press your fret board in place (with no glue, just to get a dent), give it a tap on each end with a plastic mallet, and you've got your indexing. When you glue it up, you'll feel the pins go in the holes.
Dave, that's great advice. But I believe the OP was probably referring to "thermo-plastic" creep. The properties that some glues have to not move at all after they have cured...like hide glue or UF resin.
 

LtDave32

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Skyjerk

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Dave, that's great advice. But I believe the OP was probably referring to "thermo-plastic" creep. The properties that some glues have to not move at all after they have cured...like hide glue or UF resin.
Did you just call Dave a thermoplastic creep?
 

Paranoia

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Never met a thermoplastic bloke before :p

Thanks all for the words of wisdom and the links. I'm gonna get me a bottle of Titebond I, and I'm gonna look into that Jowat UF glue too... but that'll be a job for tomorrow now, I'm heading up to Sydney to catch a concert tonight.

:band:
 




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