Lefty 1970(?) 1969(?) Les Paul Custom

[CanadianCustom]

Hello everyone - long time lurker, first time poster.

Just wanted to thank everyone here for the invaluable wealth of information. I figured for my first post I’d share my most recent Norlin acquisition that I bought locally here in Canada. It’s a lefty, so might be a fun one for some of my fellow south paws.

It’s been modified over the years with pickups replaced, bridge, tailpiece swapped etc. but man does it ever rock… oh and a pretty major headstock repair that was done professionally.

I also wanted to post it for your thoughts and input since there’s some unique features that indicate it might be a pretty early lefty. I’ll list some:

1. It doesn’t have a pancake body. Single piece of mahogany with 3 piece maple top. But thanks to the terrible hand-done pickup routes, you can see that top thin layer of between the top and body

2. It has a 3-piece neck though the top section is now a solid piece due to the repair. It also has a restamped 6-digit serial starting 100 …

3. The finish… well it’s not black, but it’s a beautifully aged sunburst. Could it have come like this? I gather you had to special order lefties so what are the chances this was a request?

4. Control cavity route has a thick letter B stamp inside

5. Perhaps most interesting… pots on it are CTS dated to late 1968.

6. Came with an era correct purple lined case with Gibson logo on the top.

Previous owner had it refretted. Previously it had fret less wonders with nibs.

P.s. don’t mind the pickup routes… yikes!! Also replaced those dimarzios with some aged SDs and the bridge with a historic abr-1.

 

[JohnnyN]

Beautiful! Welcome to the MLP forum

 

[CanadianCustom]

Thanks for having me Johnny and thanks for the kind words.

 

[Vintager]

As a lefty, let me jump in and welcome you. I am by no means an expert but did some research about the earliest late 60 lefties in the past. I myself have a late 73 BB custom.

Good information can be found here: http://www.latesixtieslespauls.com/odditiesleftiesandunconfirmed.asp

According to that, the earliest possibility to order a lefty was Sep69 and the first orders were shipped late 69.

However, anything could have been possible in that era, even a protolefty made guitar.

Send a photo of the headstock from the rear side to see the volute (if any).

What struck me, perhaps a bad photo, yours doesn't have fret markers on the right side.

They would not do any sunburst until much later.

 

[CanadianCustom]

As a lefty, let me jump in and welcome you. I am by no means an expert but did some research about the earliest late 60 lefties in the past. I myself have a late 73 BB custom.

Good information can be found here: http://www.latesixtieslespauls.com/odditiesleftiesandunconfirmed.asp

According to that, the earliest possibility to order a lefty was Sep69 and the first orders were shipped late 69.

Send a photo of the headstock from the rear side to see the volute (if any).

What struck me, perhaps a bad photo, yours doesn't have fret markers on the right side.

They would not do any sunburst until much later.

Always a pleasure to meet a fellow lefty! MoonWeasel (the site creator) and I chatted over email a few months ago when I shared the guitar with him. He said definitely early Gibson, but they were doing all sorts of weird stuff early on with special orders so it’s hard to categorically say anything about lefties.

Good catch with the side markers. I understand that typically they’d have them on both sides, but I don’t see evidence of them ever existing. Weird though because I held the guitar before the re-fret was done and it still had factory nibs…

It’s got the volute too, not a massive one but not tiny either. Because of the extensive neck repair, the upper 1/4 of the neck is rebuilt with new wood and a scarf joint.

Pure speculation, since I don’t have evidence, but I was told the repair was done at Gibson sometime in the early 70s and they may have reapplied binding, a new volute and restamped the serial. Maybe they refinished it then?

The strange thing to me is the non-pancake body, which I understand means it is 69 at latest. Coupled with the 68 pots it’s a head scratcher for sure. I sure wish guitars could talk!

Oh, and these tuning heads… I’ve never seen anything like them before.

 

[CanadianCustom]

As a lefty, let me jump in and welcome you. I am by no means an expert but did some research about the earliest late 60 lefties in the past. I myself have a late 73 BB custom.

Good information can be found here: http://www.latesixtieslespauls.com/odditiesleftiesandunconfirmed.asp

According to that, the earliest possibility to order a lefty was Sep69 and the first orders were shipped late 69.

However, anything could have been possible in that era, even a protolefty made guitar.

Send a photo of the headstock from the rear side to see the volute (if any).

What struck me, perhaps a bad photo, yours doesn't have fret markers on the right side.

They would not do any sunburst until much later.

And thank you for the welcome! Exciting to part of this community. I’m obviously a bit of a nerd with this stuff…

 

[mudface]

I have seen a number of red flags here.

The top binding with a additional black stripe on the the side.... never seen this before.

The route for the neck pup looks rough and even chiseled like.

Gibson would never do a scarf joint repair.

The cavity route is also rough and not exactly ‘69 spec,... but we are talking lefty here so.... I give it a slide.

With all the oddities and/or repairs I find difficult to even say it’s a real Gibson. I’m not completely positive it’s not.... but I’m not completely convinced it is.

If that makes sense.

But if you love it,.... that’s all that really matters.... enjoy.

 

[CanadianCustom]

I have seen a number of red flags here.

The top binding with a additional black stripe on the the side.... never seen this before.

The route for the neck pup looks rough and even chiseled like.

Gibson would never do a scarf joint repair.

The cavity route is also rough and not exactly ‘69 spec,... but we are talking lefty here so.... I give it a slide.

With all the oddities and/or repairs I find difficult to even say it’s a real Gibson. I’m not completely positive it’s not.... but I’m not completely convinced it is.

If that makes sense.

But if you love it,.... that’s all that really matters.... enjoy.

Totally get the apprehension - lots of strangeness! Appreciate the comments.

I’ve owned and handled many many norlin era Gibsons so I’m not concerned that it’s not authentic. It’s also been in the hands of the preeminent vintage store and gibson historian here in Canada. Just sharing some of the interesting oddities of a lefty from the era.

Cavity routes are absolutely hand chiseled by whoever installed the dimarzios haha.

Hard to argue with the cavity B stamp and the extra banded layer of maple under the top. I’m sure you know these are hallmarks of this very specific era. I just don’t see a counterfeit having these.

You’re probably right about the repair. At the end of the day I think this is just a great example of the quirks of the era, especially when we’re talking early special orders.

 

[Vintager]

Canadian, looking at the picks on a computer and not on my phone, here are my 5 cents.

That very specific and time limited blocky dotless logo joined with the bigger volute and non pancake body would definitely limit the guitar to late 69/early 70. As with lefties, not all righty rules may apply. The earliest lefties I saw were exactly late 69.

There are some wonky things going on like the not correct TRC cover (could have been easily replaced in the past), the 68 pots and foremostly the black line on the top binding and the missing fret markers on the right side. Not sure about the burst color, if refin.

There are three main hypothesis:
- it is a guitar ordered in 1969 with custom specs (but burst was not an option back then???) and produced and delivered late 69/early 70. The body might have been manufactured a bit earlier and glued with the neck later when the order arrived.
- it might have been an employee guitar, prototype and/or a showcase/retailer guitar.
- it is a fake.

I would rule out the fake guitar theory. In any case, due to the wonky stuff, I doubt this will have a 5 digit value, but I guess you're not looking to sell it but to play it

 

[Vintager]

Some details from my 73, if it helps

 

[CanadianCustom]

Canadian, looking at the picks on a computer and not on my phone, here are my 5 cents.

That very specific and time limited blocky dotless logo joined with the bigger volute and non pancake body would definitely limit the guitar to late 69/early 70. As with lefties, not all righty rules may apply. The earliest lefties I saw were exactly late 69.

There are some wonky things going on like the not correct TRC cover (could have been easily replaced in the past), the 68 pots and foremostly the black line on the top binding and the missing fret markers on the right side. Not sure about the burst color, if refin.

There are three main hypothesis:
- it is a guitar ordered in 1969 with custom specs (but burst was not an option back then???) and produced and delivered late 69/early 70. The body might have been manufactured a bit earlier and glued with the neck later when the order arrived.
- it might have been an employee guitar, prototype and/or a showcase/retailer guitar.
- it is a fake.

I would rule out the fake guitar theory. In any case, due to the wonky stuff, I doubt this will have a 5 digit value, but I guess you're not looking to sell it but to play it

That’s a beautiful guitar you have there Vintager. I’ll never get tired of that classic look. I wonder how many of the early Norlin lefty customs can be accounted for on this forum alone.

You’re certainly right - I’m not planning on letting it go, so value is irrelevant to me. It’s the history of this period that interests me so much and talking shop with like minded people.

Your first two theories are what I’ve been leaning toward as well. I’ve chatted with the folk at the store where the previous owner bought it in the early 2000s (the preeminent vintage store in Canada - so again not worried about it being fake…) and they pointed out a few things that lend credence to those theories. They had a 1968 GT with the Crown inlay in the back room, and when we compared the TRC, it turns out that the one on mine is the exact same. They might have slapped that on because it was less obtrusive upside down then the righty LPC TRC, and before they had tooling for the left handed version.

That’s another fun thing to think about. When they were tooling up to create those first lefties, what decision were made consciously and unconsciously and how did they have to amend things on the fly?

Thanks again for the interest and sharing your LPC. Play in good health!

 

[Vintager]

There is one more – but a very loose – rule of thumb that the pre-70 necks were a bit thicker than the post-70s, but again, case-by-case.

Two more pictures for you. My one for example has specific white caps which were used only in a very short period in 73

 

[CanadianCustom]

There is one more – but a very loose – rule of thumb that the pre-70 necks were a bit thicker than the post-70s, but again, case-by-case.

Two more pictures for you. My one for example has specific white caps which were used only in a very short period in 73

Wow. That is seriously a museum quality piece, Vintager. Thanks for sharing those photos.

Your control cavity shot reminded me of the fact that mine has no paint in the cavity at all. Certainly possible that when the repair work was done, they stripped every last bit of black, but I don’t know… At this point it’s close to impossible to know when things were swapped out and repairs done.

Could be a red herring, but a local shop had a 1968 and 1970 ES 175 in stock and the original burst finish on them was near identical to the finish on mine. See the picture attached from a random internet one.

Thanks again for your thoughts on this and sharing your gorgeous axe.

 

[mjross]

That’s an interesting Les Paul Sir. Welcome to the forum! Oh yeah, lefties rule…

 

[mudface]

That’s an interesting Les Paul Sir. Welcome to the forum! Oh yeah, lefties rule…

You know I have been tempted to get a lefty and try learning to play left handed for years.... especially in my early years... I had always felt if I ever lost ability to finger with my left hand and could at least hold a pick I could finger with my right. I have tried it a few times.... I still think I could do it. I guess I’m a bit jealous lol.

 

[LeftyGtrPlr]

Welcome fellow lefty! I have a Norlin era lefty SG, 1978. Harmonica bridge and dual Dirty Fingers pickups. Wish I had a Norlin-era LPC, although I do love my 2002 Alpine White LPC in my avatar! Always wanted to have an ebony LPC to complete the set..

 

[LeftyGtrPlr]

You know I have been tempted to get a lefty and try learning to play left handed for years.... especially in my early years... I had always felt if I ever lost ability to finger with my left hand and could at least hold a pick I could finger with my right. I have tried it a few times.... I still think I could do it. I guess I’m a bit jealous lol.

Don't be jealous...we usually have to pay more for our guitars and have much, much, much less to choose from...
Other than that, we rule lol!

 

[CanadianCustom]

You know I have been tempted to get a lefty and try learning to play left handed for years.... especially in my early years... I had always felt if I ever lost ability to finger with my left hand and could at least hold a pick I could finger with my right. I have tried it a few times.... I still think I could do it. I guess I’m a bit jealous lol.

One huge advantage is that we can admire all the great right handed axes from afar without that "I need that now!!" itch.

 

[mjross]

You know I have been tempted to get a lefty and try learning to play left handed for years.... especially in my early years... I had always felt if I ever lost ability to finger with my left hand and could at least hold a pick I could finger with my right. I have tried it a few times.... I still think I could do it. I guess I’m a bit jealous lol.

I tried to play righty in my younger days (60’s) but failed miserably! I finally resorted to playing lefty strung righty. Unfortunately, I learned early it’s a righty world. Not that I could even afford a $29 Woolworths guitar back then but all guitars seemed to be right handed, a lefty guitar was unheard of. Be glad you are a righty Sir…lol!

 

[CanadianCustom]

Welcome fellow lefty! I have a Norlin era lefty SG, 1978. Harmonica bridge and dual Dirty Fingers pickups. Wish I had a Norlin-era LPC, although I do love my 2002 Alpine White LPC in my avatar! Always wanted to have an ebony LPC to complete the set..

Thank you! Oh man now that's a 70s icon! Those pickups must rip!!

It's a tough choice between the ebony and white... both is certainly the right choice.