Ideal rate of twist (MLP firearms and shooting thread)

SteveC

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Is there a significant difference between the two?
Nah... some swear that the trigger internals are "better" on a 3 vs. a 4, but IMHO, there is no appreciable difference. I've been shooting Glocks in competition for many years, with thousands of rounds through both versions, I can't see any difference.

Grip texture is different. I like the 4 better. The 4 has adjustable blackstrap profiles, which I really like. The mag release button is larger, better positioned and ambidextrous on the 4. That is hugely important to me, since reloads are on the clock and I need to hit the mag release button and move on. Ambi is a who cares.

The recoil spring is beefier on the 4, using dual springs. Another who cares for me.

There are other differences that may or may not matter to you, me or anyone else. But, it's almost religion with Gen 3 vs. Gen 4 Glocks.

I had a Gen 3 for years & years. When the 4 came out, and I tried it, it was an easy decision for me to make the switch. But, many, many people swear the 3 is better.

Horses for courses :laugh2:
 

cybermgk

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Nah... some swear that the trigger internals are "better" on a 3 vs. a 4, but IMHO, there is no appreciable difference. I've been shooting Glocks in competition for many years, with thousands of rounds through both versions, I can't see any difference.

Grip texture is different. I like the 4 better. The 4 has adjustable blackstrap profiles, which I really like. The mag release button is larger, better positioned and ambidextrous on the 4. That is hugely important to me, since reloads are on the clock and I need to hit the mag release button and move on. Ambi is a who cares.

The recoil spring is beefier on the 4, using dual springs. Another who cares for me.

There are other differences that may or may not matter to you, me or anyone else. But, it's almost religion with Gen 3 vs. Gen 4 Glocks.

I had a Gen 3 for years & years. When the 4 came out, and I tried it, it was an easy decision for me to make the switch. But, many, many people swear the 3 is better.

Horses for courses :laugh2:
I prefer Gen 4. IBut, since only Gen 3 was approved in CA, those there, well........
 

LocoTex

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I have a Gen 4 and like it. I just don't see why one would be okay and the other not if there are no appreciable differences. One of those California things, I guess.
 

CB91710

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I guess I'm behind here: why can't they sell the Gen 4 in Cali?
"Roster of not-unsafe handguns"
It was intended to rid the streets of cheap "Saturday Night Specials", but of course, incrementalism has now effectively prevented any new semi-automatics from being added to the list.

If you're on the list, and pay the renewal fee, you remain on the list.
If you're not on the list, in addition to passing the drop test (which was the original requirement), you also have to have a loaded chamber indicator and magazine disconnect, so it can't be fired without the mag inserted. Makes takedown a bit of a pain.
Then the latest addition is microstamping. And the firing pin can't be used because the number must be embossed on the case, not the primer.

The really bad part is if any change is made to the manufacturing process, it must be recertified against the new regulations, so if/when Kimber moves to a more tax-friendly state, all Kimbers will drop off of the roster.
Likewise with Glock. Simply moving the factory would trigger recert on the Gen3.

We can still get them used via private party transfer, but they can't be purchased new, or imported from another state, so cops are effectively the only source.... and WAY too many cops have been busted on state and federal charges for flipping off-roster handguns.
 

CB91710

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It's a small PITA to get approved.
Impossible for semi-auto due to microstamping.
Kimber was able to get their .357 approved.
Single action dimensionally compliant (think cowboy guns), and single shot break top bolt action are exempt.
 

sonar1

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You have to send every model and variant to CA for a drop test.
Too expensive for the manufacturer.
So they don’t send all of them.
Some make the CA approved list.
Many never are even sent.
 

CB91710

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You have to send every model and variant to CA for a drop test.
Too expensive for the manufacturer.
So they don’t send all of them.
Some make the CA approved list.
Many never are even sent.
I wish it were still just a drop test.

Last I heard, cert requires three operational samples and the cost is $20k.
Honestly, that's not a whole lot given the sales they would get.
Sig would sell a LOT more P380s if they had submitted models with better looking grips than what they sent us.
 

sonar1

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I wish it were still just a drop test.

Last I heard, cert requires three operational samples and the cost is $20k.
Honestly, that's not a whole lot given the sales they would get.
Sig would sell a LOT more P380s if they had submitted models with better looking grips than what they sent us.
I had a couple, but the all steel version and 9mm versions were LEO only.
My first one didn’t have the chamber indicator.
The second one did. Wouldn’t go into its own holster if the indicator was up.
Sheesh!
 

CB91710

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I had a couple, but the all steel version and 9mm versions were LEO only.
My first one didn’t have the chamber indicator.
The second one did. Wouldn’t go into its own holster if the indicator was up.
Sheesh!
I bought the alloy frame model for my wife.
Black alloy frame, silver slide, and it comes with fugly grey grips that'll never look clean after it's taken out of the box.... IF they look clean even then.

So I got her some rosewood Sig grips....
 

sonar1

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Pretty accurate, in my experience. Especially for a pocket pistol.
 

SixAngryStrings

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That's all they can sell in California.
Yup.. this State is absolutely fucking retarded.. I don’t even know why I have a subscription to Guns and Ammo.. any new cool shit that comes out, wouldn’t be available to me..kinda got a mini boner over the new Kimber Mako .9mm coming out, and then I realize, what’s the point.. I wanna move.
 

CB91710

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Pretty accurate, in my experience. Especially for a pocket pistol.
I was actually quite surprised at my Kahr P380... that thing is a freaking laser beam.
Wife does pretty well with her P238. We selected that one because she can actually operate the slide.
Out of the collection, the only semiautos that she can chamber are the Sig P238 and the 92FS.
 

sonar1

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…she can actually operate the slide...
Yeah, my Wilson Elite Professionals (4.1” bbl) were gone as I got older, slower, and my grip declined. Racking 24lb recoil springs got to be a drag.
I can still rack a 5” 1911 (16lb), but even those are getting hard to slingshot (not that I ever liked that style).
 
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CB91710

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The Kahr was a bit of a habit breaker for me on that. I generally try to keep wear on the hard parts to a minimum and only use the slide lock as a lock.
But the P380 specifically says in the manual not to slingshot it.... and honestly, I can't.
Even if I'm able to hold it solidly back, it won't go fully into battery from a manual release... it has to be snapped shut.
 

LocoTex

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Does anyone here own a CZ handgun? If so, how do you like it? I've not fired one, but I've handled a few in the stores and they are the most ergonomically comfortable guns I've ever held. I love my Glock 19, but I think I would trade it in a heartbeat for a good CZ.
 

PapaSquash

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Does anyone here own a CZ handgun? If so, how do you like it? I've not fired one, but I've handled a few in the stores and they are the most ergonomically comfortable guns I've ever held. I love my Glock 19, but I think I would trade it in a heartbeat for a good CZ.
I have a CZ75 Compact D. Also sold as a "PCR" (Police Czech Republic), but it doesn't say that on the pistol. It's more accurate than I am, very comfy, and tolerates every brand of ammo I have put through it. Including hard-primer Turkish stuff that some guns supposedly light strike. The sights aren't great, but OK. All metal, 15+1 in a small-ish package.

The compact D has a decocker and is DA/SA. the Compact B has a safety and is typically carried cocked and locked. The full size is the 75B

I very much like it.
 
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sonar1

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Does anyone here own a CZ handgun? If so, how do you like it? I've not fired one, but I've handled a few in the stores and they are the most ergonomically comfortable guns I've ever held. I love my Glock 19, but I think I would trade it in a heartbeat for a good CZ.
I don’t, but a friend uses a CZ75 in Bianchi Cup competition. If I were in the market for a 9mm again, that’d be the one.
 


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