Ideal rate of twist (MLP firearms and shooting thread)

HardCore Troubadour

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That is .223 and that was not "right before all of this"....it was August 2019. and .27-.30 per round is about right.

problem is that is apples to oranges to what you posted earlier.

9mm was $18-$23 per 50 round box everywhere last year that I saw....you know, about twice the price that you posted....but none of that matters.

When you say that it is $100-$120 per 500, that is misleading at best, it is just not so....that is the point, and we have been through it once before.

not trying to be an ass, but I am just saying, you continue to make those statements, and they continue to be inaccurate.
 

SteveC

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That is .223 and that was not "right before all of this"....it was August 2019. and .27-.30 per round is about right.

problem is that is apples to oranges to what you posted earlier.

9mm was $18-$23 per 50 round box everywhere last year that I saw....you know, about twice the price that you posted....but none of that matters.

When you say that it is $100-$120 per 500, that is misleading at best, it is just not so....that is the point, and we have been through it once before.

not trying to be an ass, but I am just saying, you continue to make those statements, and they continue to be inaccurate.
OK, but what I am telling you is this... believe it or not... That price for 9mm from 2018 was the exact same price in the fall of 2019. I shoot competitively with a large group of people and we all buy our ammo in bulk from TS, I know several people who paid that price (again, plus/minus $20) in the fall of 2019. If you were paying $18+ for 9mm then you paid much more than we did. But, so what? I

The 223 was only an illustration of how bad people are getting gouged. That ammo is selling for $699+ /case right now. In the fall of 2019 it was what I showed you that I paid in Aug. It did not go up. In fact, it was going down... until this shit started

Sorry, I don't know the exact date all of this shit started, so I can't back up 4 days and go figure out what the price was on that day. But, in August - Nov. Nov - Jan more or less.... the 223 was that price and the 9mm was that price... plus/minus $20.
 

HardCore Troubadour

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buying bulk is not the same as saying.....
Ten boxes of 9mm at reasonable prices is about $100 - $120. Maybe a few pennies more.
I don't believe anyone bought 9mm by the 50 round box for $10 per box last year....unless they bought multiple thousands of rounds.
 

JonCanfield

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Me too...where ya going?
Not sure, but we're leaning towards NV. Still close to CA. Kathy is picky - no tornados, hurricanes, doesn't want snow, etc. She wants the San Diego weather we grew up with somewhere else. My only criteria is that it's not the #stuffwecan'ttalkabouthere kind of place.
 

JonCanfield

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I just moved to Redding, CA

Much more gun friendly than Santa Cruz!
Sheriff ENCOURAGES people to get CCW’s.

Still, it’s California, so we shall see.
Redding is a nice area. Part of the problem with staying in CA for us is the taxes. I'm paying 12K a year just in property taxes now.

the county differences in CCW are really wide. I can drive 15 miles south and be in a friendly county. In Santa Clara county, they won't even acknowledge that you've filed for a CCW
 

Deftone

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Not sure, but we're leaning towards NV. Still close to CA. Kathy is picky - no tornados, hurricanes, doesn't want snow, etc. She wants the San Diego weather we grew up with somewhere else. My only criteria is that it's not the #stuffwecan'ttalkabouthere kind of place.
LOL...yea, I want year round San Diego weather too....the only problem is San Diego weather can only be found in San Diego.
 

Deftone

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And that's what we had for our first 35 years.
I have Immediate family in San Diego, and I was born and raised in Santa Clara county. I'm in Placer county now (Auburn) Very gun friendly and CCW is easy.

I'm looking at the Prescott, AZ area. Weather isn't bad.

My buddy bought 40 acres in KY for $80k. He likes long range shooting.
 

JonCanfield

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Prescott, Prescott Valley, and Kingman are on our list too. I’d prefer AZ over NV personally, but what ever keeps the complaining down will work
 

SteveC

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buying bulk is not the same as saying.....


I don't believe anyone bought 9mm by the 50 round box for $10 per box last year....unless they bought multiple thousands of rounds.
Sorry, but you are wrong. It happened all the time.

I cannot possibly explain this more clearly. The price that I paid is the case price for 20 boxes of 50 = $179.80. The reason that it is $179.80 is because I bought 20 boxes at a box price of $8.99. It has nothing to do with buying in bulk.

If you bought 10 boxes, you would have payed the EXACT SAME PRICE PER BOX - $8.99. You will, however, pay a shipping charge. The benefit of buying "by the case" is that they ship the case(s) free. So, you would pay $89.90 for those 10 boxes. Well under the $120-150 prices that many have been paying.

Now, from time to time, the box price would vary by $1.00 - $1.25. The median price was $9.99 and I think it was as high as $10.99 at one point early in 2019. By the case, by the box, same price. I even saw some fo the Federal shit in retail stores for $10.99 box.

But, prices are higher in other places: CA, NJ, NY, etc. I get that. That is precisely why I buy from Target sports. The have very low PER BOX prices *and* they will ship for free if you buy a case.
 
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JonCanfield

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That’s a much better price than I’ve found in the last 2 years here. Last 1k I bought was 239 plus tax and background check
 

SteveC

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That’s a much better price than I’ve found in the last 2 years here. Last 1k I bought was 239 plus tax and background check
The retail prices here in PA are higher, too - more in line with your $12/box price. I've seen some of the volume retailers to sometimes be a buck and change lower - now & then. We have no BG checks for ammo in PA.

In the end, I found that buying ammo online was much more cost effective, especially with my high usage. Up until they started enforcing the online sellers to collect state tax, the 6% penalty could be avoided online, too. No longer.

Even with state tax added, it is almost always cheaper to buy online - especially with vendors who offer free shipping. But, you usually always have to buy a full case.
 

JonCanfield

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The retail prices here in PA are higher, too - more in line with your $12/box price. I've seen some of the volume retailers to sometimes be a buck and change lower - now & then. We have no BG checks for ammo in PA.

In the end, I found that buying ammo online was much more cost effective, especially with my high usage. Up until they started enforcing the online sellers to collect state tax, the 6% penalty could be avoided online, too. No longer.

Even with state tax added, it is almost always cheaper to buy online - especially with vendors who offer free shipping. But, you usually always have to buy a full case.
Unless you're in CA - then it needs to be sent to a FFL that will charge for the transfer. One place here in the bay area charges .03 a round for the transfer
 

JonCanfield

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I envy you guys. where I bought my last 1k was the best price in the entire bay area at $12 a box plus tax and fees. most places were selling the same for 15 a box before all of this started.
 

MiniB

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OK, but what I am telling you is this... believe it or not... That price for 9mm from 2018 was the exact same price in the fall of 2019. I shoot competitively with a large group of people and we all buy our ammo in bulk from TS, I know several people who paid that price (again, plus/minus $20) in the fall of 2019. If you were paying $18+ for 9mm then you paid much more than we did. But, so what? I

The 223 was only an illustration of how bad people are getting gouged. That ammo is selling for $699+ /case right now. In the fall of 2019 it was what I showed you that I paid in Aug. It did not go up. In fact, it was going down... until this shit started

Sorry, I don't know the exact date all of this shit started, so I can't back up 4 days and go figure out what the price was on that day. But, in August - Nov. Nov - Jan more or less.... the 223 was that price and the 9mm was that price... plus/minus $20.
I was still getting Blazer Brass at around $0.17 per round before around February of this year, right before pandemic started to become real news. Also buy from TargetSports in bulk or 20 boxes at a time like you.

As I said earlier, I did have a few cases at that time, but since then have bought a few just to replenish. Last time I bought 9mm was 1000-rd loose pack of Blazer Brass from Natchez, at around $0.30 per round was in July, and I thought that was crazy at the time. Compared to now it looks like a steal. Actually, I did get 500 rds of some Federal 'white box' (seems the same as etc Blazer) at around $0.35 in late August. I'm in CT so I would get it to my door in two days.
 
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SteveC

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Unless you're in CA - then it needs to be sent to a FFL that will charge for the transfer. One place here in the bay area charges .03 a round for the transfer
I never had firearms when I lived in CA. That was back in the early 80's. I imagine it is much worse now. <sigh>
 

SteveC

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@HardCore Troubadour.... I bought many boxes of 9mm ammo retail over the counter for under $10/50 in December 2020.

I was buying 1,000 rounds of the “cheap” stuff for sub-200 as recently as March of this year. I may have been one of the last people in America to get that price.


I have never in my life paid as much as 20 cents per round for factory 9mm, whether in person or online.



But those days are gone. I do not expect them to return ever.

I'm hoping this will be like the .22lr "crisis" a few years ago.... and in 2-3 years all of this will be a distant, bad memory.




(I know... hope is not a strategy)
 

HardCore Troubadour

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I never bought a box of 9mm last year that was less than $15 normal retail....none of what I am talking about is the "cheap stuff" but is also was not Self defense/top of the line etc. etc. it was Brass FMJ ball.


@Who.....lol I know it is a type-o but change that date to something besides 2020 before you have someone else go waste 20 minutes of their life looking for ammo prices that do not exist today, like I did yesterday when @SteveC got me all excited.....with his 2018 prices. :applause:

and I do say that with a smile man...no offence meant, but DAMN you got my hopes up!!
 
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CB91710

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I never had firearms when I lived in CA. That was back in the early 80's. I imagine it is much worse now. <sigh>
The "frog in a pot boiling" has made it tolerable for most.
The biggest impact has been on semiautomatic rifles and pistols that have certain features.
The recent ammo restrictions are the biggest/fastest changes that really have a significant impact on all enthusiasts, whether your interests are hunting, sport, or defense.

But there have been a lot of changes since the early 80s, and it would certainly be a bit of culture shock to yank someone out of 1980 and drop them into a gun store in 2020.
I think it was 1991 that all non-C&R transfers were required to go through an FFL, and now even C&R require one. Magazine capacity and the "safe handgun roster" are the other two biggies.
 


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