Humbuckers used for ANY position

[freefrog]

The thing that stumps me is the whole phase thing with using a neck in the bridge vice versa.

To get them out of phase, you'd have to hang the pickup in neck position over the strings, upside down...


That said, + 1 about most explanations developed above with just a peaceful but relativistic testimonial about what is meant to be mounted in the neck or bridge slots: in the early 80's I had a DiMarzio Dual Sound (Super Dist with 4 conductors cable) in neck position of a LP copy and it was fully playable, even wired in series.

Since these days, I've often mounted bridge models in neck position or conversely, depending on the instrument involved and on the tonal "target" to reach.

Also, before to stop a career started in the late 70's, my friend luthier/winder did design a last Gibson style covered neck pickup measuring 15,7k and 10,2H. This product did sound powerful but clear despite of an extremely high inductance. Many variations become possible when one fiddles consciously and simultaneously with all the physical properties characterizing a magnetic transducer...

 

[ReWind James]

OMG…,











@cooljuk

If you rotate a pickup in the ring, it won't change the phase. However, if you have zebra pickups and you rotate one in the ring and put on a top hat, you'll sound like Slash.

 

[DECEMBER333111]

If it fits in the cavity, you can put any pickup in any position.
With EMGs being solderless quick-connect, people often switch them around to try them in different positions.
All pickup manufacturers should adopt a universal quick-connect system so that we can easily try out different pickups without having to solder them in.

 

[Paul_R]

But to answer the question, generally any pickup that's considered a good neck pickup, i will like it as a bridge pickup also. If the DC resistance is in the 7k range with 42 AWG, I'll usually like it anywhere. 8k and up can sound a little bold as a neck pickup.

One that surprises me is how many posts I had seen recommending the DiMarzio Norton or Air Norton as a neck pickup. To me that's like putting a "hot P.A.F." bridge pickup in the neck, having an inductance of more than 6 henries, where as a typical bridge P.A.F. type pickup is closer to 5 henries and a typical neck closer to 4.5 henries.

Me too - one of my favorite “bridge” pickups is a SD 59 neck pickup.

 

[MAS Tequila]

I have a Tele, I know it's not a LP, that has a Gibson spaced full size JB in the neck, and a SD Trembucker spaced Alternative 8 in the bridge.
Both pups metered at just over 17K(JB) and just under 18K (Alt8) and they balance out nicely.
Having that kind of output can be fun, she spanks the front end of the amp.

Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love the 490 and 498 in my Studio.

 

[Faron]

I've always read humbuckers had to be used for their designated position but I've seen some state they could be used in either position.

How is this possible... They use a special magnet or some voodoo magic?

For instance Custombuckers can be used in either position according to Gibson's website.

I wind pickups. But I usually wind them progressively. Meaning the Bridge pickup or in the case of Strats Mid/Bridge have more winds on them. Pickups that are wound the same (same amount of winds, same size wire, same magnets) could be inter changed as it would make no difference where they are placed as standard Les Paul pickups are 49.2mm spacing. However once you get into F spaced pickups there would be a difference in string spacing and the strings would cover the magnets in a different spot 52-53mm spacing. I have had clients ask for some mixed sets before though and they came out well. You can take it as there are no clear cut strict rules, whatever works, works and most innovation come from experiments

 

[Duane_the_tub]

The ReWind Creme Brulee is a great example of a "bridge pickup" that absolutely slays in the neck position.

 

[gkelm]

First I’ve heard of Gibson doing different pole spacing. Of course there at re SD trembuckers and Dimarzio F spacing, but that’s generally understood for Fender style.

 

[Underwound]

I wind pickups. But I usually wind them progressively. Meaning the Bridge pickup or in the case of Strats Mid/Bridge have more winds on them. Pickups that are wound the same (same amount of winds, same size wire, same magnets) could be inter changed as it would make no difference where they are placed as standard Les Paul pickups are 49.2mm spacing. However once you get into F spaced pickups there would be a difference in string spacing and the strings would cover the magnets in a different spot 52-53mm spacing. I have had clients ask for some mixed sets before though and they came out well. You can take it as there are no clear cut strict rules, whatever works, works and most innovation come from experiments

Each set of ears is different. When I used a 52mm pickup in the neck, I couldn't detect any shortcomings.
If the string didn't line up precisely with the pole, when I string bend a note "over the pole" I couldn't detect a volume increase.
From what I gathered, the bar magnet pretty much magnetisers the whole area.
That's what my ears hear. Other ears may be different.

 

[ReWind James]

The ReWind Creme Brulee is a great example of a "bridge pickup" that absolutely slays in the neck position.

I stopped including “bridge” and “neck” nomenclature on my humbucker decals.

People should use their ears, not theirs eyes, to judge sound.

Sadly, many will resort to a meter and miss out on the full experience and knowledge but maybe it’ll help a few.

 

[Underwound]

I stopped including “bridge” and “neck” nomenclature on my humbucker decals.

People should use their ears, not theirs eyes, to judge sound.

Sadly, many will resort to a meter and miss out on the full experience and knowledge but maybe it’ll help a few.

Spot on James. It's all ears . I had the same neck pickup in both an "incorrect" 52 spacing (early prototype) and a later 50mm spacing .The 2 examples didn't sound any different to my ears in a test environment.
I put this down to the magnet encompassing the whole area .
Similarly, prior to F spaced,trembucker etc, Floyd users didn't have crap tone because these things weren't invented. Conversely , it was hardly game changing when they were.
Reminds me of Audiophiles and their $40,000 RCA cables

 

[drivers1959]

without getting too technical ...just play the guitar and enjoy

 

[LeftyGtrPlr]

I have a '78 lefty Gibson SG and it has the original Dirty Fingers pickups in both positions.
It sounds great to me!

 

[ReWind James]

... it took about until the 90's until Gibson made a pickup set where there was a specific position the pickups were designed for. The Bill Lawrence circuit board pickups were the first ones.

In 1978 Gibson started making bridge / neck specific T-Top sets.

In these sets, the bridge pickup had longer pole screws, longer slugs, taller plastic spacers, and a large ceramic magnet. Meanwhile, the neck pickups for these sets was a typical AlNiCo T-Top of the day.

Gibson started making long skirt covers for this pickups as well, but the covers ended up getting mixed up and some of the taller pickups got the regular height covers and some of the regular height pickups got the long skirt covers.

Both pickups of these short / AlNiCo and tall / ceramic T-Tops look the same from the top and outside of the guitar but, of course, they sound extremely different. Some shipped from the factory uncovered, and these also still look the same (just like typical T-Tops of the era) from outside the guitar.

Of course, there were also the pickup sets in Varitone guitars where one pick had reverse magnetic polarity of the other (though these also got mixed up, ending up in the wrong guitars) and some other PAFs that had two braided shield leads coming out of the baseplate for more elaborate wiring. Also, the narrow-spaced PAFs, as previously mentioned upstream.

The first bridge / neck specific pickups that Gibson made were dogear P-90s, long before PAFs.

 

[ReWind James]

For those claiming pole spacing is critical regarding "F-spacing" or Fender guitars...

If pole spacing was important for pickups on Strats, The bridge pickup would always be wrong. All three Strat pickups are manufactured the same but the angle of the bridge pickup would require a wider pole spacing to line up with the strings, especially considering the strings are at their widest point over this pickup, compared to the other two.

If pole spacing for pickups was important on Strats, all of those 1970s and 1980s recordings, where artists put humbuckers into Strats, would sound bad. Measure the pole spacing of an original Super Distortion, DiMarzio PAF, or Seymour Duncan humbucker. They are narrower than a PAF.

 

[vechap]

I've always read humbuckers had to be used for their designated position but I've seen some state they could be used in either position.

How is this possible... They use a special magnet or some voodoo magic?

For instance Custombuckers can be used in either position according to Gibson's website.

My Custombuckers read exactly the same!

 

[LCPG282]

The neck /bridge position doesn't change that.Theyre still in phase because the pickups are still pointing in the right direction.ie. neck pickup screws toward fingerboard, Treble pickup screws pointing towards the bridge. Only when you have those screws pointing the wrong way around with you have it OOP.

Nope, you have to flip the magnet on one pickup to get the OOP. The position of the screws has nothing to do with OOP.

 

[red59dot]

Use your ears. There are way too many variables to choose a pickup by its DCR. DCR does not equal output. It's related but I've had hundreds of PAFs and a 9K is not necessarily louder than a 7K. One of the best PAF's I've had was a very musical 6.9K. The neck pickup in my 59 345 is 9K. It sounds pretty good right where it is. The bridge is 8K and is louder than the neck pickup by a little. If I raise the neck pickup and lower the bridge pickup, the neck will likely be louder. BTW, raising the pole screws doesn't do much of anything. Raise the entire pickup instead.

 

[Mr French]

It makes me curious if their inductance would suggest that it's the sort of pickup you would tend to find in a neck or the bridge. Gibson says the DC resistance of the Custombucker is 8k, if the DC resistance happens to track close with the inductance, I'd say that's sort of in between. The Lollar Imperial, just as one example, the neck is 7.6K and the bridge is 8.4K, so that would be right in between. Lollar used to show inductance, but removed it when he redesigned his website a few years ago, the Imperial neck was 4.1 henries and the bridge was 4.9 henries.

Fellas, so the magnet orientation does not matter and what's the deal with magnets being oriented and some not?

I was talking with a buddy last night about pickups and he brought an alnico 5 unoriented and alnico 5 oriented. Again I'm no pickup expert but do enjoy learning about these things so forgive my dumbo questions.

 

[Mr French]

Of course my post didn't quote the people I wanted too...