How Safe is Flying?

FrankieOliver

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2009
Messages
17,958
Reaction score
27,130
Ffs, enough already, I'm flying to the UK next week for the Meet.

If anything happens, I just want you to know I love you all...especially, you, Joey. :D
 

Publius pro tem

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 30, 2007
Messages
12,488
Reaction score
14,996
It's the other idiots and pyschopaths sitting in the seats next to you that make flying dangerous.
That's why I always tell people that it's a whole 'nuther world when you fly Air Neo. :cool: :naughty:

I personally select my passengers, and I keep a Glock 10mm in my briefcase until I'm ready to fly.

(Then it's in a holster, beside my seat, or next to my feet.)




Never once had a "security issue" in 20 years. :D


.
 

AngryHatter

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2009
Messages
17,182
Reaction score
13,131
I actually just read a couple days ago that in a plane crash, as long as you are in a good position (like in the back near an exit), the survival rates are *unbelievably* high.

Places you never want to be:
Standing in the aisle
Restroom - they are rated for less than 3Gs and are nothing but an aluminum frame...you'll be found like Lenny Bruce, only flatter.


Most problems domestically are runway/taxiway incursions. And since incidents are not crashes they don't get the same treatment.
 

Publius pro tem

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 30, 2007
Messages
12,488
Reaction score
14,996
Yeah, this is NOT a "crash"...


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSUL46Jdudw]A 380 Air France crashes with CRJ-700 - YouTube[/ame]
 

RichBrew

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2010
Messages
5,022
Reaction score
7,661
"How Safe is Flying?"

I would sooner be up there with the professionals than drive a car amongst all the amateurs.

RichBrew
 

Thermionik

Banned
Joined
Jan 20, 2010
Messages
11,045
Reaction score
33,108
.
.
.
.
.

Flying is incredibly and unbelievably safe.....
It's hitting the ground at terminal velocity in a spinning burning mass of metal that ain't.
.
.
 

Tone deaf

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 12, 2011
Messages
37,619
Reaction score
87,291
wouldnt know...i just keep flappin and i get nothin

I can't stand it when the guy next to you is flappin' the whole flight. Just my luck to get stuck next to someone with an intestinal disorder or who was drinking keg beer the night before.
 

MenaceMartin

Senior Member
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
8,893
Reaction score
10,192
You're fooling yourself on that point.
Flying near mountains where there's heavy, turbulent air, and windshear can certainly bring down a plane, as it has a few times in the past. But these are things that are avoided now.

Turbulence alone, cannot bring a plane down, nor will a pilot ever fly into turbulent air which isn't seen as safe enough. Pretty much all commercial jets have radars in place now, and the pilots will avoid any severe air turbulence.

That is the point i was trying to get across. If you experience turbulence on a jet, you'll be safe, as the pilot will only fly through it if it's more than safe to do so.

Any incidents which have happened in the past, such as the BOAC 707 many years back, were, again down to a series of serious faults which led to the tailplane collapsing. Turbulence alone was merely just another factor. The wings won't just break off of a healthy aircraft in some regular rough air.
 

Publius pro tem

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 30, 2007
Messages
12,488
Reaction score
14,996
Turbulence alone, cannot bring a plane down
Eh... I dunno.

I wouldn't rule it out nowadays, not completely.

Not even for heavy jets.



... nor will a pilot ever fly into turbulent air which isn't seen as safe enough.
Pretty much all commercial jets have radars in place now, and the pilots will avoid any severe air turbulence.
That's why I mentioned clear air turbulence - radar does absolutely nothing to indicate its presence.

Most turbulence still may be predicted as possible, but is confirmed only by planes who encounter it.
PIREPs, as they are known in the industry jargon.

As an aside, when I got my license 20 years ago I received a word of caution about turbulence reported as "moderate."
A flight instructor warned to find out what kind of airplane reported it.

Was it another prop-driven single like I was driving?
Was it something slick with a high wing-loading like a biz-jet?
Or was it a Boeing 737 that weighs 150,000 pounds?

If Southwest Airlines is reporting moderate turbulence on approach through air you intend to use?

Turn around NOW.



If you experience turbulence on a jet, you'll be safe, as the pilot will only fly through it if it's more than safe to do so.
As long as you're buckled up before-hand.
Good luck getting a seat belt latched when you're bouncing between the floor and ceiling.
I cannot stress this enough.



The wings won't just break off of a healthy aircraft in some regular rough air.
"Regular" rough air is like a smooth road with no obstructions - nothing should happen, eh?
But when the air goes to hell and a plane is traveling above the rated speed for turbulence, might be trouble.

Consider too, that commercial flight crews will not abruptly pull the nose up to scrub off speed.
If they deviate from altitude, they get their asses chewed by ATC.

They will cut power gradually - to avoid scaring passengers - and try to ride the bumps until they get slowed down.
At some point they may throw out the landing gear and some flaps to aid stability, especially if dropping altitude.
This too is speed-dependent according to the particular plane and how heavily-loaded it is.
If all that doesn't help, they will be asking for a new altitude - and waiting for approval.

All this takes time - and if the turbulent air you just penetrated is nasty...

Pilots still rip parts off of perfectly good airplanes by trying to keep them wings-level, or attempting maneuvers to cope.
There is a speed rating or "V" speed for rough air penetration, even for straight & level flight.
One very important "V" speed to learn for each aircraft is the Design Maneuvering Speed, or Va.
If you're going faster than that and get rowdy with the controls, the manufacturer makes no guarantees.


It's far less common on commercial carriers now, but it still happens.
Even on the newest Airbus designs.



.
 

coldsteal2

V.I.P. Member
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
37,070
Reaction score
14,466
must be safer than driving, because ive been in 10 auto accidents
and no plane crashes.......yet
 

Publius pro tem

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 30, 2007
Messages
12,488
Reaction score
14,996
Yeah, I hear ya.

To drive my point home for flying myself where I wanna go:
I've had a few minor "boo-boo" wrecks over the years.
The biggest car wrecks I've been in were with someone else driving.
Or somebody ate it while using MY car.

Flying airplanes, I've made some ugly crosswind landings and some minor mistakes.

It's the other guys who keep crashing the damned things.

Several planes I flew over the years met an undignified end with someone I knew at the controls. :hmm:


.
 

SKATTERBRANE

Banned
Joined
Nov 26, 2008
Messages
21,430
Reaction score
12,401
To die in a commerical flight in the US is like one in a million. To die in a car accident is like one in 100.
 

RobertF

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2008
Messages
747
Reaction score
1,140
Clear air turbulence would appear to be highly unpredictable and dangerous. I recall a really nice King Air turbo-prop that made an emergency landing at the airport where I work after having run into CAT -- they were reporting severe control issues. When the plane landed we figured out why -- the elevator and rudder surfaces on that aircraft had been badly bent out of shape by the CAT. Made me wonder what might have happened if they'd been in a Cessna 152.
 

Publius pro tem

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 30, 2007
Messages
12,488
Reaction score
14,996
Yeah - and that very likely happened with the crew performing only "coping" maneuvers:
Chop power to reduce speed NOW - easy in a turboprop.
Use only control inputs required to keep the wings level.
Forget altitude - let the plane ride the currents up and down.


Keep talking to ATC to let them know what's going on, and to warn others in the area.
Consider your life to this point, and rehearse your talk with Saint Peter if it goes badly.


.
 

Thumpalumpacus

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 28, 2010
Messages
76,200
Reaction score
187,691
Flying near mountains where there's heavy, turbulent air, and windshear can certainly bring down a plane, as it has a few times in the past. But these are things that are avoided now.

Turbulence alone, cannot bring a plane down, nor will a pilot ever fly into turbulent air which isn't seen as safe enough. Pretty much all commercial jets have radars in place now, and the pilots will avoid any severe air turbulence.

That is the point i was trying to get across. If you experience turbulence on a jet, you'll be safe, as the pilot will only fly through it if it's more than safe to do so.

Any incidents which have happened in the past, such as the BOAC 707 many years back, were, again down to a series of serious faults which led to the tailplane collapsing. Turbulence alone was merely just another factor. The wings won't just break off of a healthy aircraft in some regular rough air.

I'm not so confident. "Get-there-itis" has caused many otherwise reasonable pilots make stupid decisions. The pilots in Delta 191 knew they were flying into turbulent air, and knew that there was windshear in the area. Human error is multifaceted and interacts with the entire flying environment.

And turbulence has killed passengers even without aircraft mishap: Turbulence Accidents That Killed Airline Passengers
 

Latest Threads



Top