How do I check for neck warping / dips / rises

[Elkoki]

So I once bought a used Schecter from Amazon that turned out to have a rise in the neck within the first few frets. I found out about the rise after a tech told me, I can't visually detect this sort of stuff so I need help learning these sort of things. Anyway the rise caused really bad buzzing on the lowest frets even with proper relief and all that. Some of you might remember that I then took it to a tech who then ruined the guitar during a fret level and he pretty much scalloped the edges of the fretboard by mistake... any of you remember that ??

Reason I brought this up is because I bought yet another guitar from Amazon , this time brand new and it has a slightly similar issue. The guitar has fret buzz mainly only on the first fret of the low e and the third fret of the A . I adjusted the truss rod because it was too tight , now it's better but it still buzzes only on those frets. How do I check it for dips / rises ? I have tried eye balling down the neck but I can't for the life of me detect anything like this. I've tried it on countless guitars and I just don't know how to see any defects this way . Do I need a notched straight edge ? Or are there any other ways? The guitar sounds excellent , and unlike the last guitar this one CAN be returned , but I don't want to go through the hassle of it if it's not warped.

The guitar is a Schecter s-1 aged natural finish .it's a double cut somewhat SG style guitar ..

 

[ARandall]

Straightedge. There are ones that have notches in them for the frets to show what the wood is doing.

 

[warmachine]

Go to an office supplies store and get an 18” metal ruler. That’s long enough to span the 1st and last frets.

If its the fretting wood surface of the neck and not the frets thats the problem, then yes than a special notched rulers would be needed.

 

[ARandall]

^ Metal rulers are however not made with ultimate straightness in mind. You certainly cannot guarantee that it is straight even if it looks pretty good. As OP already is having trouble seeing where there are slight issues of hump/dips, him being able to buy one that is adequate for the incredibly minute differences is not good.

 

[warprider]

Are the frets seated properly?

 

[Elkoki]

Are the frets seated properly?

It looks like they are, but i'm not an expert in that though. I quickly tested if there's any rocking in those areas with an action ruler and there isn't any rocking. I do have some metal dowels that I use for checking that, but I can't find them right now. I think I might try to get it replaced before the return window closes. I wonder if Amazon stores their guitars properly, I have a feeling they leave them in a hot warehouse, and if they're like that for years, then no wonder they arrive this way.

 

[mrdannyboy]

try raising your bridge a little by little see if that helps

 

[Elkoki]

try raising your bridge a little by little see if that helps

I don't really want to raise it any further, its already at 2mm almost 2.25mm at the 12 fret. I don't like too high of an action.

 

[viking20]

It could be anything
Even just a setup thing
Take it to someone knowledgeable , if you don't have the experience , or the tools
Sounds like you have to do it rather quickly , because of being able to return it ?
Hump , and frets rising at the body joint is very common , but have nothing to do with buzzing at the first frets.
Action height at the nut , relief in the neck , and off course uneven frets could be what you are looking for.
If you like it , maybe have someone level the frets and do a setup ?

 

[Elkoki]

It could be anything
Even just a setup thing
Take it to someone knowledgeable , if you don't have the experience , or the tools
Sounds like you have to do it rather quickly , because of being able to return it ?
Hump , and frets rising at the body joint is very common , but have nothing to do with buzzing at the first frets.
Action height at the nut , relief in the neck , and off course uneven frets could be what you are looking for.
If you like it , maybe have someone level the frets and do a setup ?

The truss rod was really tight when I first got it so the buzz was at it's worst, loosening helped it but didn't completely take it away. The nut height is good, it isn't low... I didn't say it had rising at the body joint, I said the first guitar had a rise within the first few frets that caused fret buzz within that area. This one seems to have the same problem, the first fret buzzes the worst, just like the other guitar. I read about something like this long ago,something about stored neck warping? The frets look level but I haven't thoroughly checked them. I do have until next month to replace it or return it. I don't want to be stuck with another damaged guitar..

 

[viking20]

I understand
Warps and twists are really not that common
You need to look at some numbers , and YouTube can really help too.
Capo at the first fret , hold down big e at the body joint , you should measure about .008 or .010 at the 7th fret. That might not be where you end up with preferred setup , but you need to start somewhere.
If you don't have feeler guages , find something the right thickness .
Action at the first fret ( nut height ) .015 or 18 thou
You could also just fret at the 3d fret , and check that you just have light under the string at the 1st fret , also works. If it slightly higher it may mess with your action height , or intonation , but it won't be that that's causing the buzz on low frets.
If that is ok , look for un even frets
Without tools or numbers , you won't get very far

 

[ARandall]

First fret buzz......is this the string buzzing on the 2nd fret when you fret the first, or it buzzing on the first fret when open?

 

[mrdannyboy]

I don't really want to raise it any further, its already at 2mm almost 2.25mm at the 12 fret. I don't like too high of an action.

 

[Elkoki]

First fret buzz......is this the string buzzing on the 2nd fret when you fret the first, or it buzzing on the first fret when open?

String buzzing on the 2nd when fretted at the first fret. Other guitar had this problem big time, to the point that it was a dead note.This one isn't as bad, but almost.

 

[mrdannyboy]

I don't really want to raise it any further, its already at 2mm almost 2.25mm at the 12 fret. I don't like too high of an action.

Can't help ya, I don't use measurements, just been from trial and error over the years. Its not going to hurt raising the action to see if that helps, you can always go back to where you were. Good luck good sir.

 

[ARandall]

The bridge height is for upper fret setup. The nut is for lower, and the relief means you can smooth out the action all the way through essentially.
You need a quality straight fret rocker that spans 4 or 5 frets here.

And not that I'm a judge on action, but if you could measure what clearance you have, or what you're trying to get, then the experts on setup can weigh in on what level of precision will be needed to achieve that goal.

 

[Elkoki]

The bridge height is for upper fret setup. The nut is for lower, and the relief means you can smooth out the action all the way through essentially.
You need a quality straight fret rocker that spans 4 or 5 frets here.

And not that I'm a judge on action, but if you could measure what clearance you have, or what you're trying to get, then the experts on setup can weigh in on what level of precision will be needed to achieve that goal.

I had a feeler gauge set that unfortunately came apart so I got a bunch of them scattered around . I need to buy another set. I usually fret the first and last fret and check the clearance around the 10th fret . I try to make sure the gap is neither too little or too much . I know numbers would be better but this has worked well so far on many other guitars . Sorry I can't be more specific

 

[ARandall]

That's ok.......look in the end an upbow with a 1 way rod can only be 'fixed' with a fretdress, or using such thicker strings that the tension pulls the upbow out. As a guitar you have just bought, it seems unlikely to want to keep it. The solutions are all compromises after all.

 

[Elkoki]

That's ok.......look in the end an upbow with a 1 way rod can only be 'fixed' with a fretdress, or using such thicker strings that the tension pulls the upbow out. As a guitar you have just bought, it seems unlikely to want to keep it. The solutions are all compromises after all.

Yeah I had a feeling it wouldn't be an easy fix. Setup wise I think it's as good as it can get . Amazon told me they can send me a replacement so I might just do that , I don't even gotta send this one back first . Gonna call them up again and order it . Hopefully this next ones better .

 

[ARandall]

Second-hand is always an issue, like a lot of things. You never know how volatile the environment it lived in was. But new there should be no issues like that.