First finish job - Ash, grain filler take stain?

[moonweasel]

Hey all,

I am finally doing my first Warmoth build. My background is that I am a woodworker by hobby, so I am not completely new to finish work nor to the materials I intend to use (I am going wipe on poly). That said, I am new to working with super porous wood such as ash.

I ordered Timbermate (amb25 , ash/pine/maple edition). I have two courses laid out:

1) Less "risky". Grain fill and a simple clear coat. I am very confident on this path.

2) grain fill and Sedona Red Minwax and clear coat. This is where my questions lie.



Does the light colored grain filler I have ordered "take stain" or will it stay light? In other words, if I stain the guitar with the grain filler installed, will I have little white dots everywhere or will it take some red pigment?

Secondly, I have read about "Sanding Sealer". How does wood take stain if it has been sealed? I have come across dozens of variants when it comes to the order of operations. Many have "sanding sealer" done BEFORE staining. This approach seems to make more sense if one is using a tinted clear coat that is sprayed on, and one doesn't want any penetration into the wood with pigment.

What is your order of operations for grain filling, staining, and then clearing Ash? Thanks! (not spray order of operations, but hand application). Since my filler is not a high contrast to my body, I was leaning towards this order: barely wet wood to raise grain, sand off raised grain, filler, stain, clear (stain being optional if I can't figure it out).

Finally, I imagine, even with the grain filling, that the end grain on either side of the guitar are going to suck in stain like no tomorrow leaving the guitar with darker sides than top. I have attempted using "pre-stain" treatments in the past that claim to even out blotchiness etc and have never had a positive result vs. just judiciously and carefully applying stain directly. Any thoughts on this?

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I am grateful for all responses, but I am only interested in results and techniques done by people WITHOUT spray equipment or rattle cans.

Thank you so much.

 

[moonweasel]

PS - I have no access to trial pieces of ash. I do have small areas under the pickguard to play with, not much. I intend to do a couple small trials there. (It's a Tele Deluxe, so lots of plastic to hide experients)

 

[Ole'Lefty]

My experience is mostly with walnut. The stain in Minwax pore filler, which I routinely depended upon, not only stayed in the pores; it stained the whole of the workpiece. I could increase the intensity with more coats of filler with stain or with plain stain. Just don't try mixing water based and oil based. I have never relied upon a sanding sealer because I filled and sealed with the oil based Minwax. CAUTION: I have never done a sunburst and there is a special technique for sealing and coating so that sealing left the possibility of bursting and then removing it and trying again. I am sorry I cannot think of a particular link-the pro sprayers or rubbed-in burst guys will have more to offer.

 

[emoney]

You also have the option of tinting the pore filler. I'm pretty sure someone around here used a Minwax oil based stain to do so, but you might want to wait for that person to weigh in with confirmation.

If the can says "stainable", then my experience is it's no issue staining after. As to a "test piece", if you're concerned it might be worth the effort to go by a Woodcraft or your local lumber yard and pick up a piece of Ash to play around with first.

 

[moonweasel]

Thank you both, Emoney I didn't know that Woodcraft had retail outlets, and I found one about an hour away. Thanks for that!

 

[emoney]

Be careful in there. It's all a "trap", having all those nice tools, bits of wood, etc. And we all know they're not the cheapest place in town. But still, that Jet 18" bandsaw by the front door.......hmmmm

 

[moonweasel]

hehehe,

I need a jointer so badly!!

 

[CherryBurstChaser]

OP: How's this project going?

 

[moonweasel]

Chugging along! I did 5 coats of satin on the neck, have about three coats of gloss on top of that only on the headstock. I went with Timbermate (#AMB25) Ash, Pine, Maple color. First time Ive ever used filler, but it wasn't bad at all. Actually enjoyed it. The key is to only do a small area at a time.

I have about three coats of wipe-on poly (gloss) on the body, holy cow was it FUN to do that first coat and see the color and grain of the wood pop. Great fun. I'm going to do light sanding every third coat since this stuff goes on so thin. I am letting it dry 24-36 hours between coats to make sure it is hard and dry before overcoating. Goal is 15 coats, but I dont know if Im that patient.

Thanks for asking.

 

[moonweasel]

Random note:

I didn't spec it this way, but my body from warmoth showed up as 1pc and a hair over 3 lbs. If you tap it with your finger it rings. High hopes!

 

[xSinner13x]

Random note:

I didn't spec it this way, but my body from warmoth showed up as 1pc and a hair over 3 lbs. If you tap it with your finger it rings. High hopes!

Spike and the crew over there are good for that.
their "Plain" woods beat the pants off some of the "Monster" tops I have seen here.

Getting a one piece though without specifying, go by a lotto ticket.

I have a SW/ash body currently on order, I am gonna stain and then fill, trying to achieve a "doghair" finish.

Still up on whether or not I will go plain, or colored.

 

[moonweasel]

That's cool that the 1pc is that rare when not speced. It was a pleasant surprise. Since this is my first guitar finish, I was hoping for a three piece knotty dog so I wouldnt feel bad if I ruined it. It's going well though, the wipe-on is VERY forgiving.

Can't tell you how tempted I was to stain mine. I really like Minwax's Sedona Red, the only downside is that I didn't have any ash to practice on. Good luck with yours! Here are a couple pics of mine, this is after 3 coats on the body (gloss) and 6 coats of satin on the neck (two gloss over that on the headstock)... I used the volute to define the end of the "gloss" area. The neck was a sale bin section at warmoth for $135.