Fake Tokai

[21stcsm]

Is this Tokai fake as hell?

It's a 2012 and it says "Les Paul Model".???????

and the Tokai logo looks extremely fake to me.

Even the shape is wickety wack?

Could an expert weigh in here?

https://reverb.com/item/7089738-tokai-tokai-single-cutaway-model-2012-usa-seller-2012

 

[xeizo]

I'm no expert but I've never heard of anything but Love Rock, looks like a Chibson to me, but who knows?

 

[elephantrider]

believe the 77 vintage tokai had les paul model on
the headstock. after the 80's they moved to either
love rock or reborn / reborn old. a 2012 version i
seriously doubt, would have les paul model for the
script. may not be fake, but that part was certainly
changed.

 

[21stcsm]

believe the 77 vintage tokai had les paul model on
the headstock. after the 80's they moved to either
love rock or reborn / reborn old. a 2012 version i
seriously doubt, would have les paul model for the
script. may not be fake, but that part was certainly
changed.

Yea,and the white control covers.

and I asked for pictures of the headstock and it says "Made in Japan" but the print looks suspect etc. It's not even a good copy.

No way in 2012 would they have "Les Paul" on it. Gibson is hyperlitigious and that is textbook trademark infringement

I'm calling SHENANIGANS

 

[elephantrider]

yup. didn't most mij models come with the nashville type bridges ? this one has the
slotted screw studs, so that may be another clue it's not original. i have a 2013
reborn old and it's meh #1. just gotta be careful on not getting a fake, like anything
else i guess.

..and agree, not possible for a 2012 to have that on the stock.

 

[21stcsm]

For the record... REVERB RULES. I called and spoke to a rep and he said they already had it flagged but he agreed it looked fake as #$(#($ and they would take action. I've called on a few counterfeits and they are always responsive, same with the "selling the guitar that's actually in somebody else's store" thing that Ebay largely ignores. Kudos to Reverb. I bet it will be gone soon.

 

[elephantrider]

nice. glad they took notice.

 

[bluesriffdev]

Other things to take notice of:

• Inaccurate headstock shape
• Can't quite tell but it looks like a nashville style bridge (Aren't all Tokai's no bushing ABR-1s?; i.e. post straight into the wood)
• Non-straight bridge humbucker
• Grey keystone knobs
• Crappy knobs (to go along with the other crappy plastic)

 

[Duane_the_tub]

I'm glad Reverb takes action in instances like that. EBay seems to hang with even obvious fraud as long as they can, hoping to make that commission.

 

[brokentoeswalker]

Was it this one ? really bad fake.

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338014323&icep_item=332448592967

 

[21stcsm]

Was it this one ? really bad fake.

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338014323&icep_item=332448592967

Same make DEFINITELY

That AWFUL headstock ... etc

 

[bluesriffdev]

Was it this one ? really bad fake.

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338014323&icep_item=332448592967

I don't know if it's the same listing as it's been listed as 'brand new', rather than a 2012 model, and I can't find the reverb listing (must have been taken down by now). But as said above, it's certainly done by the same people. They do list in the description that this guitar is not made in Japan but elsewhere (which it clearly isn't; no other Tokais outside of MIJ ones have two screw TRCs).

I can understand listing a guitar and not realising that it's actually a fake, especially with MIJ guitars as they're sort of niche and for the untrained eye, it can be hard to tell the specs; It would suck to get traded in a fake when you thought it was a real one. But if this listing is in fact a new guitar, it would imply that this music store is deliberately obtaining fakes, rather than innocently obtaining a fake second-hand one and selling it none-the-wiser.

 

[21stcsm]

I don't know if it's the same listing as it's been listed as 'brand new', rather than a 2012 model, and I can't find the reverb listing (must have been taken down by now). But as said above, it's certainly done by the same people. They do list in the description that this guitar is not made in Japan but elsewhere (which it clearly isn't; no other Tokais outside of MIJ ones have two screw TRCs).

I can understand listing a guitar and not realising that it's actually a fake, especially with MIJ guitars as they're sort of niche and for the untrained eye, it can be hard to tell the specs; It would suck to get traded in a fake when you thought it was a real one. But if this listing is in fact a new guitar, it would imply that this music store is deliberately obtaining fakes, rather than innocently obtaining a fake second-hand one and selling it none-the-wiser.

Yea, I agree.

And I reported to Reverb because I know they actually ACT on such complaints. My experience with Ebay otoh is that they are slow to do so if they do anything... that is one of the reason I avoid Ebay. Yes, I have bought a few guitars off Ebay and if it's a trusted seller (like Meestursparkle et al and others from this website), I'll pounce... iirc there was a problem with some fake Tokais showing up in Canada at legit dealers not too long ago.

One of the advantages of buying more "obscure" and less popular brands vs the BIG ONES is lower possibility of counterfeit and/or fraud ime. However, Tokai is starting to become better known imo here in the states and this brings with it... greater possibility of fakes. The MIJ buyer community (especially this website) is small enough and we support and educate each other, so we are a harder "nut to crack" but we may see more in the future.

Bolt on guitars are also easier to do fraudster stuff on ime like using a MI USA neck on a cheapo body and calling it a MIA Fender can fool a lot of people.

Caveat Emptor n' stuff

 

[Mikkkele]

Get a Japan made Tokai in your hands - they have an offshoot in China - and compare with your originals MiU. Then you can see and feel the differences. And you will wonder!


Some "mad" sellers want about 700,- bucks for a new MiC Tokai SG. Im-pos-sible for a M.i.J.
But read for yourself the SG-Wiki: https://solidguitar.fandom.com/wiki/All_Models
Is there a pendant site to SGs?

 

[paruwi]

Good to know after all the years....

 

[Jim_E]

LOL that Tokai is still for sale on Reverb "listed 8 years ago" lamo

 

[moreles]

That's one heck of a depressing guitar. Tokai rips off Gibson, and whoever made this genuinely terrible guitar ripped off Tokai. You don't need more than a split-second to see that repulsive soft-edged, goop-cornered finish to know that you're looking at a totally fake fake, but a totally genuine P.O.S. The excited, hyped-up description is just revolting.