Fading How fast???!!

HonestAl

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Back in June this year I treated myself to an R0. As a lefty in the UIK I've seen lots of ads for righties, but rarely anything for we southpaws. But one day I spotted what I thought (and still think) is a fabulous guitar. Apparently its Royal Teaburst. To me it was a really pleasant very pale sunburst with a quilt grain pattern more than a tight flame. Looked almost 'pre-faded' Love at first sight.
The description from the shop selling it was that it was VOS. When it arrived it very definitely wasn't VOS. So I was initially a little disappointed. Which lasted a whole 30 seconds or so :)

I normally keep it in a north facing room, so no direct sunlight, though the room does have an entire wall (facing due north) which is glazed. I'm really pleased with the guitar. I normally leave the strap attached and either wall hang it, or have it on a Quick Look stand. For no particular reason, a couple of days ago I removed the strap and was absolutely amazed at the amount of fading of the dye on the mahogany (made evident by the area around the neck strap pin which is normally beneath the strap. Just for fun I removed the switch ring too and, hey presto, very clear fading taking place over the 3 months I've had it. Worth noting this doesn't live in a window, and if it gets anywhere near the window, the window faces north. So

I'm absolutely not complaining, I bought it because I liked the semi faded look, and, from what I can see, give it a year or two and it'll have little or no burst left!

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Davey Rock

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Back in June this year I treated myself to an R0. As a lefty in the UIK I've seen lots of ads for righties, but rarely anything for we southpaws. But one day I spotted what I thought (and still think) is a fabulous guitar. Apparently its Royal Teaburst. To me it was a really pleasant very pale sunburst with a quilt grain pattern more than a tight flame. Looked almost 'pre-faded' Love at first sight.
The description from the shop selling it was that it was VOS. When it arrived it very definitely wasn't VOS. So I was initially a little disappointed. Which lasted a whole 30 seconds or so :)

I normally keep it in a north facing room, so no direct sunlight, though the room does have an entire wall (facing due north) which is glazed. I'm really pleased with the guitar. I normally leave the strap attached and either wall hang it, or have it on a Quick Look stand. For no particular reason, a couple of days ago I removed the strap and was absolutely amazed at the amount of fading of the dye on the mahogany (made evident by the area around the neck strap pin which is normally beneath the strap. Just for fun I removed the switch ring too and, hey presto, very clear fading taking place over the 3 months I've had it. Worth noting this doesn't live in a window, and if it gets anywhere near the window, the window faces north. So

I'm absolutely not complaining, I bought it because I liked the semi faded look, and, from what I can see, give it a year or two and it'll have little or no burst left!

View attachment 494365 View attachment 494366
Yes I've never really understood this either. Prs private stock and Gibson custom shop tend to have their dyes fade over time. Which I really don't get because I could take a can of minwax and wipe it on my guitar with no finish at all and it'll stay the same shade most of it's life. I find it outrageous to pay5k+ for a guitar that will just eventually be not as advertised. But 3 months?! That's crazy. I guess any and all sunlight would fade the colors but honestly I wouldn't know. Anytime I play my guitars is when I'm in a row with zero sunlight. I don't even try to block out sun it just happens to be a window with heavy curtain. I've played with the windows open a couple times, and every time I could feel the uv heat from the face of my acoustic and just scared me to death. All these shades of bursts originate from what Gibson calls factory burst I believe. All these different shades of bursts fading over the years. They all used to be a heavy sunburst. sunburst was the origin of all bursts except tobacco and silverburst. I believe anyway. But still that is just crazy. I wish they used uv protected stains. I only use minwax stains so I don't know about stuff like prs northern lights finish, but I know that the ones I use have never faded.
 

christopherJ

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Gibson does use fade resistant dyes in most other guitar lines. The original type dye did fade quite easily. Some have clamored for such an original finish and Gibson has obliged and charged a premium for the reissues.

I find it outrageous anyone would spend $5K+ on a guitar an not understand one of the selling points of said guitar.

Gibson has plenty of guitars that use fade-resistant dye. There is always M to M too and they will use whatever dye you want.
 

HonestAl

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Thanks for the comments guys. I’ll stress again I’m neither upset or surprised it’s faded, just fascinated how fast. I also have a historic 56 replica which I’ve owned since ‘99. The dye on the sides and back has all but vanished
 

EdmundGTP

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It is quite surprising just how quickly non-fade resistant dye will change color when exposed to sunlight. This is what just a few days worth of direct outdoor Arizona sunlight did to the Iced Tea burst of my Historic Makeover. Turns out you don't really have to pay extra for parts shadows.
 

VictorB

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My 2014 R8 has faded significantly.
 

Sct13

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They started using aniline dyes in 2013 on the backs ... not sure when they started applying aniline reds on the tops...

It’s the red component of that type of dye that fades

that said I noticed my 2013 cc#7 turn darker on top and fade to a reddish brown on the back ...

Also the amber will become less brilliant I have noticed on a few others...
 

Phil W

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You do know that 58 to 60 bursts faded too, right?
You've got a reissue where the aim is replication of the original guitar from the stated year and you are concerned that it is replicating the behaviour of an original guitar ... ? Hmmmmmm.
 

Dilver

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It is quite surprising just how quickly non-fade resistant dye will change color when exposed to sunlight. This is what just a few days worth of direct outdoor Arizona sunlight did to the Iced Tea burst of my Historic Makeover. Turns out you don't really have to pay extra for parts shadows.
Yeah, but you guys have a different sun in Arizona :) (Looks awesome BTW)
 

Torshalla

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I wonder why some toos fade and others get darker... is it due to the environment they are in or to how the die was applied? Or the type of die?
 

Sct13

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It’s the type of dye...

Remember that tho get the different colors ... like dark cherry. Tobacco Burst, and so on. These colors need to be mixed with other colors to get the shade or tint your looking for,, and it’s the reds that fade the most... like blue hardly fades, and mixed yellow or amber makes green ,,, so you can see what gives the famous green burst a green hue.
The aniline reds are completely gone...

I’m not sure why some get darker ... it might be that the reds are the only thing that fades and the only result are the blues come out... but it was still red...

I think there are mixed pigments in there not all the colors are aniline...
 

ARandall

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The clearcoat ambers over time, which is the only thing that can possibly make for darkening. Because for sure logic is dictating that you don't have more dye on there....nor can the colours get more vivid or add in more.
And you can often confuse 'darker' with 'duller'. When the richness of the colour fades maybe those parts of the tint that vanish are the ones more in the upper range of that colour.
 

MaxBoogie

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While I get it, that it’s nice to keep your guitar hanging on the wall so you can constantly admire it, nothing good ever happens to a guitar not kept in its case. It could be inadvertently knocked off the wall by a pet or a careless brushing up against it, or it can get damaged in a fire from smoke or water or the fire itself. Then of course there’s your issue that it fades more quickly under any kind of light, even if it’s not direct light. I want my guitars to stay as they are now for as long as they can, so the only time they are out of their cases is when I’m playing them.
 

Sct13

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Never.....

guitars are out on stands, some on the wall to keep out of the way, they are played almost daily. Non smoking home, grandkids are allowed to touch, therefore they never do... (boring grandpa stuff),

Fading or not is a fact of life... Hell ... Im fading .... so fk it ...

I bought a case queen, it was in there nearly a year, now it’s checking.... so go figure...
 

Airhead

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I wonder if my '50 standard tobacco burst will fade (not CS). I love a much light brown on sides.
 

captdan61

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It is quite surprising just how quickly non-fade resistant dye will change color when exposed to sunlight. This is what just a few days worth of direct outdoor Arizona sunlight did to the Iced Tea burst of my Historic Makeover. Turns out you don't really have to pay extra for parts shadows.
I also live in Arizona and play shows that are both indoors and outdoors. I had a 2014 R9 and notice color change on the neck back and sides. Which faded from the red to more of a reddish brown. But i attributed that more to handling and sweat than sunlight. And i am only beginning to see those changes in my R9 vos. Should i be looking for fading? What i expect is for the clear coat to amber which will darken not lighten the guitars color. It is bourbon burst.
 

monty john

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I have a 13 R9 and it sits when not in use, in a north facing chair with reflected light....it was a washed cherry now its just plain washed no cherry no where....
 

EdmundGTP

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I also live in Arizona and play shows that are both indoors and outdoors. I had a 2014 R9 and notice color change on the neck back and sides. Which faded from the red to more of a reddish brown. But i attributed that more to handling and sweat than sunlight. And i am only beginning to see those changes in my R9 vos. Should i be looking for fading? What i expect is for the clear coat to amber which will darken not lighten the guitars color. It is bourbon burst.
The dye used in your R9 by Gibson could be a little more fade resistant than the dye used on my guitar when I had it refinished at Historic Makeovers. Hard to know for sure. Can't say I'm really an expert on dye fading but generally speaking, but Sct13 covered it pretty well above. The red colors are the most prone to fading and washing out over time. I would not expect the "dark" areas of your burst to get much darker as dyes fade. Yes the clear coat will amber over time, and the lighter areas of the burst will get a bit more yellowed, but probably not enough to transform your bourbon burst into more of a dark tobacco burst. I'd only "look" for fading if it's something you're concerned with, and even then, there's only SO much you can do to avoid it. It's just the nature of the materials used. We all pay extra for a stab at historical finish authenticity, and fading is what comes along with it. I dig it ,personally. I left my R8 out in the sun on purpose to wash out some of the red (what you see above) and was more than happy with the result.
 

guitarvoodoo

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My lefty R0 from '97 has faded very little even though it has spent a couple of hundred hours out in the summer sun to get some fade. It's a Tobacco Burst. A little of the red tone has faded, but a tobacco is so dark that not much will ever happen. The high gloss when she was new has been replaced by a more matt, vintage look now though. Just from being used.
Almost all parts are vintage from late 50s to '61 including electronics. The pickups in the pic have been replaced by real PAFs. And she lives in a '57-'58 Lifton Caligirl case.
Did you know that there only THREE known original lefty bursts in the world? Amazing.
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