Counting the Budokans...

musicfan57

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The Budokan is seriously one of the best Lester's I've ever encountered and not because I have one. I'm 52 I don't try to impress myself anymore much less anyone else so this isn't one of those cause I got it, it is the best thing since sliced bread kind of things...it really is an amazing piece!

That's when I seen KISS for the first time in early 1979, Judas Priest was opening act! Ace is in concert at the Hard Rock Live Rocksino in Ohio this coming Saturday and I am trying to find someone to go with me to it!:jam:
I'm with you on this. Epiphone really knocked it out of the park on this one.
Played mine again last night for a couple of hours, still amazed at the sustain it has.

Unfortunately for me, I didn't get to see KISS until 1983 and didn't know
until I got to the concert that Ace wasn't there. I was mad. But I did
get to see the original line up 3 times when they reunited.
Saw Ace a few years back at the House of Blues. I was drunk, but I think
he was sober, but I was too drunk to know for sure. lol
 

93LPStudio

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Ok. Got the parts from Grover today. They sent me a full set of Pearloid buttons, ferrels/collars, plastic washers, metal washers, friction washers and screws. All I needed were the ferrels/collars. Yes, my diagnosis of the problem was correct. The new ferrels/collars fit tight with no slop. I used all my original parts except the ferrels/collars. The new buttons are not as nice as the originals for sure. The new screws were not nickel either. But, like I said I only needed the ferrel/collar. They work and feel like they are supposed to now. Next, I'm going to swap the 14:1 tuners for 18:1. Grover makes the identical tuner in 18:1. They also make the milk bottle ones in nickel as well. I think these are the more correct tuner, but you may be able to see an impression in the headstock from the originals as the milk bottles have a smaller footprint. So there you have it. Just contact Grover for the correct ferrels/collars and your tuners will be like you want.
Just want to thank you for taking it upon yourself to find what was the issue with these tuners and for taking the lead in contacting Grover. I contacted Grover and although they didn't have the replacement ferrels/collars in stock they assured me that they would take care of me. Took about a month but they came in the mail few weeks ago now. Not wanting to replace the original pearloid buttons with the plain looking replacements that Grover sent I seperated the originals and installed them onto the replacement ferrels/collars. ALL, absolutely ALL the slop is gone and the tuners do Not slip at all. Absolutely the only issue besides the wrong size pup rings concerning these Les Paul Customs from the factory. Thanks! Thanks! Thanks!:applause::applause::applause:
 

rtcook

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You're welcome. Glad it worked out for you. I got the correct rings from Epiphone. But, I put them on like Ace had them.
 

93LPStudio

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You're welcome. Glad it worked out for you. I got the correct rings from Epiphone. But, I put them on like Ace had them.
When I got 185 from XTN he included a correct size rings from Classic Ax in Nashville, first thing I changed out as matter of fact. Those ferrels/collars are a lot bigger than stock ones were as well. Amazing the difference it made.
 

93LPStudio

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By the way RTCook...did you install that wiring harness you mentioned a few threads back? If so I missed it and curious as to your thoughts on it.:thumb:
 

rtcook

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Wiring harness is installed. But, have an issue I need to sort out. One of the wires must be touching as I get alot of noise from it. Haven't had time to diagnose it. Will let you know though.
 

rtcook

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Ace installed his rings like this. The neck is a neck ring but installed 180 degrees opposite. Taper is towards the bridge. The middle ring is actually a neck ring in the proper orientation. Taper towards the neck. This arrangement allowed more room under the strings so you are not hitting the pickup with your pick. Since Ace did not actually use these pickups, the pickups are adjusted down to the top of the ring for maximum clearance.
 

93LPStudio

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Ace installed his rings like this. The neck is a neck ring but installed 180 degrees opposite. Taper is towards the bridge. The middle ring is actually a neck ring in the proper orientation. Taper towards the neck. This arrangement allowed more room under the strings so you are not hitting the pickup with your pick. Since Ace did not actually use these pickups, the pickups are adjusted down to the top of the ring for maximum clearance.
That is interesting as I never knew that he had done that with the neck pup ring!
 

93LPStudio

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Just for posterity and for those that have not dealt with this issue of the sloppiness of the tuners on these Budokans, or at least some of them. Here are a few pics of the ferrels/collars, stock/replacement. Well worth the "fix" as mine stay's in tune now, and possibly a minor tweak of the button to get her into pitch after days of sitting in the case. Please excuse the bad pics!

Stock on the left/Grover replacement on the right. You can see the difference in the middle hole, the replacement has tighter tolerances. It is also bigger as you can see.


Stock on the left and replacement on the right. Although pic is blurry but you can see the size difference as well. Once placed on the tuner shaft you realize this little difference made a world of difference.
 

Parasite68

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So I wonder what the deal is with this Budokan. Looks legit and comes with the COA. I wonder why the guy said he got it from Ace. He says he has two he got from Ace One signed and one unsigned. COA has a number out of 1000. :hmm:
I personally own a signed one from Ace directly. The ones he got were only abut 25 or so and he signed them all. They are not included in the 1000 and the coa is different it mentions that it is a specially signed guitar with no number out of 1000, but should have the serial number on it., I'm confident the seller is BSing you about the unsigned one coming from Ace because it didn't. It still may be a legit budokan.

When Ace sold them thru his website he sold them for $1700.00 when they were still on the market for 699 usd. Numbered of course.
 

rtcook

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Take a picture of the bottom of those ferrels and post so people can see why there was so much slop. It's that's connection that causes the slop.

Just for posterity and for those that have not dealt with this issue of the sloppiness of the tuners on these Budokans, or at least some of them. Here are a few pics of the ferrels/collars, stock/replacement. Well worth the "fix" as mine stay's in tune now, and possibly a minor tweak of the button to get her into pitch after days of sitting in the case. Please excuse the bad pics!

Stock on the left/Grover replacement on the right. You can see the difference in the middle hole, the replacement has tighter tolerances. It is also bigger as you can see.


Stock on the left and replacement on the right. Although pic is blurry but you can see the size difference as well. Once placed on the tuner shaft you realize this little difference made a world of difference.
 

93LPStudio

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To late I didn't think to do that! All I know is they are perfect with this fix. So glad again you persued Grover!:thumb:
 

XTN

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To late I didn't think to do that! All I know is they are perfect with this fix. So glad again you persued Grover!:thumb:
The replacement ones have less turn play.

I urge Budokan owners to contact Chuck at Grover chuck at grotto dot com and ask for replacements.
 

hogdaddy

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The replacement ones have less turn play.

I urge Budokan owners to contact Chuck at Grover chuck at grotto dot com and ask for replacements.
I got my fix yesterday. Thanks for the heads up~:dude:
 

musicfan57

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The replacement ones have less turn play.

I urge Budokan owners to contact Chuck at Grover chuck at grotto dot com and ask for replacements.
I did exactly that, and in one week I had the replacements in the mail. Got them yesterday.
Thank you so much for the heads up on this one.
Now, all I need is patience and better eye sight to make the swap!! lol
 

XTN

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A public 'Thank You' to rtcook who dealt with Grover and got them to offer up a solution. It was a glaring defect that had been angering me since day 1 of my first Budokan. And with my second.
 

rtcook

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And a public 'Thank You' to rtcook who dealt with Grover and got them to offer up a solution. It was a glaring defect that had been angering me since day 1 of my first Budokan. And with my second. [/QUOTE]


You are most welcome and I sincerely appreciate the recognition.
 

NRVPaul

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Just called Chuck at Grover today and he is sending my fix out!

 




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