and i can't say i told you so... because that's just being a dick.

Kamen_Kaiju

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That's part of a sad truth that women hate to hear.

They have a "value",...and they can de-value themselves pretty easily.

Truth hurts but honest guys will often admit it.

The only guys I've ever known that want a used up chick is guys who have a fetish for used up chicks. (which totally exists and is a real thing.)

Most guys,....eh,...not really.

They don't want doe eyed virgins but not many want ex-(wannabe) porn stars with 3 kids and 2 ex-husbands either. :laugh2: There's no value there other then maybe her ability to give good head.

...and good head isn't worth giving up your life for. :laugh2:


..it's a funny world we live in.
 

freebyrd 69

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I've heard that complaint before. Why take a woman that's been married and has kids by some other dude?

She's already done the marriage thing
She's already done the kids thing

There's no real 'new experiences' to be had as a couple. All the life milestones she's already done.

So if you have a kid with her and it's your First Kid it's going to be very special TO YOU,...she's already been there done that bought the T-Shirt.

Guys are 'entitled' to first time experiences too. We're not backup plans to pick up the pieces and be a paycheck to her failed decisions and a surrogate father to their brood.


....is at least the complaints I've heard.

Guys want romance and first time experiences too. Why would you consciously pick a Women who's already done it all?

You'll never share those experiences together, really. She's done.

You'll always be second fiddle to HER kids anyway.

Just seems like a losing proposition.

Like buying a racehorse whose racing days are over. Why do it?

It all depends on your situation. I love kids. I am 47 now, and I have one child with my ex. She had one with another guy, you can see my previous post in this thread for that explanation.

Anyway, Brooke is 4 1/2 now, and I have made her issues known on this forum before. She is a little angel. My little angel. We have fun, laugh, and play in our own way, and she is non-verbal...autism, epilepsy, and cerebral palsy. As much as I love her, there are simply some things I cannot and may never be able to do/share with her. A live football game, playing sports, board games, normal "playing", even going to the movies, etc..

My girlfriend has an 8 yr. old daughter. Very well behaved, and she doesn't put up with any crap. She pays to send her to a private school. She is a very smart kid, with a great sense of humor, and I enjoy her very much. I have my daughter every other weekend, but see hers almost on a daily basis. Her dad is in the picture, and a decent guy. He has accepted me with no problem, probably because his daughter speaks highly of me to him. I know my boundaries, and I'm not trying to be her dad.

My gf and I have had many discussions about parenting style, and we mesh very well. As long as you are working as a team, things can be great. It is very rewarding to me to spend time with her daughter. I have taken her to a Michigan hockey game, movies, boating, bowling. She even likes getting into my fantasy football team. :laugh2:

My gf is a great woman. I won't get into why it didn't work out with her ex, who she has been divorced from for 5 years, but suffice it to say, I don't blame HER. I am only the second guy to meet her daughter since her divorce. She is very picky about that, and understandably so.

Dating a divorced woman with a child is not a bad thing, or a doomed situation. At my age, I would be more scared of a woman who has never been married or had kids. It's all about communication and being on the same page. It's rare to find, but it's out there, and can be very rewarding when you find it.
 

Kamen_Kaiju

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sure, whatever works for folks.

Divorced women seem pretty bitter and man-hating. Damaged.

...seems an odd choice. But whatever works for folks.

Hell I'm damaged too. I'm on no pedestal.
 

Harmony

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sure, whatever works for folks.

Divorced women seem pretty bitter and man-hating. Damaged.

...seems an odd choice. But whatever works for folks.

Hell I'm damaged too. I'm on no pedestal.

Get real Mal!

I've met more screwed up divorced men than I have women. Look at this forum for one!

Geez!

What about the many men who are divorced with kids? Are they damaged goods? Used goods? Hell no! Neither are the one without kids, unless they allow it to be.

Plenty of women single or divorced who have to take on their kids too. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Women have the same problems as men listed above.

Sometimes it is the men who don't parent well either, especially if they only get part time custody/visits. Excuses I hear? Because as they are not the one having them full time, they don't want to upset them, rock the boat and want the quality time with them.

I can tell you stories that I hear from the men's mouth right here, but it wouldn't be worth it, because at the end of the day, some people want to only see tunnel vision and/or have others agree with them.

I am sure there are fathers here who have just as a hard of a problem with their own kids, whether they are living with mum and a step father or their wife has taken on his kids in their own home.

Some people need to step out of the box. Some people need to to lose that chip off their shoulder (not singling anyone out) otherwise life will be full of misery and find themself aging alone in life. Also could lose a potential great relationship with a woman when you meet one.




Divorced, non screwed up female rant over :)
 

allwheelz

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I dealing with this right now in a round about way.....it recently hit home when my nephew "on my gf's side" came over, and toppled over my 60 gallon fish tank, on my brand new carpet. I believe the tank fully filled weighed around 450 lbs...he's damn lucky, that would've squished him. Simple case of neglect and lack of respect.....gf said he just pointed at it and it fell over??? Then had the balls to say it was my fault...I was working my 11 hr job at the time....my patience is wearing very thin for stupid people and the stupid things they do. A 60 gallon fish tank is not a jungle jim stupid......60 gallon fish tanks don't fall over by pointing at them stupid....don't bring your kids over to my house and then let them run free an not watch them...my house is not kid proof, I've already done that stage, my kids know better. Sorry, kind of a sore subject for me right now, and I bet its gonna take about a year to get over this one. Lack of parenting, everyone is a winner, there are no losers.....this is the generation we are about to deal with....buckle up kids...the sh*t is about to hit the fan.
 

hecube

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I dealing with this right now in a round about way.....it recently hit home when my nephew "on my gf's side" came over, and toppled over my 60 gallon fish tank, on my brand new carpet. I believe the tank fully filled weighed around 450 lbs...he's damn lucky, that would've squished him. Simple case of neglect and lack of respect.....gf said he just pointed at it and it fell over??? Then had the balls to say it was my fault...I was working my 11 hr job at the time....my patience is wearing very thin for stupid people and the stupid things they do. A 60 gallon fish tank is not a jungle jim stupid......60 gallon fish tanks don't fall over by pointing at them stupid....don't bring your kids over to my house and then let them run free an not watch them...my house is not kid proof, I've already done that stage, my kids know better. Sorry, kind of a sore subject for me right now, and I bet its gonna take about a year to get over this one. Lack of parenting, everyone is a winner, there are no losers.....this is the generation we are about to deal with....buckle up kids...the sh*t is about to hit the fan.

I never curse but this kind of thing would have unleashed the fooking fury within me.
 

Bobby Mahogany

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I agree with many here who have pointed out that people don't change that much.
That is, unless THEY want to change.

An incident like that could constitute a trigger point for change.
Make it known that if someone is not liking where "this" is going,
they can make changes and you can help the process.
Other than that, there's not much you can do.

It's for you to know where your happiness lies.
 

tazzboy

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It's time to leave bro. She will not discipline her kids which should have been a red flag right there from the started. These Kids are going to be nothing but trouble until they decide to straight out even if that means a long period in jail.
 

Actinic

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Pay me now, or pay me later.

Or, like the femme fatale would say, "Play me now or play me later, but either way, you will be played."

Is the OP seeking our advice or has he made up his mind already? Womenz have wiles, and trust me, her two children are way more important than a boyfriend or non-biological husband. You will be had and manipulated.
 

Kamen_Kaiju

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Get real Mal!

like my last sentence said this applies to me as well.

I've been married I've had kids. Were I ever to do it again with a Woman who has never done either it would be special to her as it's her first time.

Me not so much.

That's just life. It's not fair.

By her choosing me instead of a guy who has never been married or had kids, she's denying herself the feeling of 2 people getting married and having a kid for the first time together.

So I'm damaged goods. And I've been told that flat out by multiple females. One even said I have no business dating at all since I have kids.

It's only fair to think the same thing in reverse. A Divorced woman with a kid or two is not the same 'catch' as a Woman has never been married or had a kid. And I'm not alone in thinking that.

Hey if 2 people love each other none of that stuff matters. But from a cold and clinical point of view with no feelings involved, people have different 'dating value' based on their past and or baggage. It's just how it is or seems to be. I'm not throwing out my own personal philosophy it's just what I've observed in what I've seen and heard and how I've been treated.

A man/woman with a ton of baggage and past history isn't the same value as someone with none of that stuff. Purely on the dating scene where people are sized up and tossed aside left and right in seconds. Sometimes even for banal and trivial reasons.

Doesn't mean they aren't good people or don't deserve love or anything like that.

Basically it's just a hard cold world out there and no one really gives a sh*t about anyone but themselves. Given the choice between a stable person with no baggage as a partner or someone with a lot of baggage,..most people will choose the 'No Baggage' option. It's easier.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjZJqh4IX7w[/ame]

"I'm looking for the least possible amount of responsibility."

It's why so many Women don't even mention they have a kid until the third or fifth date. Because they know most guys would bail after the first date.

Not every guy,..but the majority.
 

Thumpalumpacus

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I've heard that complaint before. Why take a woman that's been married and has kids by some other dude?

She's already done the marriage thing
She's already done the kids thing

There's no real 'new experiences' to be had as a couple. All the life milestones she's already done.

So if you have a kid with her and it's your First Kid it's going to be very special TO YOU,...she's already been there done that bought the T-Shirt.

Guys are 'entitled' to first time experiences too. We're not backup plans to pick up the pieces and be a paycheck to her failed decisions and a surrogate father to their brood.


....is at least the complaints I've heard.

Guys want romance and first time experiences too. Why would you consciously pick a Women who's already done it all?

You'll never share those experiences together, really. She's done.

You'll always be second fiddle to HER kids anyway.

Just seems like a losing proposition.

Like buying a racehorse whose racing days are over. Why do it?

Compares women to livestock, wonders at his own relationships ...

Sorry, Mal, but I gotta call BS when I see it.
 

Harmony

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like my last sentence said this applies to me as well.

I've been married I've had kids. Were I ever to do it again with a Woman who has never done either it would be special to her as it's her first time.

Me not so much.

That's just life. It's not fair.

By her choosing me instead of a guy who has never been married or had kids, she's denying herself the feeling of 2 people getting married and having a kid for the first time together.

So I'm damaged goods. And I've been told that flat out by multiple females. One even said I have no business dating at all since I have kids.

It's only fair to think the same thing in reverse. A Divorced woman with a kid or two is not the same 'catch' as a Woman has never been married or had a kid. And I'm not alone in thinking that.

Hey if 2 people love each other none of that stuff matters. But from a cold and clinical point of view with no feelings involved, people have different 'dating value' based on their past and or baggage. It's just how it is or seems to be. I'm not throwing out my own personal philosophy it's just what I've observed in what I've seen and heard and how I've been treated.

A man/woman with a ton of baggage and past history isn't the same value as someone with none of that stuff. Purely on the dating scene where people are sized up and tossed aside left and right in seconds. Sometimes even for banal and trivial reasons.

Doesn't mean they aren't good people or don't deserve love or anything like that.

Basically it's just a hard cold world out there and no one really gives a sh*t about anyone but themselves. Given the choice between a stable person with no baggage as a partner or someone with a lot of baggage,..most people will choose the 'No Baggage' option. It's easier.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjZJqh4IX7w

"I'm looking for the least possible amount of responsibility."

It's why so many Women don't even mention they have a kid until the third or fifth date. Because they know most guys would bail after the first date.

Not every guy,..but the majority.

Yes you did say that you were yourself, but you are grouping women together again as the same. Just because you may experience it, doesn't mean that all divorced women are like that.

I sure would never group all divorced men the same. Any man for that matter. It is the person, not all men or all women. Some men and women become a better person in fact from a divorce or broken long term relationship.

I know I have become a better person/woman from my broken marriage/divorce and even with all the nasty crap I went through.

I so appreciate a good man much more than I would have done prior to that marriage. The good things he does for me, the better ways I am treated and I sure do not care about the petty things that once irked me. I came to realize what was petty and what was more important in a relationship.

I find that with a lot of men after a divorce or long term relationship too. In fact many say the 2nd marriage was much better and much happier..last longer too. Many people get married young and it doesn't last, find themselves as a divorcee. Married again later on and matured somewhat. We learn from our mistakes or at least we try to.

No one is damaged unless they let it consume them. That negativity shows through, believe me and will ruin future relationships or won't be so attractive to the opposite sex.

I know that I went through tough times after my divorce but I stayed single because of it. I needed to be ready, emotionally. I didn't hate men, I just needed to get my self esteem back, which I did. Anyone can go through that, even if never married. It happens to anyone, regardless of gender or married.

Personally, now because I am way past my twenties, a man who has been in a long term relationship is far more appealing than one that has not. It at least tells me that they can commit and I don't have to deal with petty things that one has not experienced before.
But at the end of the day, I don't judge whether they have been married or not, kids or not, it is the person and how they treat me. Everything else I can work with, because if you end up loving each other, you got to do what you have to, to make it work.

If there are things that is a problem and can't be fixed..and causing misery, then it is time to move on.
 

Harmony

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Olds..sorry for the derail there..

I don't know if this is just a vent or whether you truly have had enough and looking for some validation on your issues. Personally I can feel the angst in your writing and whether you feel better today about things, it is obviously eating you up.

My advice is, if you haven't already, have a sit down and serious conversation without arguing with her. Let it be known this is one serious talk and that you cannot tolerate it anymore.
Tell her how you feel..put cards on table. If possible don't try and put all blame on her, because as you well know, no matter our parenting, our kids could well do something stupid and/or become little brats. What she does is not helping rather than her being the blame for it, so to speak. Say you understand why she protects or helps them, they are her kids, but without putting more discipline in the house, she is enabling rather than helping them. They need to grow up and take responsibilities.

If things cannot improve and she doesn't change things somehow..even some compromise to make things better...then it will be time to go. Nothing is worse than being around a place that makes you miserable and drain you out.

You can only do your best at making it work and tolerate as much as you can, with or without her help.

Whatever your decision, I wish you the best. I feel for you, it really is a hard position to be in.
 

KP11520

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Anyone see Olds442? We probably scared him off! :shock:

All I can say is: Healthy belief systems and behavior increases our chances for a happier life. It's NEVER too late to pursue them. But it is up to each of us to do what it takes to do that. Nobody else!

If everybody ante'd up willingly, can you imagine how good life could be? :fingersx:

Healthy is the new COOL! Well it should be anyway! :cool:
 

Thumpalumpacus

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Anyone see Olds442? We probably scared him off! :shock:

All I can say is: Healthy belief systems and behavior increases our chances for a happier life. It's NEVER too late to pursue them. But it is up to each of us to do what it takes to do that. Nobody else!

If everybody ante'd up willingly, can you imagine how good life could be? :fingersx:

Healthy is the new COOL! Well it should be anyway! :cool:

Indeed. I am responsible for my own happiness, and I will not shop that out to anyone else ... doing so is a fool's errand.
 

KP11520

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Indeed. I am responsible for my own happiness, and I will not shop that out to anyone else ... doing so is a fool's errand.

Isn't it amazing how many years it takes for so many of us to learn that! And many..... Never!

Keep on Keepin' On! :cool:
 

chupe442

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1- this is your problem.
or
2- this is not your problem.

Seems you have stuck this one out for a few years more than you should have and are having a difficult time drawing a line in the sand for when that line will be crossed to pick up and move on. Its difficult to be in a one sided relationship and at some point you need to decide its worth. Its also difficult to leave when it is apparent that the **** storm is happening and you dont want to leave her high and dry with the mess she has made for herself either.
 

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