Amps without effects loops. Noob Question.

[redben10]

I wanted to get a Carvin VT16 for Christmas. This amp has no effects loop so what difference would it make if i just put the effects in front of the amp? Good/Bad or should I look at different amps? Thanks!

 

[jerrypilot]

I guess it's a matter of taste . Overdrive , distortion , wah etc should go in the front of the amp . Time based effects , delay , chorus etc can sound more present through the loop , after the preamp section . You can put all your effects into the front of the amp ; some people believe that effects loops suck tone . Personally , I can't be bothered with faffing with loops so it all goes through the front - my amp doesn't have an effects loop .

 

[redben10]

Ah, ok thanks!

 

[Reeko]

I guess it's a matter of taste . Overdrive , distortion , wah etc should go in the front of the amp . Time based effects , delay , chorus etc can sound more present through the loop , after the preamp section . You can put all your effects into the front of the amp ; some people believe that effects loops suck tone . Personally , I can't be bothered with faffing with loops so it all goes through the front - my amp doesn't have an effects loop .

Only problem with delays prior to the Preamp......
If you use your amp for both clean and distortion, the delay will be way to present (read as too much delay repeats etc) when distortion is on due to the gain (if it is set to sound good clean).

In other words, the amount of delay heard varies with the amount of gain after the delay.

If you run it in the loop, the delay (and reverb) sounds consistent when switching from a high gain to clean .

In my mind, delay and reverb sound bad prior to gain. I always run it last in the loop (prefered) OR run them in front of a clean amp.

 

[mmd]

i have both kinds of amps. my amps without a loop get everything in front, and i use the amp clean. amps that are multi channel, where i use the amp gain for my distorted sound, i use the loop for time based effects.

here are a couple rig examples that i have to use:

1. my vibro champ get used with an old roland GP-8 rack unit. it and the head are rackmounted the roland goes into input one, and i get all my effects from it. the amp is used to amplify the effects.

2. my egnater tweaker has a loop. it is one channel so i get a cool tone and then put my boss ME-70 in the loop for time based effects. sometimes i set the egnater to sound like a "vintage" amp, and then i run the ME-70 in front and get all my sounds from it. then the amp is used to amplify the effects.

3. my rivera S120 has a true stereo effects loop. i use it with multiple cabinets in a wet/dry set up. i will take my rack, which uses a digitech quad (4 channel effects processor), and plug the effects into the loop. depending on which patch i select for the channel i am using (clean or distorted), the patch will send effects to either amp A, amp B, or both. for example, for my clean sound i will use a chorus, a reverb and a slight tape delay. in this case the chorus and reverb are routed to both power amps while the delay is sent to amp B.

the carvin vintage 16 is a nice amp. if you intend on using a lot of effects with it, i would suggest you run a set up like example 1.

 

[chef]

If you use a looper an fx loop is great because you can still run you loops and swithch to a gain channel and not be running the loop through that.

 

[Big John]

Another option is to utilize the cab-voiced line out on the back of the VT16, run that into a line level stereo effects unit, and then into a pair of powered P.A. speakers (QSC K10's, or whatever). Then you'd have a Wet-Dry-Wet rig that would probably blow you away.

 

[Mr Insane]

Even with my amps that have effects loops, everything goes in front.

 

[nauc]

good article

Back to Basics: Using Effects Pedals, Part 1

bunch of other good stuff

http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyle/ProductSpotlight/Tone-Tips/

 

[Midnight Blues]

Everything in front worked for many, many years and by many a great player.

 

[mikethebumperman]

Quick question... will your affects be a multi affects pedal? If yes and you plan on using that for all your core tones (clean, od, distortion, fuzz), then going through the front is how you would likely go.

If you are patching individual modulation boxes and switching between your amp's clean and dirty channel, you will notice a pronounced increase in affect levels as you drive your gain up.

If that becomes a problem, you do MAY not have to sell your amp. I'm not familiar with solid state, but in tube amps like the Orange Tiny Terror, many people have an amp tech add an affects loop. Depending on your area, the cost should be less than $250. Just know that your warranty will be voided.

 

[JW123]

I run everything in front of my Triple Rec, always have and probably always will.

Wireless-Tuner-Wah-Distortion-Distortion-Phaser-Whammy-Delay

Ive actually put my Whammy-Delay in the loop but still like it out front, plus its less wires to run.

 

[GitFiddle]

I have one amp with an effects loop. I ran a CE-5 and DD-3 into the loop and the rest in the front. The extra cords from the pedal board to the amp were a pain. The CE-5 always sounded like crap in the loop. It always sounded overdriven and distorted. I moved everything to the front of the amp and have been very happy since. Plus the pedal board is just as portable to the other two old Fender amps with no loops.

 

[Big John]

GitFiddle brings up a good point, and that is that a lot of amps out in the world don't digest certain pedals in the loop very well. It's because those loops are running at a hotter level than those pedals were designed for. One nifty fix that I've found to get around this is a custom box made by Bruce Egnater. It knocks down the loop to instrument level and then boosts it back up for the return to the amp. He charged me $150 for mine...

 

[SteveGangi]

I wanted to get a Carvin VT16 for Christmas. This amp has no effects loop so what difference would it make if i just put the effects in front of the amp? Good/Bad or should I look at different amps? Thanks!

I've been doing that for decades, using a Carvin (and other makes) myself. It doesn't hurt anything, though some people prefer to put some efects to be in the loop. I forget which effects types they like to "loop".

 

[chef]

I have one amp with an effects loop. I ran a CE-5 and DD-3 into the loop and the rest in the front. The extra cords from the pedal board to the amp were a pain. The CE-5 always sounded like crap in the loop. It always sounded overdriven and distorted. I moved everything to the front of the amp and have been very happy since. Plus the pedal board is just as portable to the other two old Fender amps with no loops.

I am in the same boat, one amp with a loop and one without. The one with the loop gets along much better with my DD and looper in the loop, and everything else out in front.

I just made a snake with all the cables, loop send and return into one of this type of sheathing: PET Polyester Expandable Braided Sleeving, Halar Braided Sleeving, braided tubing, weaving, braiding, abrasion protection, clean cut - BuyHeatShrink.com

I also made a power snake for a few OneSpots. I should just get a better power supply though.

When I use my other amp, I just use a regular cable and quickly repatch the DD and looper to the end of the chain. I actually might make a little patch panel to go on the back of my board so I can just jumper it in this situation.

Anyhow, it's pretty hassle free and works for what I need.

 

[GitFiddle]

...
I just made a snake with all the cables, loop send and return into one of this type of sheathing: PET Polyester Expandable Braided Sleeving, Halar Braided Sleeving, braided tubing, weaving, braiding, abrasion protection, clean cut - BuyHeatShrink.com

...

Lol, I did the exact same thing. Had me a big effects loop snake. I even made two of them at different lengths, depending on the gig. Now I have a couple rolls of that stuff left over.

 

[chef]

Lol, I did the exact same thing. Had me a big effects loop snake. I even made two of them at different lengths, depending on the gig. Now I have a couple rolls of that stuff left over.

Thats the way to go. I zip tie it a couple of feet from the ends and then loosely braid the cables to make it all neat so they are not just flopping around everywhere.

The more I think about it, the more a little patch box would be cool on my board It would have 3 jacks

1. To amp Front end <-- This would be the end of my non loop effects
2. From Loop Send <--- This would go into my first loop effect
3. To Loop Return <-- This would come from my last loop effect

For my non loop amp, I would patch 1 to 2 and then use 3 into the front of the amp.