A teacher's view

[KSG_Standard]

Obama's aunt lives here in the States. She was DEPORTED in 2004...she failed to follow the law and stayed put in the People's Republic of Mass, where she was protected from the evil laws. She doesn't work, she lives in Gov't housing, has medicaid, food stamps and lives a pretty good life...at the expense of American tax payers. She has no skills and no plans to work, she was just granted asylum and permanent resident status. Why would she be granted asylum?

And typical of Progressive politicians, President Obama doesn't help her with money or housing, he let's OTHER people pay her way...You know, "share the wealth"...OTHER people's wealth.

 

[CenCalPlayer]

And I still say that most of the violent crime problems are drug related. Yeah, there's the whole "leeches on the economy and social services" thing, but what about that violent crime problem? Doesn't anyone want to discuss that?

Even in periods where the illegal immigration problems were superfluous, the drugs just kept pouring in, and violent crime with them. How far do we stick our heads into the sand before we gag, choke, and die?

I'll tell you what...why don't you move to our neck of the woods and see first hand the crime....it is NOT all drug related in the slightest....murders, rapes, tagging, car theft, home invasions, shop lifting, identify theft.....you name it, we got it in the illegal immigrant population. California's prison population is bulging with illegals who are committing serious crimes.....the gangs are a real problem as well.....

Sorry River, but it's not those of us that are calling for some serious action to be taken who have our heads in the sand on this....drugs are a real problem, no argument there, but they are only on piece of the mess we are getting because of the illegals....no other country on this planet would allow 12-20 million people to illegally invade their country...why? Because they know the problems we are experiencing are what happens if you do....this country had better get a serious dose of self preservation pretty damn quick or the problem may become irreversible....or worse yet, there is going to be some blood shed that no one wants....time to start growing up.

 

[standard man]

Thanks for the read man. I outta show this to my grandpa. He would love it!

 

[JMV]

You know that is rather amusing. I was at Home Depot earlier today and saw a group of about 8 "workers" in their normal place. Then up drove a tricked out Escalade and the driver locked up and joined the group. I would be so easy for INS to drop by or the Sheriffs. The only problem is we have so many Russians, Ukrainians and assorted "refugees" that the county is talking about letting 240 deputies go, because we need to support all of the newly arrived welfare cases. That will mean no patrols and no investigations of misdemeanors. I need to start the process for a CCW permit.

What's interesting is that the Home Depot at which I worked was always staffed with a LEO, typically a constable driving around in the parking lot in a golf cart. The purpose of that? I'll never know. It certainly wasn't to make arrests or issue citations.

Mind you, this was Austin. Typical Texas stereotypes need not apply there, bt it was happening.

 

[River]

So you don't think we could close down the border if we moved our military and/or National Guards down there? <snip>

No, I know we couldn't. Because the border is not that simple, and not just that line on the southern end of maps. If the East Germans couldn't stop people from going over the Berlin Wall...

The "border" extends up and down both seaboards, plus the Gulf Coast and the Canadian border. Then you've got those pesky airports. How many of them are there? Thousands?

Seal the "border"? You've got to be kidding me. How much Cocaine and Heroin is manufactured in the U.S.?

 

[coldsteal2]

Seal the "border"? You've got to be kidding me. How much Cocaine and Heroin is manufactured in the U.S.?

Zero because niether plant will grow here in the US,
its a good thing it doesnt

 

[River]

I'll tell you what...why don't you move to our neck of the woods and see first hand the crime....
<snip>
time to start growing up.

What do you think I am? Stupid? Immature?

When did I make a post arguing against finding practical solutions or suggesting you folks just stew in your own juices? Did I not post "we know we're next"?

Where in the world do you get off accusing me of trying to thwart finding a solution to our problem? Just because I question the efficacy of your proposed solution I'm some kind of cretin? Screw that.

If you want to convince people like me to vote in favor of your proposed tactics, you're doing it wrong.

 

[KSG_Standard]

Illegal immigrants are STREAMING across the southern border ON FOOT. Illegal immigrants are TRICKLING in via airports and boats. The purpose of the border fence is NOT to seal the border, it's to slow down the illegal hordes and to funnel them into more easily monitored routes. The airport, seashore and northern border arguments are a smoke screen. In order to get here through an airport, you have to face customs officials.

 

[River]

Zero because niether plant will grow here in the US,
its a good thing it doesnt

I'm not so sure, CS. If it did, we could make it, distribute it, and tax it. As it is, it ensures that every possible hole in our border will be exploited to the fullest.

God-awful situation, it is.

 

[JMV]

....murders, rapes, tagging, car theft, home invasions, shop lifting, identify theft.....you name it, we got it in the illegal immigrant population...

You name it...it's in the legal citizen population. Your point?

I would assume you must have some staggering statistics to support your statement. I'm not just being an ass. I would genuinely like to see these statistics.

 

[CenCalPlayer]

No, I know we couldn't. Because the border is not that simple, and not just that line on the southern end of maps. If the East Germans couldn't stop people from going over the Berlin Wall...

The "border" extends up and down both seaboards, plus the Gulf Coast and the Canadian border. Then you've got those pesky airports. How many of them are there? Thousands?

Seal the "border"? You've got to be kidding me. How much Cocaine and Heroin is manufactured in the U.S.?

What are you talking about.....we are talking about the border with Mexico...the land border with Mexico....that is where the problem is and that border can be shut down.....sorry River, but that "can't" stuff is pure left of center BS...Yes, we can if we have the fortitude to do so....why are you so opposed to trying anyway?

You don't know that it can't be done, because we have never tried to....fact is when the Minute Men were down patroling on the border, the areas where they were at saw huge reductions in illegal crossings....imagine what would happen if the length of the border was patroled regularly by the U.S. military and/or National Guard.....by the way, we do patrol our seaways pretty heavily...and our airways as well for that matter, especially since 9/11.....

 

[River]

Illegal immigrants are STREAMING across the southern border ON FOOT. Illegal immigrants are TRICKLING in via airports and boats. The purpose of the border fence is NOT to seal the border, it's to slow down the illegal hordes and to funnel them into more easily monitored routes. The airport, seashore and northern border arguments are a smoke screen. In order to get here through an airport, you have to face customs officials.

Yes, KSG - I'm exaggerating. But not by THAT much. Your last sentence is proven false daily. Otherwise, I'd be fresh out of coke.

 

[PraXis]

Put landmines on the border and give warnings to bordering countries.

 

[River]

<snip>why are you so opposed to trying anyway? <snip>

I'm opposed to putting all of our eggs in one leaky basket. You wanna seal that sucker? You pay the taxes to get 'er done.

 

[MineGoesTo11]

As was stated before by River. If there was a will in the corridors of power to shut down the flow of immigrants, it would happen. There is an interest in keeping the cheap labor coming for certain parties.


River states that closing the border tight is not plausible, and I think he's right. So the alternative is to do something that removes the incentive to move across the border. That would mean developing the Mexican economy into something that doesn't drive people into the US looking for a better life. That means putting pressure on the Mexican government to weed out corruption, and to snuff out the drug lords.

Ostensibly, Nafta was supposed to be a benefit to all parties, but I don't think the Mexican people have benefitted largely from it. Closing the border down or tightening it significantly is going to be met with fierce resistance from all of the parties involved in cross border trade.

 

[MineGoesTo11]

You name it...it's in the legal citizen population. Your point?

I would assume you must have some staggering statistics to support your statement. I'm not just being an ass. I would genuinely like to see these statistics.

Supporting evidence doesn't fit on bumper stickers and placards.

 

[KSG_Standard]

I'm not sure, because I'm not that good at math, but I'd be willing to bet that building a 100ft tall 1200 mile fence made out of platinum, diamonds and gold, would be cheaper in the long run, than paying for food stamps, schooling, healthcare and other gov't services for over 10 million illegal immigrants.

* some exaggeration used to illustrate a point.

 

[KP]

As was stated before by River. If there was a will in the corridors of power to shut down the flow of immigrants, it would happen. There is an interest in keeping the cheap labor coming for certain parties.


River states that closing the border tight is not plausible, and I think he's right. So the alternative is to do something that removes the incentive to move across the border. That would mean developing the Mexican economy into something that doesn't drive people into the US looking for a better life. That means putting pressure on the Mexican government to weed out corruption, and to snuff out the drug lords.

Ostensibly, Nafta was supposed to be a benefit to all parties, but I don't think the Mexican people have benefitted largely from it. Closing the border down or tightening it significantly is going to be met with fierce resistance from all of the parties involved in cross border trade.

The only way to develop the Mexican economy would be to invade their country and execute all corrupt officials, drug lords and gangs. Short of that, there is nothing we can to to stimulate their economy.

 

[River]

As was stated before by River. If there was a will in the corridors of power to shut down the flow of immigrants, it would happen. There is an interest in keeping the cheap labor coming for certain parties.

River states that closing the border tight is not plausible, and I think he's right. So the alternative is to do something that removes the incentive to move across the border. That would mean developing the Mexican economy into something that doesn't drive people into the US looking for a better life. That means putting pressure on the Mexican government to weed out corruption, and to snuff out the drug lords.

Ostensibly, Nafta was supposed to be a benefit to all parties, but I don't think the Mexican people have benefitted largely from it. Closing the border down or tightening it significantly is going to be met with fierce resistance from all of the parties involved in cross border trade.

Thank you.

My attempts to face reality are normally met with derision and accusations of being a leftist, commie bastard. I am nothing of the kind. I am a realist.

When "everyone" starts shouting "hey, look over here, rape pillage and murder in progress!", I immediately look around to see from what they're trying to divert my attention. In this case, I happen to think it's painfully obvious.

 

[MineGoesTo11]

I'm not sure, because I'm not that good at math, but I'd be willing to bet that building a 100ft tall 1200 mile fence made out of platinum, diamonds and gold, would be cheaper in the long run, than paying for food stamps, schooling, healthcare and other gov't services for over 10 million illegal immigrants.

* some exaggeration used to illustrate a point.

So if you made them all citizens, then you'd increase the tax base by the number of those millions who are able to work?