59 Reissue Les Paul in Church

brianbzed

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The church I go to was closed for a while and is reopening soon with new members in the band and tonight is our first rehearsal. I will be playing my 59 Reissue Les Paul. The previous Pastor didn't like me playing a Les Paul and said its a Rock & Roll guitar. Personally I think its quite a good looker!

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Glad you have a new Pastor. We all know that the Les Paul Model was invented for the popular music of the 50's. Guys like Peter Green, used them for Rock n' Roll a few years later. I have been using my Les Pauls for worship for years, and have had nothing but compliments on the tone. Go tear 'em up!
ps. I have played other guitars in Church,too....super-Strats, Teles, PRS...it is the context...not the instrument!
 

GBLEV

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Actually it was Lucifer that was the angle of music,...Lucifer's angelic name was Samael the archangel of Light, Justice, and Entertainment...(including Music).

Samael is a figure that comes from Talmudic-Midrashic literature, and not the Bible. In Talmudic-Midrashic literature, he is a figure that resembles Lucifer and carries similar monikers for evil works as Satan. However, Samael is still serving God in the Heavenly realm, hates sin, and still holds a high position in God's angelic hierarchy. Also, in Talmudic-Midrashic literature Samael is called "the great prince in heaven" (Pirḳe R. El. xiii., beginning). While Satan on the other hand, has been cast out of God's kingdom and banished forever (Isaiah 14:12-15; Matt. 25:41), and not only does Lucifer tempt people to sin (1 Peter 5:8; Eph 6:12), Jesus calls him "a murderer" and "the father of lies" (John 8:44). So the two couldn't be more different.

In the end, it was God alone Who created music, thus, the possibility for all music. I hope this helps.
 

GBLEV

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a few years ago I was reading a book on the history of Classical Music. One thing that jumped out at me was that in the European Capitals, Kids and unwed women were not allowed to attend Concerts (we would now calll them symphonies) of the day. Beethoven and separately (but even more so) Mozart were considered SO provocative that it was disallowed. When reading that I thought to myself, "that is exactly what was said about my music (1970s and 1980s). Those thoughts were not new in the late 1970s and are not new now. They go back AT LEAST to the time of Beethoven and Mozart. Mozart himself was the Gene Simmons and/or Ozzy Osbourne of his day. And for the record, KISS can now be heard on "smooth sounds of the 70s" radio stations (I heard "Beth" as well as in elevators). It was not true in 1781 nor in 1981, and is not true today!

Don't forget, at one time they said Elvis was playing the devil's music, and he was evil. When he would preform on TV they were only allowed to film him from the waist and up! If those people back then could only see our TV commercials today!
 

mudface

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Samael is a figure that comes from Talmudic-Midrashic literature, and not the Bible. In Talmudic-Midrashic literature, he is a figure that resembles Lucifer and carries similar monikers for evil works as Satan. However, Samael is still serving God in the Heavenly realm, hates sin, and still holds a high position in God's angelic hierarchy. Also, in Talmudic-Midrashic literature Samael is called "the great prince in heaven" (Pirḳe R. El. xiii., beginning). While Satan on the other hand, has been cast out of God's kingdom and banished forever (Isaiah 14:12-15; Matt. 25:41), and not only does Lucifer tempt people to sin (1 Peter 5:8; Eph 6:12), Jesus calls him "a murderer" and "the father of lies" (John 8:44). So the two couldn't be more different.

In the end, it was God alone Who created music, thus, the possibility for all music. I hope this helps.

:rofl:...... Google the question:

Is Lucifer the angle of music?
 

GBLEV

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:rofl:...... Google the question:

Is Lucifer the angle of music?

My bad, I thought you were asking me that question, then I saw you said to Google it. When it comes to things of the Bible, Google is not always your friend. If you read and know scripture, then you won't need Google. There's more mis-information regarding things of scripture on the internet than there is truth. If your not rooted in God's word, then you will have a hard time telling the difference between truth and error.

Talmudic literature is Jewish folklore and is not rooted in evidence and truth. While Samael in Jewish folklore was based off of Satan in the Bible, the reality of the two are contradictory. It would be like comparing the real John Henry to the folklore character who could use a sledge hammer to pound steel drills into rocks faster than a man using a steam powered hammer, only to claim victory and die from the stress with his hammer in his hands.

*EDIT* I guess I should add that you will not find in scripture anywhere of it mentioning Lucifer as the "angel of music" or having anything to do with music. No where is this being alluded to, or even hinting at that. It's not there.
 
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mudface

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My bad, I thought you were asking me that question, then I saw you said to Google it. When it comes to things of the Bible, Google is not always your friend. If you read and know scripture, then you won't need Google. There's more mis-information regarding things of scripture on the internet than there is truth. If your not rooted in God's word, then you will have a hard time telling the difference between truth and error.

Talmudic literature is Jewish folklore and is not rooted in evidence and truth. While Samael in Jewish folklore was based off of Satan in the Bible, the reality of the two are contradictory. It would be like comparing the real John Henry to the folklore character who could use a sledge hammer to pound steel drills into rocks faster than a man using a steam powered hammer, only to claim victory and die from the stress with his hammer in his hands.


It's obvious that you are using faith and belief as a method to which you understand the truth.

Which is fine..... I simply quoted the answer word for word without implying any truth..... Peter Pan can fly,....at least that is how it is written.

Edit:....I guess i should add that other religious writings and/or "folklore" are just as valid as any scripture, but that is just my opinion.....I'm not saying it has to be true.
 
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GBLEV

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It's obvious that you are using faith and belief as a method to which you understand the truth.

Which is fine..... I simply quoted the answer word for word without implying any truth..... Peter Pan can fly,....at least that is how it is written.

Edit:....I guess i should add that other religious writings and/or "folklore" are just as valid as any scripture, but that is just my opinion.....I'm not saying it has to be true.

Your right I am a person of faith and spend a lot of time studying scripture, and pretty much anything that's even somewhat associated to it in anyway. I wasn't trying to be condescending. I was only trying to shed some light on something I think you are confused on. It's common knowledge that Talmudic-Midrashic literature is indeed Jewish folklore, and Samael is a parody of Lucifer. It's impossible for them to be one and the same given that the two stand in complete contradiction to one another. This is fact and shown in the passages I shared for each. It does not matter your belief system, or mine. The only thing that matters is that according to the two pieces of literature that gives any details on these two characters, whether they are real or a folklore, the details written about them stand in complete contradiction to one another. They can both be wrong, but they both cannot be right.

Even then, both in Jewish folklore and the Bible, it is still God who created everything, thus, the possibility of everything, including music. Not angels. No angel has the power to create anything of itself. I'm sure without a doubt that God has appointed an angel over music, But which angel that is, we have no clue (?), as this is not info that has been given to us.
 

DBDM

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Don't forget, at one time they said Elvis was playing the devil's music, and he was evil. When he would preform on TV they were only allowed to film him from the waist and up! If those people back then could only see our TV commercials today!
My point was it goes WAY back before Elvis. It likely did not start with Beethoven and Mozart. I am pretty sure the first dude that transitioned a ūd into a lute was told he was going to hell. Subsequently when the baroque guitar appeared, some pastor or Dad said, "you are going to hell for playing that baroque guitar, why can't you play the lute like a good Christian". Swap the words, insert your favorite time frame in history--some people simply fear change of any kind, and are comforted by the familiar.
 

Crusader

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I remember the Pastor saying its not the shape of a Les Paul that make it unsuitable, its the pickups, the sound they make. Well we had the first service on Sunday as a new church and the place was packed and I think the singing of the congregation drowned out any sound the band made, it was incredible!
 

Lefty Elmo

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I use my Historic goldtop in church, though mostly I play my ES-345. No one has ever said anything bad about either one. Rather, they express gratitude for my playing. Before covid, we had a two minute "meet and greet some one you don't know", during which we played "Freeride", Jessica", "Rockin' Down The Highway", and others. Our paster even asked us to play "Just Like Starting Over", and "I'm Alright". His favorite band is The Black Crowes and one of his favorite movies is "The Big Lebowski". He's a very cool guy!
 

wildhawk1

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I remember the Pastor saying its not the shape of a Les Paul that make it unsuitable, its the pickups, the sound they make.

The pickups... yeah right. :hmm:

I've gotten "that look" more than a few times hauling my electric and amps into churches.

Always from the older ones that don't want change.
The I've been attending this church forever type.

Don't care.

I'm respectful enough to take an acoustic to nursing homes and play the traditional music they like. Been gigging long enough to know if we're invited to a specific event the music should be geared towards the expected crowd demographic.

If a pastor tells us a sermon is on a certain topic and asks if we can play a few songs that are relative to it I'm good with that. I can be accommodating however....

I'm not going to roll in and be a oldies jukebox just to make a few elders in a church happy.

I strongly believe many of them are at fault for their churches demise. We played at a large church years ago that would probably seat three hundred.
They were lucky to have a few dozen there that Sunday and there wasn't one person under forty.

I'm sure they blame it on society.

There's more static in young people's lives than ever before and if it takes an electric guitar to make them stop and think for a few minutes then IMHO it's a no brainer.

 

lavern23

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The first time I played my Les Paul Goldtop at church our preacher said “now that’s a guitar! Your not allowed to play any other here. Lol”
 

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