2 NAD - Orange Content

rjwilson37

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A few weeks ago, I purchased a new Marshall JCM800 Studio Classic and it just didn't do much for me, not very versatile and I just did not get the tone I was hoping for.

So... I looked at a lot of different Orange Amps, to go with my Orange PPC212V cabinet and I settled on getting the Rocker 15 Terror. I was originally looking at the Orange Rockerverb 50, but it was just overkill for my purposes and that thing weigh's a lot. I did look at the TH30, but the dirty channel was pretty much the same thing as my Dark Terror and the Clean channel is still pretty dark. While playing my Dark Terror the past couple days, I realized that I can't put both the Dark Terror and new Rocker 15 Terror on top my cabinet. I was thinking it would be nice to have something to put the Rocker 15 Terror on and be able to switch back and forth between two heads if I wanted to. So... I got a really good deal on a TH30 in black, so I can sell my Dark Terror and still have a nice Dark Metal tone from the TH30 that also has a clean channel with it. Sure it cost me a little bit more, but I still will have that nice killer Metal Tone that I love when I want it and sitting right on top will be the new Rocker 15 Terror with a nice crunch and a warmer nicely rounded clean tone on the Natural channel.

I will be getting the Rocker 15 Terror on Tuesday and hopefully the new TH30 will follow soon after that.
 
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rjwilson37

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Ok, someone did mention to me something about big iron, larger transformers that they say once you go big you never go back.

How do you feel about that.

I know I did listen to a video about someone replacing the Chinese transformer in a TH30 with a Mercury Magnet Transformer and I did not hear a big difference with that kind of upgrade. Granted that is still not big iron, but not sure that kind of costly upgrade for a TH30 would ever be worth it from what I heard.
 

Classicplayer

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I hope this works out for you. I think you said that your Dark Terror was sounding “dark” and above you say the TH30 clean channel Is also on the dark side. My suggestion is hold off with the TH30 and see howmell the Rocker Terror 15 works out for you first.

I have a Dark Terror and really appreciate what it can do for my tatstes. I tend to e.q. it for a clean tone, but only when I use my Les Paul neck pup. I make an “e.q.compromise” so that in the middle and bridge position, I have that chewy Orange grind happening. Your Dark Terror can be bright and clean if you want it that way, or nasty and angry if you like that. It's not going to be as versatile as the Rocker Terror 15.


Classicplayer
 

guitfiddle

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With the TH30 you'll get some of that bigger amp tone over the DT. Just having more power to push the gain into makes a difference in tone and feel...you might find yourself running more gain than you did on the DT.
 

rjwilson37

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Thanks for the info and those are definitely things I have thought about. I know that I don't get that crunch tone I like from the Dark Terror and I've heard it in some of the videos for the Rocker 15 Terror. That is something I am really looking forward to. I did have a great crunch tone from the DSL40C I had years ago, but that amp was heavy at 50lbs, pretty big and just did not have the clean or driven tones I liked. I could use the clean on the DSL40C with my old Boss ME80 using the core gain pedal with some delay and reverb, which was very cool. It was a nice deep full tone that was very killer for sure. When I moved out to California, I only came with one guitar and a small fun little Blackstar Core 10 amp. I rented a room for a little over a year when I got out here and kept things minimal if you know what I mean with limited space.
 
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guitfiddle

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I have a Dark Terror too, and my favorite crunch tones are when I set the volume on 8 or 9 and then put the gain around 4. The shape control goes to the left around 9 or 10 o'clock. It's a bit dark so a brighter guitar helps, but it's crunchy goodness for sure.

Then I plug into my OR15 or my OR50 and the crunch tones just fall out of them no matter how you set them. Still, the DT can get some good crunch but it's mean and pissed off, and not smooth like the Rocker 15 seems to be. It works well onstage as the snarl makes the guitar cut through.
 

LSAR

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I think we talked about the DT vs TH30 when you were looking for a cab...I think the DT is a great amp and the TH30 offers a bit more out of that plus a clean channel that may or may not work for you. The "big iron" thing IMO may or may not apply if you don't actually bring it up in volume (that's not an educated opinion, so don't take it as fact).

IMO, the Rocker at 15W is a mean monster if you want it to be. It'll do rock, including a lot of very high gain modern rock and it'll be very comfortable doing it at a pretty high volume especially through that PPC212V of yours. I had the 1x10" combo and that even covered well into a lot of classic metal up into the late '80s and some '90s but after that it lacked some tightness in the low end. I suspect with your cab it will go a little further too.

I miss my Rocker 15. The dirt channel was a rock tone wherever, and the Natural channel was cleanish if you rolled back the volume a bit and dimed on guitar and amp was pure AC/DC bliss with some decent humbuckers. They could sell that single control Natural channel as a standalone amp and IMO it would do well...though maybe not until word spread. The dirt channel you have to spend some time with but once you do most things are there.

IME a Marshall is a great sound...and great sounds can be dialed in. None of them are "mine" though and Orange has that feeling right away. I'd own a Marshall for a cover band, I'd own an Orange to jam the fvck out and be me...but I could dial the Orange in close enough to cover the cover band duties as well most likely.

If they made an updated Dual Terror and it was a Dual Rocker or Rocker 30h...with the Natural channel unmolested (but more volume) and the Dirty channel having maybe a switchable option to change the midrange/low-mid characteristic to make it a but tighter...holy shit. Nobody else would stand a chance.

I wish I'd tried a TS9 in front to tighten it up at the time...I may never have sold it and never have looked for another amp.
 

Classicplayer

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I have a Dark Terror too, and my favorite crunch tones are when I set the volume on 8 or 9 and then put the gain around 4. The shape control goes to the left around 9 or 10 o'clock. It's a bit dark so a brighter guitar helps, but it's crunchy goodness for sure.

Then I plug into my OR15 or my OR50 and the crunch tones just fall out of them no matter how you set them. Still, the DT can get some good crunch but it's mean and pissed off, and not smooth like the Rocker 15 seems to be. It works well onstage as the snarl makes the guitar cut through.

Those DT settings would really make mine sound rather dark IMHO, and I'm using two Les Pauls with my DT at home. Usually my settings (and considered to be “quiet” for a Dark Terror), are: volume at 11 o'clock, gain +-10:30, and the shape never goes too much counterclockwise; mostly 2 o’clock to even thinner a 2:30. It gives me a fairly bright tone overall. It's full sounding with a neck humbucker, and brighter and thinner with the bridge. To get a bright middle position, I have to have the shape at 2:30 o'clock and drop the gain a touch while raising volume. This is all done to keep home volume respectable, but still represent that Orange angry to smooth sound.

A TH30 would not work for me unless playing out was my thing. I'd like to give the a Rocker Terror 15 a go; for that well-spoken of clean channel. There happens to be a decent store not far from me that has a used RT15 for sale at a decent price.....I've been tempted to ask for a tryout. I just cannot justify the outlay right now.

As a side note, I’d been experimenting with sort of Classical music as applied to a Rock-toned and gritty sounding Orange amp. It requires fingerpicking and more fretboard leaps at speed than would some types of Metal. It requires a thinner twangy tone and that is the reason I set my Dark Terror as I described above. That's another reason why I think this may work as well, or better, on the Rocker Terror 15.


Classicplayer
 
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rjwilson37

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I do really like the Dark Terror and will like the fact that I am not getting rid of that killer tone since the TH30 still has that, and an added Clean with some headroom at 30w. It is a killer amp that a lot of people speak very highly about, as well as black to match my cabinet. It will also give me something to put the Rocker 15 Terror on top so I can switch back and forth when I want to. I am getting married next February, so I want to get this now before we start looking to buy a house and of course traveling with my new wife. This new merger will probably not allow the funds to spend on such things that we here at MLP consider sort of a necessity from time to time to change things up a bit. Buying new gear adds spice to life and inspires me to play more. I really want to improve and want to get more involved in some Metal jamming as well as still keeping with the sweet Classic rock tones that I have played my whole life and love so much. I love jamming to AC\DC, Van Halen and Ozzy a lot, that is just my favorite guitar tones and riffs of all time.
 

rjwilson37

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Added note.... The upgrade to the MLP website, I am not sure I totally like it just yet. There are definitely some nice improvements, but the fixed screen size blocks not expanding if you have a nice large monitor is a bit restrictive.
 

matthew bear

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Big Iron is a feeling thing for me, much like a SS vs tube rectifier.
I have a tendency to be a super nerd, so I'll focus in on some detail whist ignoring everything else going on... I find that I appreciate how my playing reacts to the circuit will cause me to change my playing so I'm getting something special from each unique item involved. Right now I'm loving how a larger amp will stay "stiffer" under my hand and it makes me hit the strings harder... I can't say for certain it's specifically because of the OT, but I know that has something to do with it.

And besides that, if any part of your signal chain is overloaded, you will receive some kind of feedback from the speaker. so "Bloom" or "Sag" can be achieved in various ways... though they all have slight differences.

So, I guess the moral of the story here is, don't listen to me, I have Aspergers :laugh2:
 

ErictheRed

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Regarding transformers, I do sort of feel that once you go big you'll never back. But that has to be taken with a grain of salt and you need to remain within reason. If you're never playing outside of your house or you can never turn it up at least moderately loud, there's no point.
 

sonar

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I own a '65 Twin, '72 Super Lead and have played Hiwatt DR 103's, Ampeg V2's, V4's up to a 200 watt Marshall Major. I don't like to admit it, but I also briefly played Dual/Triple Rec's. Trust me, you'll eventually come back down to earth. Size, weight and volume gets old pretty quick.

I love and miss the headroom of big iron (not to be confused with "crystal clean") but it's incredibly impractical. It'd be worse if I was a Metal player, as you really do need that tight bass response to make it work. (If you 're going for the post Master of Puppets Metal tone at reasonable volume you can always go digital, for what it's worth.)

I have a fair amount of Surf influences in my playing and even then a 15 watt amp can easily fall apart unless I modify my playing approach. And that's the key, for me at least. Make your playing work with what you have.
 

northernguitarguy

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Regarding transformers, I do sort of feel that once you go big you'll never back. But that has to be taken with a grain of salt and you need to remain within reason. If you're never playing outside of your house or you can never turn it up at least moderately loud, there's no point.
I started big and now prefer small.
 


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