1953 Les Paul Custom Prototype?

mudface

Boo Bee
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We need pics of the pup routes and control cavity,.... and a close up of the bridge would help,....
 

PierM

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Seems sporting lot of aftermarket mods.

Pickguard it’s a modern HH aftermarket, not for P90 and not original.
From the pics looks like doesnt have a Staple Alnico 5, but 2 P90 soapbar.
Bridge and TP also they dont look stock, but hard to say from those pics.
TRC not original.

The code 452 was in the P90 plastics from 50 to 70.

Could be someone sanded off the clear coat? (or maybe a recent refin?)

Indeed, more detail pics are needed: cavities on the back, under pups, details of the heel etc...

Anyway, @zhivago is your guy. ;)
 

neogtbrg

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Thank you guys for your replies, here are the pics you requested, let me know if theres anything else. As far as i can tell it did have a refinish (it doesnt have the 7 layer ply and the paint on the neck looks a bit different). As far as i can know this could be a fake? or a RI? i honeslty still have no idea...

WhatsApp Image 2019-12-26 at 1.34.36 PM (4).jpeg
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WhatsApp Image 2019-12-26 at 1.34.36 PM (1).jpeg
WhatsApp Image 2019-12-26 at 1.34.36 PM.jpeg
WhatsApp Image 2019-12-26 at 1.34.35 PM.jpeg
 

neogtbrg

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Seems sporting lot of aftermarket mods.

Pickguard it’s a modern HH aftermarket, not for P90 and not original.
From the pics looks like doesnt have a Staple Alnico 5, but 2 P90 soapbar.
Bridge and TP also they dont look stock, but hard to say from those pics.
TRC not original.

The code 452 was in the P90 plastics from 50 to 70.

Could be someone sanded off the clear coat? (or maybe a recent refin?)

Indeed, more detail pics are needed: cavities on the back, under pups, details of the heel etc...

Anyway, @zhivago is your guy. ;)

Yeah, the pickguard is what it came with (previous owner said the head nut cover, bridge, and pickguard was aftermarket).
it could be that someone sanded the clear coat but alas it still doesnt have the 7 ply binding, also the binding on the nexk was changed to a bad 3 ply binding instead of the 1 ply normally found. As seen in the pics, the bridged seems to have been covered with a dowel and then redrilled to fit a tune-a-matic style bridge. It still has the bigsby drilling on the side of the guitar. Thank you so much for the info!
 

The_Nuge

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The routing channel appears to be square => not a vintage or reissue Gibson, as these have a 1-piece body with a round drilled channel.
Also the pickup-end of the fretboard is very rounded, which doesn't look Gibson to me!
 

neogtbrg

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The routing channel appears to be square => not a vintage or reissue Gibson, as these have a 1-piece body with a round drilled channel.
Also the pickup-end of the fretboard is very rounded, which doesn't look Gibson to me!
Correct, the pickup end of the fretboard i believe was refinished baaadly... So because of the routing this cant be a real gibson?
 

PierM

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.... Plenty of modifications. As said, the routing isnt right for a 53/56 LPC (that version is being used for bodies with a cap), and that second routing on the bottom of the cavity looks weird...

Binding isnt original.
Switch plate not original.
Switch/ring not original...
Interesting wood color under the top finish...Maple? :hmm:

Bridge posts holes arent looking 6/32, they looks much larger.
Routing on the neck seems not deep enough for a staple alnico, so could be this born with 2 P90.

Maybe a 5x GT conversion?

Do you have a pic of the switch toggle cavity?
 

The_Nuge

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Correct, the pickup end of the fretboard i believe was refinished baaadly... So because of the routing this cant be a real gibson?
Well, AFAIK all vintage Customs, and the re-issues too, were / are made with a 1-piece solid mahogany body with no separate top. It would be impossible to use the standard square routing on a body like that, so I'm very sure this isn't a Gibson Custom. As PierM said, it might be a Goldtop dressed up as a Custom, but I wouldn't bet any money on it!
 

PierM

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P90 routing are very much looking like a 53 goldtop.

25DD0C86-FD3B-42C1-A2CA-41A347D9F793.jpeg
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neogtbrg

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.... Plenty of modifications. As said, the routing isnt right for a 53/56 LPC (that version is being used for bodies with a cap), and that second routing on the bottom of the cavity looks weird...

Binding isnt original.
Switch plate not original.
Switch/ring not original...
Interesting wood color under the top finish...Maple? :hmm:

Bridge posts holes arent looking 6/32, they looks much larger.
Routing on the neck seems not deep enough for a staple alnico, so could be this born with 2 P90.

Maybe a 5x GT conversion?

Do you have a pic of the switch toggle cavity?
... correct, theres pleeenty of mods on this one. Maybe i didnt state this before but i havent cleaned it or done anything to it besides taking it appart for pics.

- The binding, switchplate (metal), and the switch ring (the typography should be more condensed or taller than what it is) are deff not orifinal. The bridge posts were prob made by the person that "refinished" this guitar (if you can call it refinish by any means)

Whats a 5x GT conversion?

I paid $520 for it...
 

zhivago

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Coming in late, but I gotta agree with the guys...a few red flags for sure...
 

neogtbrg

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Here are some pics of the switch toggle cavity. and also of the wood on top that has no paint on it.
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WhatsApp Image 2019-12-26 at 2.30.29 PM (1).jpeg
WhatsApp Image 2019-12-26 at 2.30.29 PM.jpeg
 

neogtbrg

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Ive also thought it might be a GT conversion, yet it has binding on all the places the Custom has them... This is a real mistery guitar ha?
 

mudface

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One correct feature is the last three MOP block inlays are the same size like a vintage Custom neck.
6D128C9F-8951-4AAE-93C1-352BB562F046.jpeg
 
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neogtbrg

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The routing is square, just checked it... A Gold top body with a Custom neck?
 

charlie chitlins

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This is a picture of my "late '53" Custom. It was in the first run of the Customs. The serial numbers on the pots are all the same.... 134323. This puts the manufacturing date as the 32nd week of '53. I also have a GA - 90 amp that was used with this guitar. The instrument has been in my family since it was new. It was played very little, then put into storage where it has been for more than fifty years. And yes, they are both for sale. View attachment 129000
I just had a small seizure...
 

PierM

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I was thinking same about the cap being maple??

I actually think it looks mahogany grain on that detail shot. Isnt looking properly stained (which make it of a dark reddish brown), but since this is a refin, could be they didnt prepped the hog before to respray....but yeah looks hog grain. Could also be maple, who knows? :thumbs:

This guitar it’s a mistery. I think you need a serious expert doing a proper ID with such guitar in his hands. We can only keep assuming and speculating here, nothing definitive for your research.
 

Mike I

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If you blow up a pic of the control cavity, you can pretty clearly see mating lines for a cap.

And a blow up of the exposed wood looks more like maple than mahogany.

Maybe this was a proto before someone got the idea of a full mahogany body?

Looks like a 53 GT body with some iteration of a custom neck.



WhatsApp Image 2019-12-26 at 1.34.36 PM (3).jpeg
 

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