Why Gibson Did Not Get It Right in the Late 60s?

Discussion in 'Vintage Les Pauls' started by zakkrhoads, Sep 13, 2017.

  1. vintageguitarz

    vintageguitarz Member

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    PLEASE, get real. Gibson, and all their competitors build guitars to sell and make money. There's no money in being only inventive or what they want to and not building what WILL sell. The idiotic Robot Les Paul was an answer to complaints that guitars won't stay in tune, usually vocalized by the amateur guitarists not the pros. But how may guitars do real pros actually buy every year? That is what Gibson, Fender et al roll the dice and make bets. Guess what, Gibson DIDN'T have any left over un-sellable inventory at the end of an year in the 60's, 70's or 80's. What's that tell you? THey made what people wanted to BUY.

    As for your ludicrous assertion why P-90's? DUH, some of the most iconic LP, SG's, ES models like the ES-175's, etc came with P-90's /Soapbars and you know that a hell of a lot of making a living recording pros PREFER them to HB's!! Look up sometime that guitar used by famous guitarists of the 50 - 90's and you'd be shocked the high percentage that used a LP, Jr, Special, SG etc with Soapbars / P-90's!

    Bottom line is late 60's, 70's, 80's, 90's Gibson's are loved, played, cherished and valued very highly $$ by a lot of players that you'd laugh at and those same owners/players laugh at your one-person opinion. I'd rather have my 1968 SG Special with factory soapbars than your 2016/2017 Les Paul Std and guess which is worth a lot more and will be worth a lot more over the next 10 years?? That 2016/2017 Les Paul is going DOWN in value.
     
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  2. goldtop0

    goldtop0 Senior Member

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    I agree with you on the P 90s......a better sound, but the OP made a valid point re the '68 GT.
    However the situation as you've stated was different back then('50s/60s) with Gibson making to order, and vastly different to recent times since when the Historic LPs came out ('90s) and meeting a market.......over supply.
    And your opinion on what will be valued more in future is flawed in that P 90 LPs while being desirable to Pro players doesn't compare with the buying public......they like humbuckers. Gibsons production numbers tell us that through the decades.
    If EC and Peter Green and Mick Taylor and Duane and Dickie and Billy etc had played P 90 LPs I'm sure the situation would be different.....but it ain't.
    Humbuckered Gibsons(vintage or otherwise) at this time will generally always be more valued and have greater resale value than their P 90 counterpart.....history and today's market tells us that.
     
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  3. vintageguitarz

    vintageguitarz Member

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    Except the worlds most valuable Les Paul of all times (at auction) is Les Paul's personal LP, which had Gibson "Recording" PuPs based on P-90's, NOT Humbuckers. And the Les Paul model Les Paul most personally endorsed was the "Recorder Model" which was based on his person LP (pictured below) and those also did not have Humbuckers.
     

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  4. goldtop0

    goldtop0 Senior Member

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    No I'm afraid that those two do not rewrite history.
     
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  5. dspelman

    dspelman Senior Member

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    It was seriously on by the end of 1966, LONG before "early '70's." They'd already begun to shoot up in price. When Gibson began putting out the gold top P90 guitars two years later, they were responding to an overwhelming pent-up demand. I think one of their first ads for LPs when they came back into production was something like, "okay, we give up." Gibson actually had field sales reps in those days, and in a couple of cases they knew where NOS bursts were languishing in a dealer back room and picked them up for employees of dealers who did a lot of business with them. By 1970, LPs were full bore again.
     
  6. dspelman

    dspelman Senior Member

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    Bill Lawrence may have been the first to use ceramic magnets in production pickups around 1970 or 1971 (Alembic's folks may have been on it sooner). He designed the first super humbuckers with three magnets (all ceramic), and those were the first "hot" pickups for Gibson, and were introduced on the L6-S (which was also Gibson's first 24-fret guitar).
     
  7. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Senior Member

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    They were also use in very late '72 SGs..the pole piece versions..wanna say that happened simultaneously.
     
  8. Leña_Costoso

    Leña_Costoso Senior Member

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    I've always thought that Gibson was always a company to make sure its own products would be hard to counterfeit, especially using its cheaper models as a basis for a more expensive one.

    That is - body thickness is thicker on more expensive models, thinner on entry and mid level models. Headstock inlay, binding, hole size and placement... you get the idea.

    There is an interview with Les himself where he says he called up Gibson and asked if they knew his namesake was going for well over a thousand dollars - used. They had no idea, but quickly made an effort to rejoin the market with the guitar (much to Le$'$ plea$ure)
     
  9. Leña_Costoso

    Leña_Costoso Senior Member

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    I'm almost certain the Super Humbucker predated the L6s by a year or two. The L6s pickups were actually quite nice, with flimsy wiring.
     
  10. Bluefox

    Bluefox Senior Member

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    Les Paul's pickups had nothing to do with P 90s, those were low impedance humbuckers with stacked coils.
     

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