This is an interesting topic. Like I've said, I started out half-joking, but now I'm curious about it. I forgot how important that label is to some people, and I see it has legs, so I thought I'd start a new thread. In my experience, it has often seemed that for many collectors, vintage means "something old enough that you can't afford it, but I have 4 of them". Fender has Pre-CBS (1965 and older), Gibson has Pre-Norlin (1969 and older), PRS has Pre-Factory (1994 and older) and (much more importantly) First-Year (1985/1986). But none of these really relate to the term "Vintage", do they? Since this is the Les Paul board (yes, I said 'the' - i don't count private clubs as 'boards'), let's discuss the term, and see how we define it. For starters, any word is a "signifier". It means what the users agree it means. The signified is the object it alludes to. As an example, "Cow" is a signifier. A large animal that says 'moo' is the signified. (And GuitarDean's 1979 prom date, I'm afraid ). I started by looking in several dictionaries for the accepted meaning of the word, and discovered that as it relates to wine, it is a word with positive connotation; in other words, a vintage wine is a good wine, not just an old one. That alone has problematic ramifications when applied to old guitars, so before we start trying to relate the original term to our area of interest, let's understand that it's not the same thing. So okay... I pulled out my Oxford Shorter, and looked at the origins of the word "vintage". That wasn't really much help either - I won't bore you with the details, but it wasn't. So what we're left with is a discussion about what the the word has come to mean to us, the users, as it applies to old guitars. Maybe specifically Gibsons? I don't know, but I find the topic fascinating. I always thought that vintage should apply to a rolling age-point, either 20 or 25 years old, and I've seen a lot of dealers and collectors who agree with that. I've enjoyed watching many of my guitars achieve 'vintage' status in my mind, as I myself do the same . But now it seems that for some people, no matter how old they get, they will never earn that label of distinction. Opinions?