The Truth about Tone Capacitors

Discussion in 'Tonefreaks' started by Rodolphe, Dec 4, 2013.

  1. Rodolphe

    Rodolphe Senior Member

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    Interesting article I found on TDPRI.
    I know some are going to say this is bullshit, and some will admit the article may be right... anyway, I think it's quite interesting and relevant.

    Atlantic Quality Design, Inc., The Truth about Tone Capacitors
     
  2. frankv

    frankv What Are You Waiting For? Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    It was a very thought out article. Really was. The debate will never end because there are folks, lots of them, that have a different opinion of the effect or lack of with quality caps. Me? I can't hear that well anymore..
     
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  3. kasu

    kasu Senior Member

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    Great article. Caps are caps, only the value is of interest. I have a whole bag of old bumble bees and black beauties of different values that ive played around with. They work ok if the value hasnt travelled too far of into the happy hunting grounds. New caps work just as well and are more reliable. The only reason I use these old ones in some of my guitars is that it looks pretty cool... You need to measure them first though....In alot of cases, caps doesnt age very gracefully...

    However....this debate will never die anyway. Doesnt matter if you make a 100 scientific studies on the subject and come to the same conclusion...
     
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  4. budg

    budg Senior Member

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    Another internet myth busted. Bumble bees , pio and the like snake oil imo . Where people here the difference in tone in vintage amps vs new is a well broken in speaker and caps and resistors that have drifted from their original values. As far as the same value caps in a guitar, the article spells it out nicely.
     
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  5. suedehead

    suedehead Senior Member

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    Kasu, those Bees and BBs you have are now worth pennies. I know they look pretty, but how about £5 for the lot?
     
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  6. Rodolphe

    Rodolphe Senior Member

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    well, I may admit i usually swap the conds on my guitars and amps thinking it sounds better after, but is it because i'm convinced it will sound better or because it does...


    I didn't post it to create a war between pro and others, just because I think it is serious and backed up with tests.
     
  7. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Article didn't tell me anything I didn't already know or believe in. Seen similar studies. Actual capacitance and ratings is what matters as far as tone goes. THAT said, some dielectrics last better than others. Oddly, some of those expensive NOS caps, tend to not age well as others. I pay a little more than bottom rung for Orange drops, because by and large they measure closer to the proper capacitance than cheaper ceramics, across the board. But, there are some very good tolerance ceramics out there too.
     
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  8. Dun Ringill

    Dun Ringill Premium Member

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    Its probably all in my head but I REALLY love my PIO .022 russian-made K40y-9s..
     
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  9. rlg5150

    rlg5150 Banned

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    Yeah, right.

    The next thing you'll be telling us is that a maple fretboard doesn't make your tone more "snappy." :laugh2:






    :Ohno:
     
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  10. WhatDoIKnow

    WhatDoIKnow Senior Member

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    Do you have a link to the TDPRI thread? I've read these discussions before. It's always interesting to read how one forum thinks it matters, but another forum thinks it doesn't.

    I know this has been hashed-out many times in the Tone Freaks section.
     
  11. bobswinea

    bobswinea Senior Member

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    OMG!!!! NOT THAT! :shock: Leave us SOME myths we can solidly believe in as the Truth. Whatever will we talk about between gigs now???? Women? Alcohol? Music? Sports? :shock: :laugh2:
     
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  12. Rodolphe

    Rodolphe Senior Member

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    here it is:

    coupling caps - Telecaster Guitar Forum
     
  13. bigsnaketex

    bigsnaketex Senior Member

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    I'd rather listen to the arguments - I think they're much more fascinating!!

    But on another note, I've found that if you leave your tone knob on 10, it really doesn't matter!!

    My Historic Les Paul's and my 55 Tele are the only guitars I ever use the tone knobs on because they seem to be the only ones that work right.
     
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  14. The_Sentry

    The_Sentry Senior Member

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    If you leave it up all the way..and all the time...then what difference does it make?
     
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  15. Rodolphe

    Rodolphe Senior Member

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    i'd say none, if the pots are 100% efficient.
    some will say there's always a tiny bit of electrons that will leak from the pot through the caps, and so on... but honnestly, with everything on 10, it should be unnoticeable
     
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  16. EDS1275

    EDS1275 Banned

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    I had replaced all the single coils in my tele and strat a while back with noiseless sc's.

    I bought from Bill & Becky Lawrence pups. They came with some tonal circuit suggestions which I explored. This involved placing a resistor and capacitor in parallel across the volume leads. The resistor brought the 250k pots values down to something like 175k and the capacitor did the treble thing when turning down volume.

    I went to a local electronic hardware outlet near me and bought me bags of cheapo ceramic caps and resistors. Something like 20 in a bag for 2 or 3 dollars.
    All I can say is these guitars sound mighty damn fine!
     
  17. kasu

    kasu Senior Member

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    Nah...maybe my daughter can make some Christmas decorations out of them.... :)
     
  18. Rodolphe

    Rodolphe Senior Member

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    double post
     
  19. Rodolphe

    Rodolphe Senior Member

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    I'll take 2 too. I think i have 0.022 spare ceramics in exchange
     
  20. Ginger Beer

    Ginger Beer Senior Member

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    I replaced the old caps in my guitar with PIO caps and to my amazement, the guitar sounded exactly the same. I wanted to head a big difference but I couldn't hear even the tinniest of change.
    Honestly, switching from a thick pick to a thin pick resulted in a far greater audible difference than switching to PIO caps.

    Remember these...guys swore up and down they sounded "warmer". At $112 a set, they should after losing all that cold hard cash.

    http://www.musiciansfriend.com/accessories/gibson-historic-bumblebee-capacitors-2-pack

    "Straight from Gibson Guitar's Historic Re-issue guitars come Gibson's new Historic Spec series—parts that have been specially designed to replicate the original parts used by Gibson in the late 1950s.

    This two-pack of .022 mfd Gibson Bumblebee Capacitors look, perform, and sound just like the original capacitors that were used on late-'50s Gibson Les Pauls and vintage SGs. Famous for their tone (and their stripes!), the Historic Spec Bumblebee Capacitors are specially made for Gibson and can help you achieve that sweet, full tone that Gibson's legendary instruments are famous for. "

    [​IMG]
     
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