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Discussion in 'Historics & Reissues' started by jenton70, Dec 22, 2017.
Laughed too hard at that.
EDM and Rap is where most kids are at today. The big thing now with them are "mixes" on youtube.
Kids want to touch and scroll an electronic handheld device, not press steel against steel on a piece of wood. It's a virtual world now. Apparently everything else is boring and one dimensional to them.
Several months ago my friend said his son was interested in learning the guitar. I invited them over, brought them into my guitar room where I had all the eye candy out in the open. His kid did not look too impressed at all. It appeared to me the sunburst guitars were the least attractive to him. The first thing he asked me was if I had an acoustic guitar. I went through the motions plugged in and played a few riffs which his dad, my friend, obviously enjoyed more. With much reserves I let him borrow an Ibanez RG I've been holding onto for one of my kids and my little 1 watt Blackstar amp. A few months later my friend gave it all back to me saying his kid was showing no interest.
Last night watching the New Years Eve countdown I saw an R&B/Rap band performing. All I could hear were the piano, drums a guy rapping and a girl singing, yet there was a guy in the background dancing around while wearing a LP? I guess it was a lifestyle moment. Maybe Henry J is onto something...?
I still say for us on here it doesn't really matter. As long as we are around there will be buyers, sellers and interest. I don't know about you guys. But 37 years ago I didn't decide to play guitar because I wanted to change the world.
I prefer PRE Custom Shop Gibsons..ya know when they were ALL supposed to be top notch..not this artificial good and better thing they came up with...
I agree, I enjoy my Custom Shop guitars a lot,..... but LOVE my "crappy" Norlins.
I think in today’s music industry the playing field is more level, but the market is more saturated. The income just isn’t there for custom instruments. I also think many low-tier working musicians are more likely to buy a premium acoustic rather than an electric.
From an amateur perspective, I think a combination of stagnant wages over the years combined with increasing prices have priced the customs out of the market.
I might add that many people who "can't afford" Custom Shop guitars still buy two or three at 1/3 or half the price of one Custom Shop model. So technically, they could afford it, but choose to buy more than one guitar.
We might underestimate how many people actually can buy a 4k instrument at some point or points in their lifetime. A lot of bucks are spent on entertainment, electronics, art (CDs, books), etc. If someone is really attracted by an instrument, they can allocate the money that way, I think. That helped me buy my guitars. Just focus, to some extent.
When millions and millions of iPhones are sold every year with a price higher than many maker's base models, I don't think it tells the whole story to say: CS guitars will be done – no one has the money for them.
For what it's worth, higher end guitars may be what's left if people stop buying their "first guitars".
Saying "the guitar is dead" is bad phrasing. It will be dead at some point. I don't doubt that. Many instruments come and go. And I don't care. But dropping sales do not equal less playing. It may just mean many have bought a guitar or a few and are playing them now, buying amps, pedals, etc.
"The guitar is dead" sounds as if we should better buy ten new ones today now because they won't be here tomorrow. I think thats BS. We're probably all gone before the guitar is dead.
Would we expect sales to go up? I personally am stunned by the fact Gibson is still selling many guitars at all. When you have the "Custom Shop bug", isn't it strange to see someone buying a 1k Gibson guitar every other year when the collection comes out? I think many in the historic crowd could not care less about these "entry level" guitars.
Just a few of my thoughts. Nothing serious.
Don't mean any disrespect but for a "true historic" best option is to give up on Gibson's poor pricing and quality and get an early '80's Burny LP. I paid $635 for mine and it smokes any Gibson I've ever played, including my old 1970 Gibson LP Custom
Can't read 10 pages worth, but yeah I think 14 was the peak. At a certain point I owned 5 historics all of basically the same spec in different colors. R6, 7, 8,9 etc all at the same time. The market was totally saturated and most people got what they wanted. For whatever reason Gibson went off the rails. Now I just have a HM RDS and an R6. I play Fender's 90% of the time anyway and thrown my McCarty 594 and I have all I'll even need.
This all sounds like Harley Davidson....
If you want your kids to play guitar, leave one or two around the house.
And tell them don't touch them.
Smoke and mirrors, Cork-sniffery and guitars that will hang on the wall/in their case and never be played (I'm guilty of these offenses). I'm over 40 and don't gig.
Nice first post. Welcome to the forum.....troll much? LOL. Nothing wrong with being happy with your 80's Burny, that's awesome. But don't come around blathering about Gibson's "poor quality" and such. I've owned upwards of 200 of these Reissue's over the years, and the closest I've come to "bad quality" was the pots and caps needing to be swapped out. There was ONE other issue with ONE guitar, but, that ended up working out to my benefit thanks to Gibson customer service.
I couldn't agree more, Jon. Maybe that is a sock puppet of the MIJ vs Historics guy haha.
I think most of the MIJ hype stems from poor production of US instruments during the 70s and early 80s when corporate entities (Norlin and CBS) upped production while cutting costs. Both Gibson and Fender were pretty much 'screwing the pooch' under corporate management for over a decade.
At that time the high end 100 120 Tokais by far surpassed Fenders US made guitars. With the current Gibson Custom Shop models and Fender AVRI runs US production is back on top.
The drawback to MIJ in the late 70s early 80s was that those top tier 100s and 120s we're priced pretty closely to what a
vintage guitar would cost. Tokai, Fernandes, Burny, and ESP/Navigator all made very fine instruments. I think we don't see many of those today in the states because the real deal vintage models these guitars were copying were widely available.
In '81 the local Mom & Pop started carrying the Tokai line. The 120 series was $1050 retail new. Selling price was ~$850-$900. My mate was looking for a nitro strat at the time. He looked for a few months and scored a '64 Strat in well played condition for $900 out of the Trading Post.
I think he made the right decision. Most players I ran across at that time were of the same mind. And his strat was a far better investment than any of the top tier MIJs.
The MIJ makes more sense when the originals are out of reach cost wise. That happened in the latter 80s but it wasn't long after that both Gibson and Fender started getting back to those original designs and improved quality.
Do you still own your SB or no?
Things feel like they are on the downswing.while some may claim a visionary reason,the complete truth is usually somewhat more diverse.I'll go with the old adage,whatever goes up....must come down.The reverse is certainly true.