The Effect CAB IRs have on the preset

Discussion in 'Amp Modeling' started by frankv, Feb 23, 2017.

  1. frankv

    frankv What Are You Waiting For? Double Platinum Supporter V.I.P. Member

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    I have the time and desire to answer your question. :thumb:

    Problem is I don' the knowledge to address your question. You want to reach out to Cybermgk. He is the Kemper guru around these parts. Me? I'm an AXE FX2 player. :wave:
     
  2. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    @kmaster68
    Just saw this. K, to load IRs to the Kemper, you need to get a software tool called Kemper Cab Maker. It takes IRs and converts them to a format that is useable by the Kemper. More to the point, it converts them into the same format that the Kemper creates when it profiles an Amp. Even when profiling an entire amp chain and making a 'studio profile' (amp and speaker and mic, useable straight too direct recording, FRFR solutions, the Kemper separates the amp portion from the cab portion while profiling. So i's converted to that same format.

    At any rate, once converted, you put them on your USB stick, formatted by the Kemper, in the shard folder, and then put that in. You'll get a prompt on the screen associated with a button to import. Once imported, you can see by pressing the CAB button, and using the Browse knob.

    Load any rig. Press the CAB button to bring the CAB settings into focus. Now use the Browse knob to roll through them. THis will include all the CABs from the different profiles you have loaded AND any IRs you have added. stop on one, try how it sounds, use the knob to select another, onward. If you find one you like, exit out and then save that rig as a new name.

    Cab Maker Download
     
  3. Pwrmac7600

    Pwrmac7600 Premium Member

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    So just because I am curious. Does the Kemper allow you to use more than one cab at a time?
    Like if i wanted to load a 4X12 with V30's and a 4X12 of T75's?

     
  4. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Yes and no. Not if they were two separate IRs or (from profiles) Cab Modules. Think of it as having just ONE CAB block on the Axe. (See my Opus), and only in one particular place in the signal path. That is one of the Axe's big advantages, is the signal path of whatever you want.

    BUT, if you had a cab profile or converted IRs that were both, you could fill that one spot with it.
     
  5. Pwrmac7600

    Pwrmac7600 Premium Member

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    And I assume Kemper doesn't yet make anything like Fractal's cablab to blend your own ir mixes?
     
  6. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Nope. But, could use it to mix and save as a new IR, then use the Kemper tool to convert and load that single IR.
     
  7. skysc

    skysc Senior Member

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    IMO; IR are magical . i was looking for Metallica tones and found a pack of IR for guitar rig 5 .. it has IR for almost each album . i load the IR into the Reflektor of the Guitar rig 5 and can get very close to hetfield sound for each album ( from Ride the lightning to black album with And justice for all dryness distortion in between . Before downloading IR i always thought patch and simulation from Guitar Rig and other guitar software were weak and i was barely using the software . Now it sound alot more profesionnal . For Axe fx II and Kemper .. silent underground studio does ¨Clone tones¨for many artist Metallica , megadeth , pantera etc.. . they sound really close from what you hear on the album . With IR i've found software sim and modelers achieving better result then using the ¨real amp and preamp¨that the artist use to record . I dont have a Axe fx II or kemper but i can only imagine how good they must be .
     
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  8. Bobby Mahogany

    Bobby Mahogany Senior Member

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    This here shows one big truth I have witnessed over the years:
    Many musicians develop their own tone (I call it "the tone in your head") and are after it no matter what.
    They will like any piece of equipment that has "that tone" inside of it.
    Whether a guitar or an amp, they will always try to "zero in" on "that tone".
    Sometimes it's theirs, sometimes it's an imitation of some other musician, popular or not.

    I remember Tony Visconti saying that "Marc Bolan could plug into anything and sound like himself".
    It's part of the same "the tone in your head" search saga.

    I find the fact that you ended up sounding like your Rivera gig with the Helix quite interesting.
    In fact, you completely succeeded with the Helix because you found "the tone in your head" with it.
    Congratulations!

    Still, many also want to experiment different tones for different songs and the digital possibilities
    are endless. Another plus for digital.
    Of course, like with anything, "Your mileage may vary".
     
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  9. jageya

    jageya Senior Member

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    tube amp limited compared to this
    ? oh yes of course.! but the ir's seem to me just eq variations really and there is something to be said about a tube amp just having what it comes with-easy peazy.
    Can you imagine EVH sitiing with his modeler going thru 1000 ir's? All that time wasted he could be playing
     
  10. frankv

    frankv What Are You Waiting For? Double Platinum Supporter V.I.P. Member

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    If you are the type where you want what comes of the box... then tubes are for you. In my case I wanted more. This technology gives me more.
     
  11. mmd

    mmd Senior Member

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    I second Frank. Why are you over here talking so much about tube amps? I keep seeing people responding to you - and there seems to be a lot of mention, on your end, about tube amps. What would you like to know?

    There is A LOT of knowledge in this forum that can help you get going. But, a lot of it is similar to having complete faith in God....

    You just have to accept it and BELIEVE it is true - despite what your analytic mind tells you.

    If you can get there, no matter WHAT science tells you, you will have unshakeable faith. Same can be said for how to get the MOST from a high-end modeling rig....

    Just something to think about.
     
  12. frozenotter

    frozenotter Premium Member Premium Member

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    Why does that sound like amp modeling and not an actual tube amp?

    (tongue and cheek, fellas)
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2018
  13. mmd

    mmd Senior Member

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    User error, more likely than not. As I continue to help people with theirs, they are setting it up wrong
     
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  14. Mr Insane

    Mr Insane Senior Member

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    Nah, he wasted his time tearing apart old Marshalls and modifying them for a slight sound difference.

    As a person who went from digital boards to analog and tube amps, I will be making the switch to profiling/modeling.

    Tube amps are great when they work. But they are just so damn fussy.
     
  15. Stuff

    Stuff Senior Member

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    You can use both tube amps and digital modellers with cab IRs. They're very convenient for those of us who don't have somewhere to run a dimed amp through a physical cab - just like digital modellers can be.

    A cab IR is a cabinet + speaker + microphone(s) + mic positioning + room bleed. It's a lot more than just an EQ variation - both in what goes into it, and that it has a time element to it.

    Never changed out the speaker on an amp? Never changed the tubes? Never had a head and run it through different cabs? These are all things amp owners do to chase their tone. Amps are only stuck with how they are from new if you want them to be.

    Choosing an IR is the equivalent to taking an amp into a studio, trying out their cabs, going through their mic locker, and figuring out which combination you want for the session. That's something that any recording artist has had to go through.

    Apart from being digital, the main difference is that you have to be both artist and engineer when you're introducing any digital element to your signal chain - especially IRs. That's not for everyone. It's easy for folks who are comfortable with all this to forget that.

    As for EVH ... We're all products of our time. The things EVH did with the technology of the day, to chase his tone, are well documented. There's a whole industry or three that only exists today because of the innovations he came up with back in the day.

    If he was a kid today, maybe he'd have to use a modeller. Maybe he wouldn't have the opportunity to own or experiment with valve amps. Maybe he wouldn't want to. Maybe he'd prefer how immediate digital is for experimenting with. Maybe he just wouldn't be able to hear the difference.

    Some people prefer digital, some prefer analog, some prefer a hybrid approach. There are many reasons why, from what you can and can't hear, to preference, to circumstances, to opportunity. There's no "correct" or "superior" choice, there's only what's right for you at the time.
     
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  16. KenG

    KenG Senior Member

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    I haven't tried IRs on the Helix yet. Changing cab selections, using dual cabs and blending, changing mics and mic distances also has the power to really change the sound. I'm finding I'm a fan of having at least a ribbon mic on the cab.
     

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