R8/R9 Pups Just Ordinary

Discussion in 'Historics & Reissues' started by theebony, Sep 7, 2017.

  1. BBD

    BBD Senior Member

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    Typical BB1s read at ~7.8k. The CBs I took out of my R9 read at ~7.8k, so it is, as you say, a possibility that all Gibson actually did was swap the BB1 A2 for an A3 and voila, you have a CB.
     
  2. BBD

    BBD Senior Member

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    It was probably a BB3, in that case. BB3s have the highest wind (5100 / 5800 screw/slug IIRC) and rate at ~8.7k
     
  3. leifpaul

    leifpaul Senior Member

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    I found the BB`s in my les paul to be so bright it hurted my ears,,just sharp supertrebly unbearable . and yes I adjusted both the pickups and the amp. when people describes their gibson with BB`s as having a blanket over the amp, and it sounded muddy and whatnot..got me wondering if maybe I should have had that blanket over my amp, lol
     
  4. ntotoro

    ntotoro Member

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    I don't know. The coils are at least different in some way, also. I've had two guitars with BB's (both with a 1/2 set) and three with Custombuckers (two "standard" and one Wildwood guitar, slightly underwound). All three Custombucker guitars obviously (to me... I've been playing the same rig for 12 years and know it like the back of my hand) had unbalanced coils. The BB's did not. It was apparent by the level of hum.

    Nick
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2017
  5. freebyrd 69

    freebyrd 69 Silver Supporter Premium Member

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    Which amp? Also, that brightness is great for cutting a mix.
     
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  6. alnico59

    alnico59 Premium Member

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    I agree with this ^ What sounds pleasing to the ear in the bedroom doesn't always work out in a live setting. IIRC, at home with the BB's I was running the tone on the bridge between 5-6 and the neck some where around 7-8. Kind of standard with 50's wiring and any PAF type pickups really.
     
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  7. BBD

    BBD Senior Member

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    How do you know?

    So Gibson is lying?

    My understanding is that BB1 BB2 and BB3 have hotter winds on the slug coil.
     
  8. Robert Arthur

    Robert Arthur Senior Member

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    The PAF's were all over the place in terms of hotness and clarity, we are romanticizing something that has lots of variables and is nearly impossible to quantify. That being said, driven hard, I find TheBB1/2 pickup combo to be lacking compared to 57 classics and 490set. The 490r/490t set is the closest to PAF pickups I have played and heard , including very expensive "boutique" pickups.
     
  9. Robert Arthur

    Robert Arthur Senior Member

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    may be because many BB1 and BB2 pickups are unpotted.
     
  10. alnico59

    alnico59 Premium Member

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    All this BB talk got me thinking...? I still have the set of BB 1 & 2 from my '04 R7. Probably the best out of the bunch I had and perfectly aged. I was thinking... I have boutiques in all four. One set I feel is not a good fit so I might try the BB's first before buying something else. I recently replaced the caps with PIO "greenies" so things should be improved somewhat.

    I agree with others on the BB's having a different (not bad IMO) midrange frequency. The thing is I hear that type of tone on some of the classic rock recordings. I think I can make it work in some situations. What's the sense of having four LP's sounding as close as possible? Just thinking out loud.
     
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  11. BBD

    BBD Senior Member

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    Do it :)
     
  12. BBD

    BBD Senior Member

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    Might be because A2 sounds different to A3.
     
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  13. freebyrd 69

    freebyrd 69 Silver Supporter Premium Member

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    You are kidding? Have you actually heard PAF pickups.....in person? The 490's would be the absolute furthest thing from a PAF you could find.
     
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  14. EdmundGTP

    EdmundGTP Junior Member

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    I was unimpressed with the pickups in my '09 R8. The Seymour Duncan Bonamassa Skinner Burst pickups I replaced them with are VERY impressive.
     
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  15. ARandall

    ARandall Senior Member

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    Wouldn't be the first time......

    In this case the winder Zhangbucker has examined many of the BB's in his time. What he has said about his experiences is that the BB's were no more unbalanced than the normal variations that he would expect to find in a pickup designed to have a balanced wind.
     
  16. BBD

    BBD Senior Member

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    Ah, fabled Gibson QC perhaps? That might explain why there are a fair number of reports of midsy and dull BBs. The rarer, on-spec BBs would be the bright ones. Maybe CBs are just on-spec unbalanced coil BBs with an A3?

    All I know is that if you want a decent PAF tone you pay for a decent PAF clone from a boutique winder. Leaving it to Gibson seems to be pretty much random.
     
  17. ARandall

    ARandall Senior Member

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    There is seemingly that variance with CB's too. There are people who have had such varying results from either RI's and some of the CC's with them.....and I'm talking the same person with seeming polar opposite pickups. You get one report saying they are dynamic and touch sensitive in one guitar and dead flat and weak in another.
    Now having had numerous Burst clones that I have built myself and various PAF clones from many winders I can certainly attest to the variability of guitars in the way that clones respond. But I am wondering if the CB's have a 'CC wind'.....like going from the Duncan Pearly gates Custom Shop edition from the factory floor version.
     
  18. BBD

    BBD Senior Member

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    I think most would agree that 'stock' CBs are a variable bunch (whether or not they agree that CBs may simply be BBs with A3 magnets). But as to the Great and Unresolved Mystery of whether Gibson actually does special CB winds for some / all CCs... goodness only knows.

    IIRC Gibson loaded CC #8 The Beast with a BB2 in the neck and BB3 in the bridge rather than custom-wind hot CBs for it. So perhaps custom-wound CBs for Collectors Choice never really happened. Gibson is artfully vague about what it actually says about this, isn't it?
     
  19. alnico59

    alnico59 Premium Member

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    I believe the BB2 is 5500. That's a lot of winds. And why they have such a fat sound. Some say they're bright. But compared to my PAF replicas they sound fat and dark. No Tele on steroids with those.

    I also read, possibly on here, when questioned about that somebody in the CS said (and I'm paraphrasing) they wanted more of a rock guitar.
     
  20. BBD

    BBD Senior Member

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    I think BB2s are 4160 / 4220 (screw / slug) and rate ~8.2k but I'm not absolutely sure these are correct numbers. And yes, they don't have the clarity of good PAF clones (at least not to my ears).

    Well, the big thing about the Beast is that it is unusually loud, but just sticking a BB2 and a BB3 in it is hardly a painstaking recreation of the original tone from the pickups on up (eg. hot custom-wound Custom Buckers just for CC#8). This does rather hint that Gibson isn't making custom wound CBs for individual CC models.
     

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