Modeling Amp Shootout?

Discussion in 'Amp Modeling' started by JonMan94, Jan 15, 2013.

  1. dspelman

    dspelman Senior Member

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    If I had to choose, I'd probably take the Mustang as well.

    That said, I've gone a different direction with a practice amp.

    Several years ago, Atomic Research (now all tied up with Fractal)put out a series of powered speakers that had a tube power amp connected to a hot-swappable bay that would take any of the four modelers that were out at the time -- the M-audio, the Behringer thing that looks like a guitar body, the Vox and the Line 6 Pod. There were adapters for the bay that would secure them into a box that could be swapped in and out of the speaker. In effect, the addition of the modeler turned it into a tidy combo amp, so that all you have to do is walk in, plug it into the wall, plug in the guitar and hit the ON button.

    [​IMG]

    In addition, there's an FX loop, so you can plug any foot pedal modeler (or any other preamp) into the FX return. But wait, there's more. Since some of the modelers output stereo, you can run a pair of these in stereo from one modeler simply by running a cable out of the one that houses the modeler to another identical cabinet.

    It came in three variants: a 112-18 (18W EL84 power amp with a 200W single 12" in a closed-back cabinet), a 112-50 (50W 6L6 powered amp with that same 200W single 12" in a closed back PORTED cabinet) and a 212-50 (50W 6L6 powered amp with two 200W 12" speakers in a closed back ported cabinet that's nearly as big as a 4x12).

    [​IMG]

    I've run these with four different Pods -- the XT bean, the X3 bean, the XT Bass and the current Pod HD bean. The 200W speaker is an eminence model designed for fairly wide frequency response (not a guitar-specific speaker with a mid bump and rolloffs at 110Hz and 4000Hz), but it's not FRFR. I added a 400W-capable piezo tweeter (no crossover required) on an L-pad that restores and disperses the highs (no icepick).

    [​IMG]

    The Bass Pod XT includes a couple of dozen bass amp models, a couple of dozen cabinet models and a few microphone models, and allows me to practice bass on these amps without risking a blown speaker. The porting really supports the speaker's bottom end. These things will even handle low-volume gigs (churches, etc.) and can work as an onstage monitor (there are DI outputs on the Pods, as well as USB outputs for recording and earphone outputs if you want to run even quieter). I picked up the one I have for under $80.

    The XT and X3 Pods provide models and FX that don't exist on the HD, and they were cheap as well (both under $100 used when I bought them, and I've had them a long (ish) time).

    The HD does pretty much everything that the HD500 does except support the Variax guitars. It's smaller and easier to stuff in a gig bag, works better on a desk, etc. You can run a foot pedal (FBV Express II or Shortboard II) out to the front of the stage via an ethernet cable. No AC required, no expensive guitar cables (if you have a wireless, it can stay in the backline with the Pod electronics) running across stage. And you have everything you really need (FX switching, bank switching, channel switching, tap tempo, expression pedal, tuner display with muting) right there. You can bend over or kneel down to make changes on the foot pedal if you want, or you can walk back to the backline and do it standing up on the Pod itself. And except for the 112-18 (which has a slightly slanted top) you can stack them.
     
  2. FFXIhealer

    FFXIhealer Senior Member

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    Wait, which '65 Fender model? There's, like, 3 of them. LOL (Princeton Reverb, Deluxe Reverb, and Twin Reverb)
     
  3. Malikon

    Malikon アストロモンスター V.I.P. Member

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    Whatever the stock model (with fuse update), third from the top with a green light.

    I think it's the 65 deluxe.

    That with the gain on 10 is sweet. Crank the bass and get the mids and treble where you like, then you can control a lot with your pick attack and vol knob. Roll it all the way and pick really hard and you'll get crunch. Back it off and pick light and it cleans up.

    I've never had a SS/Modeling amp that could do that well.

    It doesn't do it as well as a tube amp, but the fact that it does anything at all along those lines impresses me.

    It tells me modeling is coming along, and probably in 10-15 years you wont be able to tell the difference between a tube or modeling amp.













    ...though tubes will always be cooler. :thumb:
     
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  4. dspelman

    dspelman Senior Member

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    Well, hotter, actually.
     
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  5. River

    River Senior Member

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    [​IMG]

    You're welcome to come out here and humiliate your preconceptions any time.

    You KNOWS that.
     
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  6. de Payens

    de Payens Senior Member

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    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eu_8USz3IvY]Line 6 Vetta II HD - Metal - YouTube[/ame]
     
  7. de Payens

    de Payens Senior Member

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    Oops double post!
     
  8. River

    River Senior Member

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    Wanna say something about your first post? 'Cause I'm not going to listen to that video just because you posted it.
     
  9. Malikon

    Malikon アストロモンスター V.I.P. Member

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    Well I've played SS 90% of my life and only had a Marshall and a Bogner tube amp before the Soul Tramp came down from heaven on angel wings.

    Now that I can finally truly control my gain saturation just with volume knob and my hands,...I'm in heaven.

    ...which is pretty damn cool. :thumb:

    My limited experience with the other 2 tube amps just left me enjoying my SS amps. The ST is the first one that's lived up to the hype. (to me)
     
  10. FFXIhealer

    FFXIhealer Senior Member

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    That's the '65 Twin Reverb, actually. The Deluxe Reverb is going to have a lot more grit with the Gain knob at 10. And that's without getting into the BIAS and SAG settings on the amp model. Since you're using a Mustang 1/2 model, you have to use FUSE to get into all of that.

    If you ever do get into FUSE editing, try a Marshall JCM800 model (British '80s) with the 4x12M cabinet, push the BIAS to somewhere between +15% and +25%. Turn your Mids up a bit and pull back on the Treble to deal with the G12T-75 speaker simulation (that's what the 4x12M models) and it should sound snarly, even with the gain ~6. It's one of my favorite presets for tone on my Mustang V half-stack.

    There's also a preset on the Fender FUSE Community website that tries to emulate an ENGL Powerball II amp. That preset blows my mind. It's the first time I've heard the Mustang with the Peavey 5150 (Metal 2000) amp that didn't sound fizzy and fake. And it's LOUD! Oh my God, is it loud.
     
  11. Malikon

    Malikon アストロモンスター V.I.P. Member

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    [​IMG]

    Tools like me need knobs. :D
    [​IMG]

    :thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:
     
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  12. Rhust

    Rhust Senior Member

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    i say this is the biggest leap for me on modelling amps... when I get time to sit and play, I don't want to futz with settings and stuff, but there are so many options on modellers, that's exactly what I end up doing... I turn into a little kid and want to play and see what happens...


    my buddy has a mustang v2 though, and I gotta say I was pretty impressed with the sounds and didn't need to mess with it too much... and once you get presets ironed out... you are good to go...

    the vypyr I had I felt like it sounded different every time I played it, and one preset would get ironed out one time, and sound different the next... it was too complicated.... I've even thought about a netbook or something being a permanent part of the mustang, because I felt like editing the settings went quicker that way.
     
  13. Malikon

    Malikon アストロモンスター V.I.P. Member

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    I updated FUSE when I first got the Mustang I, but I never did anything like that again.

    I just pick an amp setting (65 Fender, 60's Vox, 80's Marshall, 90's Mesa) , turn off all the effects, and dial in the eq and gain to be what I want to hear.

    it's a great little amp. Pretty shocking considering the price.

    I know it does a lot more then I do with it, but I've always been able to dial in a practice/jam sound I like with one of those 4 models. :thumb:

    Only bad experience I ever had with it I took it to a jam one night and it was undersized, (didn't realize there'd be a bassist and piano player there) so I had to dime the volume.

    Which made the little guy 'shake',...which at some point rotated the effects knob while playing.

    So suddenly sh*t just got really weird!!!

    Was funny though.

    ...couple weeks later I bought a VOX pathfinder 15r (for the same reason, practice and small jams),....and I've really come to like that one too. Usually a Tube Screamer or some type of boost pedal is all I need. And no 'vibrations turning on effects' have ever happened.

    ....ok maybe once the vibrations nudged the tremelo knob. :laugh2:

    ...some days I think I should tape knobs into place. (it only seems to happen with amps that have knobs 'on top' instead of on the face of the amp.)
     
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  14. FFXIhealer

    FFXIhealer Senior Member

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    Dude, you should allot about 1 hour to sit down with your Mustang amp and a computer and a guitar. You say you keep having to turn effects off. Why don't you just edit the preset so it doesn't have any effects, then SAVE IT to the amp with FUSE? That way, the next time you turn to that preset, no effects. That's what I did with mine.

    In fact, I replaced ALL 24 presets on my Mustang II with effects-free tones, mainly because I prefer not having shit like choruses and reverbs in there. A compressor, though, somehow adds a whole lot of clarity to the VOX and Twin Reverb models.

    So now, I can go and sit with my amp and not have to plug a computer up to it. I haven't had to hook up my Netbook to the Mustang II since last year, and THAT was mostly to back up the presets so other people on-line (who apparently can't take some time out of their lives to LEARN to use something they spent money on) could not hate their modeling amps. Hell, I did an in-depth guide on the Fender Forums over these things and FUSE. It's really not that hard, people.

    And that new v.2...man, I had a chance to demo a Mustang I version of it at the local dealer. I LOVE the Orange OR50 model (British Colour). It's thick and sounds A LOT like the Orange amps that were sitting right next to it in the store. I didn't care much for the '60s Thrift, though.
     
  15. Malikon

    Malikon アストロモンスター V.I.P. Member

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    Honestly I just don't care. It takes me less then 5 seconds to turn on the amp and get playing. :laugh2:

    It's just not a priority

    the less knobs and things on an amp, the more I appreciate it. :D

    I don't like tweaking I just want to play.

    Mixing computers with music makes me feel all squirmy inside. I don't care for it.
     
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  16. Ddavid

    Ddavid Senior Member

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    Amen!
     
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  17. Ddavid

    Ddavid Senior Member

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    Is there a list anywhere on what real amps are being emulated? Also, is there a list Detailing all 100 of the v.2 presets? (band, song, amp being emulated)

    Also, any insight into finding user contributed presets that don't suck? I've tried a bunch and many kinda fall apart if I turn the amp up or down. I have a few that I tweaked myself and I use them quite frequently, but I like discovering cool presets that nail a certain song or riff.
     
  18. Rhust

    Rhust Senior Member

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    this... it's the reason I like the HT5 so much :dude:
     
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  19. zslane

    zslane Senior Member

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    Modellers aren't for people who want to play only one or two types of amps and only need one or two types of guitar tones. Modellers are for people who want to plug into any one (or two, possibly in stereo) of 50-100 different amps, hook up multitudes of effects, and hook up to any kind of cabinet with any sort of speaker combination they can think of, all without taking up more space than one large combo amp. A different set of tones is just a button push (or dial nudge) away.

    Most dudes in forums like this one (and the Marshall amp forums) where vintage this and classic that are the preferred sounds, aren't going to need the power and flexibility of a modeller. Nor are they going to have the patience to construct signal chains and tone rigs for lots of different contexts. They are the plug 'n play crank to ten crowd. Modellers are complete overkill for them. However, it is important to realize that just because modellers aren't useful to them, that doesn't mean they aren't immensely useful in a broader sense.
     
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  20. Malikon

    Malikon アストロモンスター V.I.P. Member

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    "different strokes for different folks."
     

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