Ok, last comment before we let this go. I think we should clear the air. It is always difficult to see the objective view point. There are two populations of people that regularly post in this section. A set that have been friends for years and moved within the circle of vintage dealers including you, Frank, Tom, Joe G, Eric, Charlie, Gil and others and another set of, often younger posters who are getting into vintage guitars or maybe have been but not as invested....while I have been buying and selling guitars since I was 17 (now 43) I include myself in this catagory...so here is my take and from personal discussions with several of the regular posters who also make up that catagory, seems to fall in line with theirs as well. The issue here is a combination of things, many of which are only peripherally as a result of actions by JG. I think alot of what Fletch says here is right. JG is to some degree was his own worst enemy as the bravado ingrained in the persona he crafted he was dismissive and often condescending to many posters on the other forum basically taking the "I know everything and you just don't understand what I know" kind of attitude. When you are that agressive and don't treat others with respect, you foster resentment and people are less empathetic when you fail. "Pride goes before the fall" comes to mind. No one knew Joe G authenticated the guitar. He outed himself after not posting for years and preceded to tell everyone who questined it, it was right and if they doubted it, it basically just showed how stupid they were. And that included people who are in "circle" and on the list above. If it didn't come accross to those who know him that way, that is sure how it came across to those who aren't in the inner circle. You treat others with no respect then you have to expect a backlash. I think had Joe just came out and said "this is what I saw, I understand how people could look at it differently, in my judgment it is real, others are free to disagree" and left it there, then people would have still disagreed but it might have dropped at that point. I also think as some of his friends rushed to defend him, they were equally agressive. Understandable and to some degree I admire the loyalty. But the whole debate became about loyalty and if whether you were Joe's friend instead of about the guitar...instead of defusing the debate, it just focused it on Joe more and further escalated the defense and attack on those questioning the guitar....many of whom didn't know Joe or really care to discuss him. Then we had people taking somewhat dubious stances like "no guitar can be judged from a photo of any type" and then sack a guitar posted in the same forum the same week from just photos. The whole situation has left a bad taste and why it keeps resurfacing. As I said before, we are all learning and evolving as people...or at least should be and there are many lessons to be learned here including but not limited to how to handle professional mistakes, how to treat those you percieve as less experienced or knowledgable than yourself, and how to treat others who have made a mistake. I for one dont want there to be hard feelings and agree we should move on and return to talking about what brings us here and that is the guitars and players associated with them. Let the healing begin.