ideal rate of twist (MLP firearms and shooting thread)

Discussion in 'The Backstage' started by JMV, May 28, 2010.

  1. Frogfur

    Frogfur Senior Member

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    About my AR-15

    It may seem as like a few here, i might be huge AR fan with a wealth of background concerning them when nothing could be further from the truth. Dont get me wrong, I like the one I have.

    While gunsmithing away thru the 70s and 80s I had only worked on a few of them for one reason or another, but if you have a basic understanding of design and function, you know what they do, and why. Combine that with standard G.I. training, followed by on the job training and they're pretty easy.

    One primary reason was in days past they were pretty expensive new. Add to that there were very little if any accessories for them, and what they cost new, you could have a Winchester, Model 70 in just about any caliber other than the Afericans .375 H&H or the .458. And certainly a Remington 700BDL.

    Additionally, I really had very little use for a rifle like that. I was building Silloutte guns, pin ball .45s right and left. I was, and am of the frame of mind that long distance accuracy equals bolt action.

    But I did have several Mini-14s. The 180 series were great rifles. A better rifle over all compared to the AR platform. Just my opinion soley, and somewhat more suited to what I was doing back then. Those and allot of things with the .243.

    Had a few friends that had a colt and it was fun to shoot one occasionally, but my interests were else where.

    So..how did I come by the weapon I now have ? My son owed me a debit of $1000.00 I called that debt awhile back, and in fact he wanted to square things up. Now I had an AR prior to the one i have now. So I had mentioned that I was considering getting either another mini-14, or an AR-15 to carry in the quad box.
    So about a month later, he shows up and gave me a New S&W 5.56mm. He stated he wanted to get it for me. He also stated that we wanted to get something else but being a new dad, I told him, you know what, consider us squared away.

    Had it not been for that, I would have ended up with the Mini-14 rather than the AR as having an M-14 I am partial to that basic design.

    So I ended up getting one, renewing my friendship with them and went from there.
    They are a lasting design, and effective.
    I'll keep it.
     
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  2. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Senior Member

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    Dave!

    They are a VERY, very good customer..His metal is always clean, beautifully finished, and a joy to work with...

    Fun fact..on our Purchase Orders, it says DELIVER TO BARN. :D

    That's one hell of a barn in my opinion!
     
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  3. Frogfur

    Frogfur Senior Member

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    Remember that most sight bases are cut with either 60° or 65° end mill cutters finished up with sight base files which employ safe sides.

    Standard front and, or back are usually a 60° shoulder x .359" base cutters, but colts are usually 60° and or 65° x .330" base cutters.
    If you are installing Novak low mounts on your .45 acp then you will need 65° shoulder x .495" base cutters.
    There are also 60° x .245" base cutters for much smaller sight applications.


    The thing to remember is that sight dovetails can be cut by hand. Its not that hard. Just because you don't have a milling machine does not mean you cannot install a new sight. Additionally, you can always take you cutter to a machine shop and have them do it as well.
    Concerning the .45 acp, there are special files for fitting and deburring, as well as barrel locking lug fitting.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2017
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  4. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Senior Member

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    Well damn it all to hell.

    Had a couple FTFs with my new M500...seems it is a known issue..there looks like a bad lot of out spec cartridge stops made it out..

    2 things..either needs THOROUGH field strip and clean, or new cartridge stop...hopefully the latter. Could be something as simple as some gunk in the slot making stop protrude just a bit too far and not retract when cycled, allowing shell to chamber, or part itself is out of spec..it WILL chamber if you rack it like you're trying to rip the fore-end off..and does happen intermittently, (which I have thought may be due using cheap shells..and shooting over 300+ of them) but I am not happy with this..I do owe the gun a thorough cleaning..(may have grease, almost like a cosmoline type from factory in receiver) hopefully that and a slight tweak to the stop will work, I may contact Mossberg to see if they will send a new stop and interrupter. Hoping for just cleaning and re-assembly will sort it out. Lesson learned..weapon should have been field stripped, cleaned and lubed first thing..but as crazy as it sounds..I have NEVER owned a NEW firearm..never...I honestly thought it was good to go from the factory..

    But I WILL figure it out and make it work...there's a reason these are the issued shotguns right now..so stay tuned!
     
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  5. Frogfur

    Frogfur Senior Member

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    Just strip it down, clean it, and do a good inspection. Its not huge just annoying. Let us know what the skinny is.
    Question: does it do that with every brand of shotshells ?
     
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  6. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Senior Member

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    Well, I will need to mix it up to ascertain that..mainly the cheaper ones..but I did a search on them...no real FTFs, but said it could be dirty..but the Olin 00 military stuff is supposed to be dirtier from what I have gathered. I have a full mags worth of those I could run, then run the Supremas to compare. Maybe when I was defouling barrel I shoved some shit in the cartridge stop track..I will be able to break her down sometime today.

    The cartridge stop I may be able to vise up at work and give a slight bend to the right..too much and the shells won't be retained in mag tube..too little, and they won't release...
     
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  7. Frogfur

    Frogfur Senior Member

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    I would also recommend getting a couple of boxes of regular Winchester, or Remington shotshells. Run them thru that shotgun and see if you have any fails as well. You need to know.
     
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  8. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Senior Member

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    Roger that!
     
  9. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Which particular sight from Dawson's did you use (Model, size, etc.)?
     
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  10. SteveC

    SteveC Village Elder V.I.P. Member

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    This one... I wanted to make sure that my rear adjustable sight was NOT cranked up too high (like a funny car) and I didn't want too much space between the post and the U of the rear sight.

    So I went with .180" tall and .125" wide.

    Screen Shot 2017-11-12 at 2.25.27 PM.png
     
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  11. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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  12. SteveC

    SteveC Village Elder V.I.P. Member

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    Your very welcome! Yessir!!! I am pretty sure the stock sight might be .100 wide. I seem to remember a lot of space around the post when centered in the rear sight... I hated that. So, I went with the wider size (.125") to eliminate it. The .180" tall may be stock. I didn't have my rear sight 'jacked up' high, so I went with that size.

    It would look like this, when you add the sizes...

    Screen Shot 2017-11-12 at 2.46.46 PM.png
     
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  13. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Mine measures .125 wide.
     
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  14. SteveC

    SteveC Village Elder V.I.P. Member

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    Cool... then, if the rear sight is sitting at the height that you want, you'e gold :)
     
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  15. Frogfur

    Frogfur Senior Member

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    Where there is a will, there is a way.
    Drill press hacks. Easily applied to gun work.
    Drilling centered holes -


    Bolt to Barrel -
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2017
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  16. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Senior Member

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    Back together..cleaned and lubed per MIL-3443-G..it really wasn't THAT dirty..but I used bore solvent and a brush and scrubbed the hell out of it..gave cartridge stop a lil tweak..(really probably didn't do much) it does seem to fit better in the track..I DID find a plastic shaving on the table when I was cleaning it..maybe from the fore-end though..here's the only pic I got, when field stripped.
    20171112_122423_HDR.jpg
    Call me crazy..but I have the urge to practice breaking it down and reassembling in the dark..:naughty: (only slightly kidding..this is my first Mossberg, and once I studied it well, it went back together fairly easily.) My service shotguns I used on watch were all checked out of the armory, and thus were maintained by the Gunner's Mates, I didn't get to mess with them except carry on watch. Though I can say the Gunner's mates were a proud bunch, and you knew your .45 and M-12 or M-500 were very well loved. :D

    So, a plastic shot cup/wad..is that what is causing my barrel fouling? I do usually shoot 100 or so 00 buck at the range when I go..so maybe the plastic is melting against barrel from being heated up? Larry, what's the hack for that..I've heard of putting cleaning rod on a drill..what's best..I only had Hoppe's #9 solvent..maybe not aggressive enough?

    Won't be able to hit the range to live fire test for a couple of days..but even if it's getting hot enough to melt the plastic, the ventilated hand guard works VERY well if you flip it on its back to reload fast..or when dumping a mag tube's worth..even after a couple of 25 rd boxes, hand guard is like a cup of old coffee..
     
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  17. Frogfur

    Frogfur Senior Member

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    What brand of ammo are you shooting ?
    American manufactured ?
     
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  18. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    It is. Have a Dawson on the way.
     
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  19. SteveC

    SteveC Village Elder V.I.P. Member

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    That's great... let me know if you have any questions about installation. I'll be glad to help. If you watched the video, the most important part was knocking off that corner on the dovetail cut on the slide. And, like Dave says, when you are filing the sight for fit, a little goes a long way.

    Looking forward to seeing pix!
     
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  20. 45WinMag

    45WinMag Silver Supporter

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    Took my stepdaughter and her boyfriend shooting today. Mostly the three Glocks in 9mm (with the 19 and 26 suppressed). My stepdaughter was a little more comfortable with my Ed Brown 1911 than previous outings. I'm the only one in the group who liked shooting the .41 Magnum Blackhawk. Stepdaughter won't shoot it and her boyfriend didn't like it.
     
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