Helix - floor or LT?

Discussion in 'Amp Modeling' started by Pop1655, May 10, 2017.

  1. Pop1655

    Pop1655 Premium Member

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    OK. Getting close here. Helix is the choice.
    For what I do, the LT looks like it would do everything I need.
    I've got one "pro" saying "if you don't need the added I/Os, definitely go LT".
    I've got one "pro" saying "get big brother, you'll be glad you did".

    What say the modeling forum?

    LT is all I'll ever need

    Just shut up and do it. Get big brother.
     
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  2. frankv

    frankv What Are You Waiting For? Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Buy best once.. Be happy forever.

    Let me tell you a true story of the years I sold Mercedes Benz cars. I once had a customer come to me looking to buy a Mercedes. He was torn between getting a Lexus or a Mercedes. All I could do is tell me about the attributes of the Mercedes because as a salesman you never bash another companies product.

    The customer went back and forth over the course of a couple days.. Finally, he came in and said

    "I'm getting the Mercedes"

    I had to ask him how he came to that decision. He told me.

    "I thought to myself that if I purchased the Lexus I might be thinking that I should have gotten the Mercedes. But if I got the Mercedes I would never think I should have gotten the Lexus"

    So there ya go POPs.. and that's all I have for you. I'll also add this. I think in your situation it is a mistake to purchase a floor unit. You should be getting the rack version with footswitch. It will be a million times easier to make changes when the unit is up in your desk then if on the floor. Bending down at our age is not very pleasant at times. Of course you could use the computer editing software and a laptop.. But that just complicates things.
     
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  3. tzd

    tzd Senior Member

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    If you need to be able to plug backing tracks into the unit via AUX IN, get the Floor. If you can plug backing tracks directly into your speaker's mixer, get the LT.
     
  4. Pop1655

    Pop1655 Premium Member

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    I don't think it's a Mercedes vs Lexus. It's just which Mercedes.

    Originally, I would have agreed with you on rack. My first "shop" was about the HD500X rack version. I'm not a floor guy and never thought I would be. I've been so comfortable using the HD500X on a shelf that it's made me think floor is the answer, even though I doubt it will ever see a floor. Buttons, knobs, even the pedal work good for me on a shelf.
     
  5. Pop1655

    Pop1655 Premium Member

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    If the aux in was stereo, that would make it a no brainer. The ease of use of the aux in, even in mono, probably deserves some thought.
     
  6. Donal

    Donal ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Premium Member

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    As mmd stated in his thread they are identical soundwise and it was more about the setup on stage that he didn`t like.
    As well as the missing the "scribble scripts" which I also find usefull on stage.

    Pop, As far as I have noticed you don`t play out and don`t play in a band? if so you may bet on just as well with the LT.

    If I was doing it again I would still get the Helix.

    BUT I think you answered it yourself ;)
     
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  7. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Ditto

    If budget is an issue, I would say LT. But, if it isn't an issue, then why not get the top, and KNOW you won't be full of what ifs?

    Got to say, you were/are a rare breed of salesman though. SO many I run across, car, software, have zero reticence in bashing a competitor (albeit in the nicest of ways).
     
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  8. mmd

    mmd Senior Member

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    My two cents....

    If you have scrutinized the feature set, as I am sure you have done, and you say the LT is all you ever need, then you have answered your own question. However, I would have to side with Frank - always with the 'buy once and be happy' thing - if you are going to have the Helix in a fixed place, consider the rack.

    I spent a lot of time in my thread focused on the "stage" aspect of the Rack. Let me share my "home" experiences with it.....

    Another reason I went with the rack format was when looking at the floor unit, I was not seeing an ergonomical way I could utilize it my studio. I did not want to do all of my editing via the laptop. I wanted ease of use. I wanted to be able to reach over and have access to the panel. At first I balked at the added expense of the Rack AND Control together compared to the floor. I spent some time weighing my immediate needs vs. the long-term happiness I would have if I went with the floor unit.....

    For studio work I felt the floor would be too awkward to use. If you can't tell from my posts about this, I am an organization/tidiness freak. Things HAVE to be neat and tidy or I am not in my best mode for performance - live or in the studio. I decided to suck it up and purchase the rack unit. Originally I was going to try to make it work with my Ground Control Pro since I already had it. The general consensus was that it WOULD work, but I would be limiting access to the Helix's feature set. I groaned - A LOT - but sucked it up and ordered the control.

    Here was the ultimate benefit for home use (which the Helix gets EVERYDAY) - I can kick back in my chair, scroll easily through presets, reach over and tweak if I so desire, save easily, AND have access to all the benefits of the buttons. I can move the control to different places (or even disconnect it since I don't HAVE to use it) depending on the seating position I NEED in the moment.

    IF I am doing serious editing or backing up of set lists, rearranging setlists, updates, etc - I put the laptop on the rack and do my work. When I am done, laptop goes back to its location in the studio and I am back to using the Helix to do everything.

    Now, here are some "home use" observations for the LT.....gotta keep things fair!!

    I instantly felt it a hassle to bend over to tweak presets. After about 5 minutes, I grabbed the laptop and hooked it up so I could tweak easier. This created a slight issue in that the laptop was away from the Helix, and the Helix had to be constantly moved for me to be able to see the laptop and then utilize the buttons on the Helix for checking my snapshots. The LT was JUST big enough to be cumbersome on the top of the desk. Once I made that move, access to the laptop became a bigger issue.

    The mess with the cabling was an issue for me - I am sure I could have made it work, but to dive right in and start playing with the LT, I had a power cable sticking out...the XLR cable (which I pulled from my rack)...and a guitar cable. While to MOST that wouldn't be a big deal, it made a mess, especially when you consider I also had the USB cable attached so I could use the laptop for editing. It was not ergonomic in ANY way.

    My solution would have probably been:

    Bring a small table into the room to keep the LT on top of so I could access the editing without bending over...OR, use the small table for the laptop and keep the LT at the bottom edge of the table so I could still use the buttons for switching.

    In either case it would put me in a weird spot because MOST of the time at home I use the Helix into my studio monitors. I wouldn't have been in a place where I would be sitting between my monitors for the equilateral triangle listening.....

    Just things to consider, if you haven't already.....
     
  9. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Excellent post. But dude, that was a lot more than $0.02 worth :D More like a buck fitty
     
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  10. tzd

    tzd Senior Member

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    I just did some more research on the Floor's AUX IN. Conclusion - it's not useful at all for feeding backing tracks. The best way to do it for any Helix type, including LT, is to connect iPhone -> Apple Lightning to USB Camera Adapter -> USB Cable -> Helix USB connector.

    Hence, Helix LT is all that you will need.
     
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  11. AllTheSound

    AllTheSound Premium Member

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    Pop, I was torn like you when i got my Helix If you are comfortable with a floor unit and cost is not the issue go for the full Helix you may never use the extra I/O but the scribble strips are very handy to have for sure (after having them i wouldn't want to go without them) .
    Something else to consider is that Helix Native will be coming out this month or next month and its $399 for non Helix owners , $299 for Helix LT owners and $99 for full Helix or rack owners. If you get at least 10% off the full Helix that will be $1349 and with the $300 discount on Native for all intents and purposes your at $1049 for two Helix's one software, one hardware. It's always nice to have a backup if the need ever arises. Just food for thought.
     
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  12. mdubya

    mdubya Senior Member

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    In my recent search, the Helix LT gave me a lot to think about. It still offers more features than the AX8 and costs less. With the upcoming Memorial Day weekend sales, it will be even less.

    By most reports, the Helix is a match for anything Fractal, tonewise, now. You may have to work a bit harder to get there, but it is apparently a wash in the tone competition.

    On the other hand, I was overwhelmed with how good everything EVERYTHING was about the AX8 as soon as I plugged in.

    No regrets here. But I doubt I would have had any regrets with the Helix LT. Especially if I got it @ $800-$850 with discount applied.
     
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  13. KenG

    KenG Senior Member

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    I'm going to way in here as another "Home Player only" fellow. There still seems to be some misconception that the LT is a "step down" for the Helix. I think people are trying to liken it to the AXE FX II and the AX8 but it is nothing like that. Performance wise the LT does everything the Helix does (modelling, routing , switching, even shared presets) etc. Yes you don't get an AUX in but as I posted a couple of days ago there are two workaround using either USB or the two effects returns should you want stereo (one if you don't).
    The difference in price is more than advertised as the LT has been purchased for $799 new at Sweetwater ($200 off it's List price) by a couple of members just by calling. The cheapest new Helix price I've heard is $1399. $600 is nothing to sneeze at minimum savings would be at least $400.
    As for Rack mount well, if you are in the midst of playing and want to change settings the rack doesn't cut it. Sure for recording you can stop/start and do whatever, but if you're playing along with a song the need to change on the fly (which I would defintiely do) the floor model is the best choice.
     
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  14. mmd

    mmd Senior Member

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    This is MAJOR - there are NO performance differences in the LT. That was the biggest reason I bought an LT vs. a used floor. I wanted to see for myself, and believe it....what you are "giving up" between the Helix and the LT is minimal. If I didn't already have what I have, the LT would have been a VERY exciting piece of gear. Already having a Helix allowed me to REALLY get picky about my PERSONAL needs for the unit. Tone-wise, I was BLOWN AWAY at the fact it was IDENTICAL to my rack. Even MY personal presets, when loaded in, worked EXACTLY the same.
     
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  15. mmd

    mmd Senior Member

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    Elaborate, please....are you referring to the touch sensitive switches? The Helix Control does all of the same parameter changes on the fly as the Helix Floor. The only difference is you need to add an expression to the control, whereas the floor has it built in.

    http://line6.com/helix/helix-floor-rack.html#smart-control
     
  16. Sournote

    Sournote Senior Member

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    mmd's feedback is an excellent endorsement of the LT for me, but I'll stay on the fence since I'm not ready to think about my next modeling step, have yet to see a Helix LT in person and have not actually played either one to decide if the Helix/HLT could entice me to move up from my POD.
     
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  17. KenG

    KenG Senior Member

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    I believe the Helix Controller is Optional so that's an additional purchase on top of the Helix rack.
     
  18. mmd

    mmd Senior Member

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    gotcha!!
     
  19. Pop1655

    Pop1655 Premium Member

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    We'll, there's an LT in the truck.

    Contrary to the internet, I had a spectacular GC experience today. I took in a garage sale. I took a bath on it, but it was all hard to move pieces. I'm at peace with how I was treated. I got a private invite discount on the LT. The trade in was enough to eliminate the sales tax.
    If I don't like the LT in 45 days, I got a promise to honor the same discount if I decide I need more.

    I was able to do a side by side. There IS a difference. You can see several shortcuts. In addition to all the stated missing I/Os, the big brother case and pedal are definitely more heavy duty. I think most real players would want big brother. If you just bought big brother, don't feel shorted. You got more.

    I think the LT would be perfect for a real player as a back up or in studio.

    I think it's the right choice for me.
    Although not as quality, the LT case has a really clean look to it that appeals to me. It feels great too, if you're not doing a side by side.

    Probably gonna be a couple of days before schedule allows me to even open the box. I'll report back.

    For today, I'm pretty stoked and feel like I got what I needed.

    Thanks for playing.
     
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  20. mdubya

    mdubya Senior Member

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    I think you will be very happy, Pop!
     

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