Headrush vs. Helix LT... who will end up on top?

Discussion in 'Amp Modeling' started by Rocco Crocco, Apr 16, 2017.

  1. Jeremiah

    Jeremiah The Worst Premium Member

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    I never really had trouble enough to need the support, but I have read that the ER is basically an abandoned product. Luckily mine has always worked. I wouldn't be so anxious to double down on my investment with that company, thus my migration to PositiveGrid.
     
  2. Donal

    Donal ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Premium Member

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    I do like the touchscreen idea and looking at the video, it looks easy to use,

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXw8vljEUdo"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXw8vljEUdo[/ame]

    But I prefer my Helix :D
     
  3. frankv

    frankv What Are You Waiting For? Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    I think the point in all this is there is a new way to make sound and music and it doesn't include hot, fragile tubes of any kind. :hmm::thumb:
     
  4. Pop1655

    Pop1655 Premium Member

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    Lots of interesting info both about the Eleven Rack folks and more positive thoughts on my earlier question on the Line 6 folks.
    LT looks my my route.

    Like I said back in the buying technology thread, part of this ticks me off even more.

    I put the 330 under the bed and the Princeton in the closet in July of 1980. In 2014 I got back into it with an Epi G400 running it and my iphone into a Champion 20 and listening through headphones. I was blown away at the technology after coming out from under a rock after 34 years. I was blown away for a total investment of $200 bucks! Been an entertaining three years since then. Played with a lot of stuff, acquired a nice collection. Playing with the Pod has sold me on the fact that the Helix is the plan.

    It still bugs me that aux in is considered a toy. I started with backing tracks, I'm still with em and from my perspective, even if was full time gigging for a living (which I don't pretend I'll ever be), I still would see myself practicing with backing tracks.

    It bugs me that on a THR aux in with a separate volume control is a really cool feature, yet on anything above that, it's a toy. It's not to me.

    It bugs me that an LT is real close to the real deal for 1/3 less money. I ain't buying there's a third less cost in building the unit.

    It bugs me that this new player has all the features and then some in a good case for the same price point.

    I just think it's a stretch to believe that you can't get a full blown Helix with a 7" touchscreen in a nice case with my aux in for a grand. I still think a grand is plenty to cover it all and make the company a nice, comfortable profit. Seriously, how much real money goes into building any of these??? Does it really cost five times as much to produce any of these as it cost to produce my Mustang V? I don't see it. Wonder what either of these will be going for in 3-5 years. Remember how much big screen TV's used to cost?

    JMHO!

    ...and anybody remotely familiar with my journey to date knows I'm not afraid to drop a dime on something I'm sold on.

    The LT still looks to be the winner. I still see myself dropping a grand, not getting everything I want and having an attitude about it. Just have to tell myself "suck it up pansy boy" and keep going.
     
  5. mmd

    mmd Senior Member

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    You could always buy a used Helix. I have seen the floor units sell between $1100-1200. I think I saw one at $1050-ish once (it was gone FAST).
     
  6. MusicLaw

    MusicLaw Senior Member

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    I have numerous touch screen devices I use every day: Smartphone, Tablets, etc.

    On the Helix, about the only time I have felt it would be handy to have a touchscreen capability would be when selecting Blocks to reposition them in the Signal Path(s), or to scroll any of the List items such as Presets or Block Models. Aside from that, Helix's capacitance touch sensitive footswitch buttons already provide for instant selection of footswitch items, reassigning footswitches, access to related Menu items, and more. Plus, Helix's awesome Pedal Edit mode, allows for hands free parameter adjustment!

    Helix's UI is so fast and intuitive, that once you get used to it, it might be faster than a touch screen. We'll have to see if future Helix models go touch screen.
     
  7. KenG

    KenG Senior Member

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    Pop you can use the effects return for AUX in if you need to (Helix LT has two sends and two returns) or you can do what I'd do and mix them in the audio interface connected to the PC and through the DAW.
    I believe you bought an ALTO TS Series which also has a mixer on it (2 channels in - 1 for Modeller 1 for Aux Audio) so there's that route. Or you can play the audio tracks through your studio monitors and play the Modeller through the Alto (or whatever FRFR you have). It shouldn't be a show stopper if you put your mind to it:thumb:
    From your post though it sounds like you're almost angry at Line 6 like they eff'ed up somehow! I don't feel that way at all, they took a design and paired away what they believed were the non-essentials, including some expensive chassis parts, and cut costs to give their customers basically the same package at a reduced cost. I think they should be commended for this and if anyone should be possibly upset it's the folks that bought a Helix just before this was announced and released. And that decision may have been competitive or strategic purposes.
     
  8. Pop1655

    Pop1655 Premium Member

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    Ken, I actually agree with everything you say.
    Just can't shake that they are worth their price tag.
    ....but these days, what is.
    If they can get $170,000 for a surbuban and a bass boat, I guess they can get a grand for an LT. For some reason, my mind doesn't flinch at a grand for a guitar, but it still does for these.
     
  9. KenG

    KenG Senior Member

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    Well 1K USD is nothing to sneeze at and I'll be paying $1350 CAD for the LT here and 3 years ago our dollars were on par! But look at the prices of the alternatives AX8= $1300 USD, Kemper =$1800 USD AXE FX II = $2300 USD and for less you're into the POD HD which you have or Atomic Amplifier which doesn't have anywhere near the functionality of the big boys.
    In all cases the price you pay certainly doesn't reflect just material costs, not by a long shot, R&D costs, operating costs, support costs, and of course profit all get their piece of the pie and pass it on to us consumers.
    I think over the next few years other products will come along but it'll be hard to get the price of the more powerful units down much more than 1K. But there will be more competition at that price point. I'm not willing to wait a few more years myself. I'm never the leader on new tech buying, but I'm never the last either, I'm usually in between somewhere if it appeals to me. (1/2 chicken I guess)
     
  10. frankv

    frankv What Are You Waiting For? Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Yes, I see that and I can't get my head wrapped around that fact. To me, after spending stupid amounts of money on amps.... well above what my AXE cost me... I see this technology less costly then anything compared to the value you get for the money. 220 amps and thousands of effects... Oh yeah, in my mind, well worth the money for sure.
     
  11. TheX

    TheX Voice of Reason

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    *shakes head*

    The opinions over there mean jack to me in the real world. I truly believe that it is a Fractal and/or Kemper world (for me) right now.
     
  12. nicolasrivera

    nicolasrivera Senior Member

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    The units has some issues that if not addressed by the HR Team, it will effect its launch momentum, if it has any.

    This one terrible product launch.
     
  13. Sournote

    Sournote Senior Member

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    I'm with the crowd on this one.

    A new entrant is gonna have to bring a lot to the game to even peak my interest. I'm really into the pedalboard format so for me the decision would be Helix/Helix LT or AX8.

    The Helix LT is a great price point for near top of the heap modeler and is from the 800 lb gorilla of the technology. You don't have to wonder if Line 6 will be around in the future.

    Fractal is a smaller company but has an established track record and good rep for standing behind their product.

    Unless someone does something a whole lot better than these two, I'd not look any further.
     
  14. MusicLaw

    MusicLaw Senior Member

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    Pop1655,

    If you're not ready to buy one of these units quite yet, and you already have a laptop you use with your gear, consider that Line 6 is scheduled to release Helix Native by the end of Spring.

    Helix Native is a software Plug-in for a DAW or VST, that brings all of Helix's Amps, FX, Cabs, etc., to your computer. Helix Native will also allow for any Presets you create to be transferred to a Helix unit and vice versa! Helix Native -- being sofware only -- will not have any of the Helix Hardware's D/A converters nor I/O excellence. If you already have an Interface, Helix Native may be an option for you. I'm not yet sure whether the USB interface in the Yamaha THR10 or Mustang will be adequate to use with Helix Native.

    Helix Native will be priced $399.
    For Helix Floor and Helix Rack owners it will be $99
    For Helix LT owners it will be $299.
    There will be a free 15 trial for everyone!

    So, if you are considering a Helix Floor or Helix LT, also consider if you might find Helix Native useful. If so, keep in mind that if you buy a Helix LT Helix Native will cost you an additional $299. However, if you buy a Helix Floor, you can get Helix Native for $99.

    I have absolutely no regrets that I got a Helix late last year! It is truly the best piece of audio gear I've bought in years.

    One last comment.... There is a yet to be substantiated rumor (hearsay) that GC will be having a 20% off sale starting next week.
     
  15. KenG

    KenG Senior Member

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    Musiclaw the trial period on Helix Native may be a nice way to trial the Helix sounds for free before buying. Personally not being a profession recording artist I would not invest the $$ required to buy it as either a non-Helix or Helix LT owner. To get the best of an app like that would require a PC upgrade for me that would pay for the step up to the standalone HW and the HW will work well with my DAW anyway. However that's just me and mentioning the Native and trial was a good idea.
    Guitar Center won't ship this item to Canada unfortunately probably due to some exclusivity with a distributor here in Canada for Line 6 and I can tell you L&M WON"T be offering any discounts! Sometimes it's very frustrating to be in Canada.
     
  16. Pwrmac7600

    Pwrmac7600 Premium Member

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    So buy it and have it shipped to an MLP member you trust, and have them ship it out to you.
     
  17. Pop1655

    Pop1655 Premium Member

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    48 hours in and HR is making Code look like a resounding success
     
  18. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    I think it's cool Line 6 is creating a Helix Plugin.

    I just don't get why an actual Helix owner would want it. It has to not sound quite as good as their hardware version, and no easier to record with. I guess it makes it SLIGHTLY easier to do reamping, with Helix like tone, I guess.
     
  19. mmd

    mmd Senior Member

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    As a Helix owner, I 100% agree. Realistically, Helix Native has ZERO appeal to me. My rack version is VERY easy to record with - plug an XLR cable (that is already attached to the console) into one of the DI boxes in the back of my rack - and DONE, lol.

    I guess reamping would be easier, but I don't do that.

    I mean, for the $99 I MIGHT go ahead and get it, but that's still $99 for something that I see no real purpose for....
     
  20. mmd

    mmd Senior Member

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    What's happening in that 48 hours to make Code seem like a resounding success?????
     

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