Do you know how long....?

Discussion in 'Amp Modeling' started by cybermgk, May 6, 2017.

  1. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    I once had a Marshall DSL15H tube head. It was a good amp. I thought it could be great. I modded it. In fact, there are some threads here and more so on the marshall forum, that go into a lot of depth. In fact, I get asked questions periodically from current modders of the same amp. I just had one yesterday, sent him the schematics and my 2 cents. In fact, that is what put this thought in my head.

    I spent a bit of time tracking down the schematics, studying them, analyzing what I didn't like about the amp, forming a game plan. soldering in the test circuit leads to try different values, trying different values for caps and resistors. All of this was to take some of the amp's brightness away, so that the 2 channels, that shared an EQ, COULD share the same settings, and to tame the gain on the gain channel, and make it a little less compressed, with a little more organic 'air'. There was some time spent.

    I don't regret that time. It was fun. It helped a LOT of people make a good amp sound really great.

    But, I can do the same changes, kinds of changes on my Axe, or Kemper, to ANY amp in mere seconds. I can even play with some of the same capacitor values on the Axe.

    Truly mind boggling. You/we can all be amp modders at that level or deeper with this modeling tech.
     
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  2. frankv

    frankv What Are You Waiting For? Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Well Tim.. I feel we are at that point with amp modelers that we were when computers first came in. Remember those years. TRS80. Commodore 64. 286 IBMs. There were those that grabbed on and enjoyed what they were. And there were those that ignored the tech and figured it would go away.

    Now look. Those that gravitated toward the tech are now reaping the rewards. Those that didn't are cursed to say "I don't know much about--------"
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2017
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  3. Falconbill

    Falconbill Premium Member

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    You'll get my soldering iron when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers. :laugh2:
     
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  4. JOESHMOE

    JOESHMOE Senior Member

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    I built 4 or 5 tube amps on my kitchen table and
    changed a couple more from printed circuit board to
    ptp wiring.

    It was a blast, had the best tone I ever had.

    But now that's all changed.

    No need for that anymore.

    Jimmy
     
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  5. KenG

    KenG Senior Member

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    I think amp modding can please people in two ways, one for the possibility of the tone change to be had, and two for the simple DYI factor. I've been an electronics guy for close to 40 years now (started in High School with Electricity classes before making it my career) but my days of farting around with amps doing mods are over, let someone else do it. I'll be happy to have the power to seriously morph my tones at my fingertips via SW/FW, I am not a purist (despite my fondness for LPs)
     
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  6. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Yep exactly. That's what I like about this. I can DIY and have fun.
     
  7. LtDave32

    LtDave32 Sua Sponte Super Mod Premium Member

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    And here we are again, talking about tube amps in the modeling section.
     
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  8. LtDave32

    LtDave32 Sua Sponte Super Mod Premium Member

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    Thread reopened. Much progress made on the membership's and the mod's understanding of each other.

    Post with confidence, but please; don't add negatives towards either camp.

    Love what you have, and don't worry about the other guy. :) That goes for both camps equally.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2017
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  9. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Back to the discussion, thanks L-T.

    Being able to DIY on the Axe, specially, but the Kemper to a lesser extent, reminds me of those DIY, redoable PCB boards I used to temp build circuits with years ago

    [​IMG]

    Only, it's with an amp there.

    Granted, it isn't actual circuits, but Cliff's models particularly, are so accurate to the actual amp circuit's it is really the same thing, for all intent and purpose. As such, you can actually learn a lot about how an amp makes it's tone, playing and twiddling some of these values.
     
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  10. AllTheSound

    AllTheSound Premium Member

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    That's really true man , i'm a tweaker at heart. I still bread board a few pedal circuits from time to time and like to build an occasional amp when i'm not building guitars. I get much of the same enjoyment building and tweaking models via SPICE. One of the things that really puts Fractals models in a different league is the depth of component level tweaking it allows the user. It gets you as close to SPICE model tweaking as you can get in a hardware modeler only easier and in real time.
     
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  11. frankv

    frankv What Are You Waiting For? Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Here's a story for you.. Back when i had a few Marshalls it was common for me to convert 6550 tube sets to EL34s. One evening on one of my JCM800s I did this conversion. Tried out the amp. Then decided to convert it back... then back again. I could not decide if there was even a change in tone not to mention what i liked better. 3 times that swap went back and forth. It was not fun.

    These days a change like that would only require a change of the power tubes inside the incredible software called AXE EDIT. A second of time when it use to take 30 minutes.
     
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  12. mdubya

    mdubya Senior Member

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    I have already managed to screw up the Dual Rectifier Vintage model in the AX8. :p

    I all I was trying to do was add a Looper. :doh:

    I'll get it unscrewed and figure out the Looper, too. :lol:

    It is also notable that I was even using the Dual Rec Vintage model. I certainly wouldn't have even plugged into a non-virtual version. :hmm:

    So many rabbit holes. :shock:
     
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  13. ttbit

    ttbit Senior Member

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    :) :) Yeah... You can stick that looper in the wrong place. Make sure you get out the 25w soldering iron this time.
     
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  14. Liam

    Liam V.I.P. Member

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    I think those of us that have loved building and tweaking tube amps and analogue effects pedals are probably at a distinct advantage over those that never have when it comes to getting what we want from a modelling amp. At least to start with. And then, like with all things, it comes down to using your ears.

    Like Frank says, it really helps being able to flick between models and try changes so quickly.

    Liam
     
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  15. mdubya

    mdubya Senior Member

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    Got the Dual Rec fixed and got the looper working. All is well. :hippie:
     
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  16. AllTheSound

    AllTheSound Premium Member

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    Which do you prefer in the the Fractal JCM800 model the 6550's or EL34's?
     
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  17. frankv

    frankv What Are You Waiting For? Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Well now. That would depend on what guitar I have plugged in. :band:
     
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  18. Pwrmac7600

    Pwrmac7600 Premium Member

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    Hands down the 6550. But if you really want to hear a great JCM800 model try the Brit 800 mod or the Brit 800 #34. Both of those models are the ultimate JCM800.
     
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  19. frankv

    frankv What Are You Waiting For? Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    The amount of incredible tones are all over the place in the AXE. Literally every amp, and I think there are like 225 now, have something to offer. This fact has kept me completely happy in every way. Now I just look at different guitars and my amp GAS is forever history
     
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  20. cybermgk

    cybermgk Singin' the body lectric Premium Member V.I.P. Member

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    Yep. I have found I like different amp tones than I thought I did. I was a diehard 'Fender Clean' for clean tones guy. I have discovered a bunch of different cleans I like now. That and pushed tones. I was never a big fan of them. That is, I, as I know now, wasn't with the amps I used to have. I have been digging a bunch of on the edge and pushed tones now, their versatility and reactiveness.
     
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