A Question about M2M

Discussion in 'Historics & Reissues' started by modavis99, Feb 12, 2019 at 4:48 AM.

  1. modavis99

    modavis99 Silver Supporter

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    does anyone know why the custom shop won't guarantee the weight of a custom order to be in a certain range? (I.e. 8.25 pounds plus or minus 4 ounces). Seems like this is something they could absolutely nail. The fact that they won't guarantee a weight, even within a reasonable range, has prevented me from ordering.
     
  2. RAG7890

    RAG7890 Premium Member

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    I would like to weigh in with comments that would carry some weight but in reality what can I say, other than this is weighing on my mind. If you do get that guarantee, it will lift a weight off our shoulders. :D

    Sorry, I’m being flippant. Fair request I suppose but probably too onerous for them to handle. Maybe expand the range a little to make it less onerous on them.

    Good luck. :)

    :cheers2:
     
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  3. guitarded_82

    guitarded_82 Member

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    Thanks for weighing in.

    Regarding the post....
    The finish, probably.
     
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  4. L96A1

    L96A1 Senior Member

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    Curious what kind of range they can handle?
     
  5. ARandall

    ARandall Senior Member

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    I can see all sorts of issues there.
    M2M is all about you choosing based on looks, not any other criteria. The best looking/most interesting cuts of wood make it to the list I'm sure. That could mean they are at the highest to lowest that the Custom shop takes in.
    So, given that it will be 'within the regular range of historics'........is that not a reasonable variance that could be inferred.
     
  6. Frozen Rat

    Frozen Rat Premium Member

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    I have heard from folks who have claimed to have gone to Gibson and picked out the woods on their M2M guitars. If you could swing a trip there and pick out your top and back wood, you could do a lot to achieve your goal. Beyond that I think they just don't want to get into a guitar and think it'll be in the range and then not be and have a guitar they can't sell to you. I'm sure they are risk averse in these sorts of situations, plus the extra man hours involved (while not much, I grant) add up over time and I'm sure they don't want any more overhead than necessary.
     
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  7. RedSkwirrell

    RedSkwirrell Senior Member

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    The fact that it's important to you to have that guarantee probably explains their reluctance to give it.
    If you feel there's a good possibility that it could fall outside your 4oz. leeway, so will they.
    :)
     
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  8. RedSkwirrell

    RedSkwirrell Senior Member

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    DUDE!
    I have an old t-shirt emblazoned with your name, "Guitarded"!

    [​IMG]
     
  9. Oldskoolrob

    Oldskoolrob Senior Member

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    Wow I really need to check my moral compass. I thought M2M was something entirely different!
     
  10. Tim Plains

    Tim Plains Senior Member

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    Maybe because it's hard to predict how much weight will be shaved off from three different pieces of wood, and really, what would you do if the guitar was 1 oz above your criteria, not buy it? Think of how picky and anal some buyers are. That could prove a disaster for Gibson.
     
  11. grayd8

    grayd8 Senior Member

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    The fact they didn’t have a no pick guard option or SS frets option was a deal breaker for me.
     
  12. modavis99

    modavis99 Silver Supporter

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    OP here. I don’t think this is unreasonable. I would guess buyers that are willing to pay a huge premium for a lightweight M2M custom do not want to risk winding up with a 9.25 pound guitar.

    Anyway Kiesel takes this kind of risk all the time - they offer a return policy on (most) custom guitars and resell the returns at a modest discount direct their web site. It doesn’t strike me as that much risk for Gibson.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2019 at 6:18 PM
  13. mudface

    mudface Non-Deadbeat/Non-Prominent Double Platinum Supporter Premium Member

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    With any given plank of wood it's really hard to tell what it's going to weigh once all the bits are removed and milled. I'm sure the can estimate it to a few ounces,.... but that's a big risk when it comes to a finish custom made product. How many do they want to risk to get it right. The density of wood varies on a single body blank i'm sure. Denser in the middle of the blank or on the outer edges that get cut off. The differences could be minimal but still difficult to measure. It really depends on the pieces you pick....... and those pieces are rather large blanks. I suppose that a solid color was your choice it would be easier for them to select lighter wood.
     
  14. Thundermtn

    Thundermtn Senior Member

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    A half pound range shouldn't be too difficult, they know what the blanks weight and they know what the finished guitars weight. Multiply that info times the thousands of guitars the CS puts out and they could pretty easily determine a bell curve range for what they're producing. Yeah it's a wood product but they are only using carefully selected pieces, they know the game before the lumber even makes it in the door.
     
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  15. freebyrd 69

    freebyrd 69 Premium Member

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    Don't shoot the messenger here, but.....I have been to the CS and picked wood on 2 of my R9's. Almost every single R9 made recently (2011 at least and up) is within the 8-8.9 lb. range. I can't remember the last time I saw a 9+ lb. R9 for sale. It's rare. That being said, Gibson probably hates dealing with "weight weenies" as much as anyone else that sells guitars. I hate to open that can of worms, but seriously, it just cracks me up how some people worry about 4 f#cking ounces. Your money, I get that, but, I am in sales, and I can tell you honestly, there are some customers that aren't worth dealing with, and in the guitar world, anyone worried about 4 oz. in the weight of a guitar would be a 99% indicator that they would be an extremely difficult customer. Long story short, I don't blame them. Again, your $ and all, but anyone that picky doesn't need to be buying shit over the internet sight unseen. Just my two cents.

    FYI, my R9's turned out to be 8 lbs., and just SLIGHTLY over 8 lbs., but I never once worried about or asked about the weight. Worried about weight, go buy a Fender......or a really, really nice wide/soft strap.
     
  16. Duane_the_tub

    Duane_the_tub Senior Member

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    Gibson used to accommodate requests for lightweight builds during the earliest stages of the M2M program (back before it was called that, and dealers such as Wildwood could custom order builds for clients).
     
  17. Thundermtn

    Thundermtn Senior Member

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    He's not talking about 4 oz., he's talking about 8. Lots of people have owned enough LP's to have favorite ranges for a combinations of tone and comfort. 8.75# +/- is a sweet spot for A LOT of folks
     
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  18. freebyrd 69

    freebyrd 69 Premium Member

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    His OP said 4, and tone has zero to do with weight, but that's another story and if you believe that it does, it is yet another precursor to being a PIA to deal with. Again, everyone has the right to be as picky as they want, but if you are that person, don't buy unless you can try. Take your magnifying glass, your perfect scale, your "toneometer", and whatever else you want, and have at it. If you are going to be that picky, and try to deal over the internet, a bad experience instantly becomes your fault, not whomever you are dealing with. Dealing with anyone like that sucks for Gibson, AND the dealer, so it's no wonder......
     
  19. Crotch

    Crotch Support MLP Veterans & Vendors Platinum Supporter Premium Member

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  20. irocdave12

    irocdave12 Senior Member

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    Yeah seriously 4oz on a guitar ain't even worth talking about in my mind. Now if you're dealing with your weed man and there is a 4oz discrepancy I'd definitely speak up. But in all honesty can you even imagine Gibson trying to do specific weights on top of letting you pick your wood top with the volume of guitars they build. People want to be specific with how the body woods look now too. Now if you want to do a one off, pick your top and then ask for lightest mahogany as possible for the body regardless of its grain pattern I'm sure they could accommodate that. But building to a specific weight window is a nightmare for them. You'd have to know exact weight of every single piece on the guitars just to be able to even attempt to estimate those things
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2019 at 5:46 PM

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