_MIJ__FAQ_+_Links

Discussion in 'Other Single-Cuts' started by reborn old, Nov 14, 2011.

  1. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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  2. GammyBird

    GammyBird Senior Member

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    How about some pictures and information on cavity routings? I know some guys here can tell a lot by those....
     
  3. JamesT

    JamesT Senior Member

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    I thought pickup routing shots would be worth a go....here's a few.

    '82 Greco EG-600 Mint Collection

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    '80 JooDee Artist

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    '85 Burny RSC-80

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    2011 Bacchus Classic

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    2009 Edwards Pure Material

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  4. slapshot

    slapshot Senior Member

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    not to split hairs but you mean pickup routes right?
     
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  5. GammyBird

    GammyBird Senior Member

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    Yep slap. Tenon's are good too James :)
     
  6. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    Tokai old vs new routing ... the main difference being an empty tenon cutout on vintage 1978 - 1985 models pics #1 + #2
    ...and a long tenon on modern LS models, pic #3.
    All feature same squarish pick up ear cutouts, (as do 1978 Tokai made Burnys, and mid '80's Tokai made Grandy's)
    and Tokai's tenon offset to the base side of the neck on all LS models. Vintage models have a characteristic 1mm surface rout between ear cutouts that newer models don't.

    1979 to late 1980 EGF routings with medium or extended tenon pics #4 + #5 + pic # 6 next post.
    (tenon type is impossible to prove or disprove outside of a neck break),

    No dowels, were used in EGF's from late 1980 to the end of 1981, but dowels continued to be used on Greco models below EGF-850's throughout 1981. All 1982 mint collection models have long tenons and no dowels like
    James's 1st pic here: http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/other-les-pauls/167868-_mij__faq_-_links-2.html#post3691012
     

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  7. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    Diagram of an extended EGF tenon below.



    Note to owners of early 1970's MIJ Les Pauls =>

    matsumoku forum has members who are knowledgeable about
    many early '70's MIJ Les Paul brands, some with bolt on necks, 3 screw TRC's, white plastic covers,
    including Fender copy guitars.

    Thanks to Ohjay for that link.
     

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  8. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    MIJ hardware compatibility, Burny Greco and Tokai:

    (all measurements center to center, the Tokai is a recent model,
    vintage Tokai examples may vary.)

    All Burny Greco and Tokai Kluson style tuners are compatible with tuner mounting screw distances set 23 mm apart.
    Tailpieces and posts are all compatible as well, with 51 mm post measurement for all 3 brands.

    Bridges, bridge posts and thumbscrews aren't interchangeable due to thread differences and bridge hole spacing.
    A Greco bridge slides onto Tokai or Burny posts, but not a Tokai onto the other two brands, not sure about a Burny bridge on a Greco. Spacing is the same , but unsure about untested post thread sizes.

    Pickup surrounds vary by 1mm, brand to brand:
    Tokai 81mm x 37mm
    Greco 81mm x 38mm
    Burny 82mm x 37mm (1982-1990 RLG)

    Pictured below are polished Tokai hardware, with brass bridge saddles
    next to aged nickel 1980 vintage Greco EGF hardware.
     

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  9. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    I thought I would post Burny ID and dating info here in the FAQ,
    since Fernandes - Burny manufacturer and production dates can be pretty confusing to newcomers.

    For individual Burny model specs please check the first FAQ post: http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/other-les-pauls/167868-_mij__faq_-_links.html#post3214637e

    I would first like to thank doublecut, for doing much of the research and
    providing much of the dating and ID info found in many of these Burny posts.
    Thanks to Nils + Jacco for their contributions.

    There are 8 known date ranges for Burny production with at least 7 different manufacturers.
    The difficulty in dating Burny's, is that RLG's produced from 1982 to date, don't have serial numbers.
    FLG's all use early Japanese serial number dating conventions, with the 1st numeric digit being the year of manufacture.

    The best strategies for dating RLG Burnys, lie in identifying unique features of each manufacturer and production era, and combine this info with pot date codes, usually found below stamped pot resistance values (on US produced Noble pots anyway).

    If not present on the pot rear face, numbers can sometimes be found on pot side edges (last pic in this post).

    The 8 date ranges for identification purposes are:

    1975-81 Terada FLG
    1978-79 Chushin FLG
    1978-79 Tokai FLG

    1982-85* Kasuga RLG
    1984-86* Matsumoku RLG
    1987-98* Dyna RLG
    1989-94* Fujigen RLG
    ~2000+* Tokai RLG (Tokai China for base models + Yako Taiwan in the late 1990's)

    *Since pot code dating is far from an exact science, year ranges posted are general guidelines only
    and production may sometimes in fact extend into year ranges of other listed manufacturers.
    There is always a possibility pots weren't used quickly or in rotation, but it remains the best method for narrowing down the above date ranges.

    Fernandes used their own name instead of the domestic Burny name on export Les Paul models.
    All FLG's + RLG's were produced in Japan except for Yako Taiwan
    and Tokai China base models.

    If you find inaccuracies in the Burny info posted here kindly PM me, Thanks
     

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  10. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    1975-77 Terada FLG

    1975-77 Terada FLG's are unique amongst Burnys due to the "Les Paul model" script below the Burny pearloid inlay.
    Serial numbers are preceded by a letter (usually z) and then the year of manufacture digit (5,6,7 or 8)
    All Terada Burnys are different from other manufacturer brands for their control cavity routing with pickup wires entering close to the outer edge of the guitar next to the bridge volume pot (see yellow arrow in last pic below). Other manufacturer's pickup wires all enter the control cavity at the neck volume pot just left of where the ground wire enters the cavity, or else between both volume pots in the case of Kasuga, Yako and a few Dyna and/or Fujigen examples.
    1975-77 models come with all metal tuners (instead of double ring or single ring plastic tuner tips found on post Tokai FLG's). Finish on backs and on headstock backs are sprayed so thin, that wood pores show through the finish.
    Pickup cavity wire routing is actually drilled through the mahogany layer at the middle of the neck cavity through to the middle of the bridge pickup cavity, before the neck is glued on, also unique to Terada made models. All Terada models have stamped rear headstock serial numbers.
    Fernandes export model Les Pauls are stamped longitudinally between tuners instead of behind the front inlay.
     

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  11. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    1978 Chushin FLG
    No serial #'s, tenon offset to the bass side + control cavity circuit board
    similar to Tokais from the same year, fret edge binding, 3 piece necks.


    1978 Tokai FLG

    1978 Tokai FLG's are easy to date, with Tokai 7 digit ink serials and blank headstocks below the Burny pearloid inlay.
    Serial numbers beginning with 800xxxx are 1978 models and serial numbers beginning with 900xxxx are 1979 models.
    Additionally, Tokai uses wire channel routing and square end tab routing (with rounded corners)
    In the control cavity, Tokai is the only manufacturer with all 4 cavity lobes flattened at edges.
     

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  12. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    1980-81 Terada FLG

    1980-81 Terada FLG's are similar to pre-Tokai versions.
    The unique feature of these last FLG's
    are the Super Grade model script combined with the white
    pearloid Burny inlay and return of stamped headstock serial #'s.
    T
    he serial number is not usually preceded by a letter so the 1st digit is probably the production year digit (0 or 1)
    Wiring to the ouput jack is housed in a clear plastic tube and control cavity shielding foil is used.
    Pickup cavity routes and wire layout are the same as earlier Teradas.
    1980 double ring Klusons are dropped sometime in 1981 for single ring version.
     

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  13. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    1982-86 Kasuga RLG

    Wire channel routing is reintroduced and Kasuga produce some "not so plain top" base model tops complete with fret edge binding. Many feature birdseye artifact tops and or flame figuring, or both. Multipiece backs become more common place than on earlier FLG's (on base models at least). Gold color Burny inlays are introduced along side Matsumoku produced RLG models. RLG-90+ models also have a tenon lip cutout similar to vintage Tokais. Kasuga tenons are medium length, ending at the top edge of the pickup cavity.

    Kasuga control cavity lobes are the narrowest of all Burnys. Kasuga models have unique wire channel routing amongst Burnys (different from Tokai's) and share many attributes of Kasuga produced Heerbys and Freshers. (see comparison pics below)
     

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  14. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    1982-86 Matsumoku RLG

    Matsumoku RLG's have unique Burny long neck tenons that fill the center of the neck pickup cavity and have a large phillips flat head screw installed into the tenon during the neck bonding process. Matsumoku Aria Les Pauls share this attribute.
    They don't use wire channel routing and the control cavity pickup wire hole is located 1/4 in below the mahogany back's outer surface, where other brand routings are all much closer to the maple top cap. Control cavity lobes are medium sized.
     

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  15. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    1987-199? Dyna RLG

    A new rainbow hued pearloid Burny inlay is used for Dyna and Fujigen models.
    New inlays can be hard to differentiate from early FLG pearloid white inlays in some pics however.
    TRC is changed from a bell to a winged bell TRC with a less pronounced white border in 1988.
    Both of these features remain until operations are moved to Taiwan.
    Super Grade script is placed lower on the headstock, closer to the TRC.
    These feature the most prominent control cavity lobes, with no lobe flats being cut like those found on Fujigen models.
    (Lobe flats, long tenons and resin in control cavities appear to be Fujigen build traits)
    Dyna tenons are medium, ending at the top edge of the pickup cavity.
    Wire routing is along the treble side edge of both pickup cavities, is the same as Fujigen II style routing.
     

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  16. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    199?-94 Fujigen RLG

    Prominent control cavity lobes like Dyna Gakki lobes.
    except control cavity lobes next to both vol pots and neck vol + tone pots are typically cut flat.
    The bottom of the control cavity or pot routes are sometimes resin filled.
    Fujigens have long tenons estending into the pickup cavity, whereas Dyna tenons are medium length.
    Wire routing is along the treble side edge of both pickup cavities, same as Dyna examples.
    Fujigen also reportedly produced mid 80's RLC models (according to Wiki sources) but this is unconfirmed.

    As with the Matsumoku-Kasuga Era above, it remains unclear at this time, when Fujigen started production,
    and when Dyna stopped production. The disimilarities between Dyna and Fujigen produced Burnys are very minor.
    Most consist of small wire routing differences from the bridge pickup cavity to various entry points and
    rout shapes in the control cavity, as well as flat circular pot routes vs rounded bottom circular pot routes.
    Both companies may very well have jointly played a role in production of many examples produced between 1987 and 1994.
    Dyna was contracted by Fujigen at times, it's just not clear if that relationship existed, and to what extent,
    during this 1987-1994 Burny production era. Build similarities lead me to believe it may have been.
     

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  17. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    RLG base models 1995 ~ 2000 Yako (Taiwan)


    Super Grade script is replaced by a blank headstock.
    Truss rod cover is changed to a 3 screw spearhead shape.
    Wires are routed along the treble side of pickup cavities similar to Dyna and Fujigen examples.
    Medium tenon,
    ending at the top edge of the pickup cavity.
    Control cavity lobes are pronounced, but only large enough to hold cavity cover screws.
    Pots are a dime sized MIC variety.
    Owners generally report quality to be good compared to some other China manufactured brands.
     

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  18. reborn old

    reborn old Senior Member

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    2000+ Tokai RLG's

    Tokai produced all RLG models from about year 2000 to date.
    RLG's + RLC's with model numbers 85 and higher were produced in Japan,
    and lower models in China. Models made in Japan are clearly identified as such in
    Fernandes catalogs on the Fernandes website.
    Production of Yako RLG models, outlined in the above post, was awarded to Tokai and operations moved to the same Chinese factories that produce ALS + ALC Tokai base models.
    Not enough modern Tokai RLG's have been documented yet, to provide more definitive date ranges.
    Later model Japan Burny VH-1 pickups with grey lead wires are used on modern Tokai Japan RLG's vs Gotoh pickups used on 1978 vintage Tokai examples.

    Base model Tokai China RLG vs earlier Yako RLG differences:

    2000+ Tokai China RLG's have bell shaped truss rod covers that rest flat on the nut and Tokai China cavity routes.

    Burny info is subject to change as more info is gathered.
    Thanks to Muzz for sharing pics of his 2003 RLG.
     

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  19. slapshot

    slapshot Senior Member

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    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  20. JDB

    JDB Senior Member

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    [​IMG]
     
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