1971 Deluxe LP Gold Top natural aged, my gold top fever reduced

Discussion in 'Norlin Years' started by judson, Oct 23, 2017.

  1. VictorB

    VictorB Formerly LZF Super Mod

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    This is true, they are ceramic.
     
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  2. The Ballzz

    The Ballzz Senior Member

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    ^^^ You sir, took the words/thoughts right out of my keyboard here!^^^ As mentioned by several here, those minis can sound truly fabulous in their own rites, and the fact that they are embossed would prompt me to jump through a few hoops to maximize their potential, if for no other reason than the "COOL" factor! If I were you, and given you not bein' affeard of swapping some pups anyway, I'd disconnect those pots and give 'em a measure, make sure they're somewhere close to what they're supposed to be and replace them if they're not. I from the pics I can't see the "claimed" value, but would likely be hoping for 500K-ish! If they're 300K pots, but don't measure well, I'd be tempted to grab two full sets (500K & 300K) and try the originally intended values first and then compare them with the 500K and maybe end up keeping the 300K in the tone positions.

    Please don't be offended by me vicariously living my Gold Top dream through you! The first "REAL" Les Paul I ever saw on stage was a Gold Top Deluxe, in the early 70s and I still remember clearly how mesmerized I was by the way the lights played on the sculptured gold finish! It was not as worn as yours, but even then it showed that it was played! I recall it having the beginnings of the bare patch that yours has behind/above the bridge/tailpiece. On top of that, the guy was a pretty rippin' player too!


    Again, Great Score @ A Good Price!
    Gene
     
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  3. DarrellV

    DarrellV Derl Ver.... ERMAHGERD!.........It's a Nerlin! Silver Supporter Premium Member

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    This is some good advise and I just wanted to add my 2 cents about the pot values.

    They could be the key to the difference between bright harsh mini's and smoother minis.

    I would aim toward the 300's just for the taming effect it would have on the brightness factor.

    Since minis have a smaller magnetic window on the strings than a full size humbucker and smaller coils inside they can tend toward a more single coil brightness.

    The winders can confirm this but IIRC more turns of copper on a bobbin can produce more output (ie hotter) but at the sacrifice of treble response.

    So the opposite is true also, less windings = lower output and more treble.

    From what I understand from other's experience with them their brightness and 'different' sound was not embraced by all..

    So if you find them too bright it cannot hurt to drop the pots down to 300 or maybe even 250K.

    HAve fun!
     
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  4. Pappy58

    Pappy58 Senior Member

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    When I got my 75 Deluxe it had crappy P-100s in it. I bought a set of SD Antiquity Mini's replaced the Vol pots w CTS 500ks. It really sounds sweet and smooth and has a unique mid-high punch compared to my other Lesters w full size HB's, but does not emit the shrilling highs folks dislike about the original mini's...so you could shrink wrap your originals and go with a setup like this...looks totally stock (sans embossing)....just a thought. :cheers:
     
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  5. Strobe

    Strobe Junior Member

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    Cool guitar, and not a bad price. Obviously folks are joking about routing it for humbuckers, but just to be clear, keep the mini-humbuckers. I really like mini-humbuckers.
     
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  6. Thumpalumpacus

    Thumpalumpacus Senior Member

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    I don't know what pots my 73 had in it, but they were stock. It was not a shrill guitar, at all
     
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  7. judson

    judson Senior Member

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    pots are 70-027 which put them at 500k if my research is correct.....

    i did a little side by side with my other guitars last night, quickly i was reminded how different they are and after i went thru the 91 FB, the 90 & 93 LP studios , a parts build with humbucks, they didnt come close to the range or tone i get from the gold top....

    i am estatic over the sound i can get from it, straight in, no pedals thru my 15 watt Monoprice tube amp set on 1 watt, bedroom level.

    but at the same time all the others need some serious work to bring them up to this level, the 90 studio was close but everything else sounded sort of crappy...lol

    most FB's always have that distinct FB sound, but i would like to pull a bit more bass out of it, and maybe it wont sound like a FB, with some minis but i could definately live with it, but i will leave that alone for now...

    also been neglecting to research improving tone options for those but this comparison was a bit of a wake up call...i dont know if i got lucky with a huge sounding GT or my others are just trash...:rofl:

    somebody tell me how P90's compare to the minis...
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2017
  8. Progrocker111

    Progrocker111 Senior Member

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    Yes, all had good audio 500k pots until early to mid 73, when they switched to different caps and 300k linear pots.

    P90s have much more mids and the output is bigger too. They have overall a fatter and more gritty tone. Minis have more treble and focused, more direct tone with less overtones.

    P.S. Beautiful guitar btw., in original condition. :) I like these early 70s Deluxes very mich, i have had some.
     
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  9. judson

    judson Senior Member

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    thanks for that...i will leave these minis in the GT as it does all i need.

    i will start to check out some P90s for my other guitars. the others all sounded like there were sweaters on the pickups...you know that somewhat muddy not clear or defined ringing tone and range was limited with a thin'ness to them, guess i didnt know what i was missing before

    it will be a winter project.....as my tone and pickup knowledge need to be improved :fingersx:
     
  10. Thumpalumpacus

    Thumpalumpacus Senior Member

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    For that FB, if you can score some old minis from a DeLuxe, they should warm up the tone a bit, being non-ceramic.
     
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  11. bblooz

    bblooz Senior Member

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    Nice score - congrats on your Norlin NGD!
     
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  12. moreles

    moreles Senior Member

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    Who played that thing before? Mr. Green Genes? (Zappa) That intense greening looks like someone touched it with something that accelerated the oxidation, but maybe it's just the photos. I like mini-hums but definitely find them to be their own thing, and more limited than full size HBs. I'd explore some of the odern mini-0hums to see if they'll deliver what you want w/o having to rout for full size HBs, though I wouldn't hesitate to do that, either. (Some call it desecration; I call it an upgrade.)
     
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  13. judson

    judson Senior Member

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    yeah i thought that also on the greening somehow but the seller mention original owner gigged quite a bit and guitar shows it all over but not in fretwear...:hmm:

    the greening behind the tailpiece from hitting the volume knob was understandable if this guy had alot of toxic sweat and if you look close you can see the green on the knob and below the pic guard....when you rest your arm on it, i can see how the sweat would run down the underside of your arm then to the lower side of your hand would explain the behind the tailpiece.......there are actually ridges built up from the gold greening if you look close.....and the fade green under it so i think it is real wear?? what can you pour over to do that???
    IMG_20171109_100618969[1].jpg IMG_20171109_100638389[1].jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2017
  14. judson

    judson Senior Member

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    yes for the FB i thought of that and started to price mini's , then i started thinking P90 but read i would need to route the FB for P90....

    i am leavin the 71/72 alone as-is, the mini's sound great to me and does what i like for now.
     
  15. Thumpalumpacus

    Thumpalumpacus Senior Member

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    I found them more versatile, myself. I played everything from funk to jazz to heavy metal on my 73.
     
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  16. judson

    judson Senior Member

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    i have found the range in these minis to be wider than any humbuck i own...thats what prompted me to start to question my other guitars overall tone......i gots alot of learnin stuff to do this winter !
     
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  17. 1969 weatherman

    1969 weatherman Senior Member

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    SORRY FOR THE CAPITAL LETTERS MY KEYBXOARD IS JAMED
    YOUR MINI HUM READS 7.2 WHICH IS AT PAF ZONE READING...VERY RARE...MINE ARE AT 7.2 7.5 AND SOUND PHENOMENAL..NOT ALL MINI'S ARE CREATED EQUAL...LIKE EVERYTHING IN LIFE...
    THAT GOLD IS A TRUE KEEPER
     
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  18. brianbzed

    brianbzed Senior Member

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    If I ever come into money, this is a MUST have model for me! Congrats, I am very jealous!
     
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  19. judson

    judson Senior Member

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    thanks for that info...this one sounds great and as i mentioned before, it made me pay attention to my others thinking that they lack something. they are not top notch guitars but a 90 & 93 les paul studio, a 91 firebird with a seymore duncan antiquity in the bridge and a few others made me realize there are better sounding and performing options out there......but i dont want to start down the rabbit hole of chasin tone...hope it isnt too late..lol

    hey you can hunt these down and maybe find one more reasonable i am sure, they are out there !.
     
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  20. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Senior Member

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    Sweet '72! ;)
     
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