Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison - Page 2

Bes628 · 04-23-2010, 05:54 AM

imo the bee's def sound better. Stock were kind of harsh, opposite of the bee's.

also the bee's had a more defined low end

i know that might look like scrambled junk...but hopefully people understood what i was trying to say.

edit: i guess i was trying to say the tone was more round.

Shai`tan · 04-28-2010, 05:30 AM

The 1st stock clip sounded harsh. The Bees sounded smooth/round to my ears. And more balanced/natural. That was a pretty cool test. Thx.

gtr-tek · 05-07-2010, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shai`tan

The 1st stock clip sounded harsh. The Bees sounded smooth/round to my ears. And more balanced/natural. That was a pretty cool test. Thx.

I'd have to agree also. I've been a orange drop fan for years, but this does change my thinking. Many of the differences are subtle and the untrained ear can't discern it. To some, it's like night & day and to others, no difference. Thanks for putting together a straight forward, no BS demonstration.

PS I like '50s wiring since I discovered the difference. If you want the '59 sound, you gotta wire it like one!

tazzboy · 05-15-2010, 05:15 PM

Yeah I have been going back and forth on getting some bee's myself.

LPGeoff · 05-15-2010, 05:25 PM

Stock sounded harsh and warbly.

Thx Vast. Loved the sound of the 50's setup.

deepblue · 05-19-2010, 12:52 PM

Bees for sure...Nicer bottom end and sounded much more rock 'n roll than stock.

zoork_1 · 05-28-2010, 02:57 PM

Jepp, to my ears stock sounded harsh. Thanks for the demonstration!

/p

Floyd Pink · 05-29-2010, 05:25 AM

Good demonstration! I had very similar results when i switched to cts 500k audio tapers, K40Y-9 pio caps and 50's wiring. Love the open sound.

However, the 50's wiring seems to roll of the volume much faster than stock/modern wiring, leaving position 1-4 useless. Any suggestions as to how you solve this?

Gryphon · 05-29-2010, 11:32 AM

I think that's more to do with the 500k pots. Others will know better than me, but I think many LPs come with 300k stock. If you swapped out the pots at the same time as the rest, that might be it. Measure the resistance of your old pots to be sure.

UpToEleven59 · 05-30-2010, 09:39 PM

wow. just wow. Am I the only person completely baffled by the tone from the bees?? I had no idea those caps would make that big of a difference

MrRhoads · 05-31-2010, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UpToEleven59

wow. just wow. Am I the only person completely baffled by the tone from the bees?? I had no idea those caps would make that big of a difference

No you´re not the only one.
Alot of people here has tested alot of caps including "real" bumblebees

They sound quite ubelivable

phlz_8 · 05-31-2010, 03:33 PM

Bees definitely are amazing.

nwobhm · 07-02-2010, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phlz_8

Bees definitely are amazing.

I just replaced the fake bees in my 2010 R8 with real .022UF/400V Bees. No wonder, some people give burstbuckers a bad rap! Changing the caps really changed my perception of them. It went from thin and harsh in the bridge to fat and chunky with a real nice growl. The neck went from overpowering and muddy in the mids to having better clarity and overall balance in all 3 postions. The dynamics and responsiveness to the volume control improved aswell.

fretboarder · 07-03-2010, 03:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwobhm

I just replaced the fake bees in my 2010 R8 with real .022UF/400V Bees. No wonder, some people give burstbuckers a bad rap! Changing the caps really changed my perception of them. It went from thin and harsh in the bridge to fat and chunky with a real nice growl. The neck went from overpowering and muddy in the mids to having better clarity and overall balance in all 3 postions. The dynamics and responsiveness to the volume control improved aswell.

my thoughts exactly!

i think the the burstbuckers definatly need a pio cap cos wiithout them they are just far too bright but with a pio they smooth out and gain some growl..

gtr-tek · 07-04-2010, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fretboarder

my thoughts exactly!

i think the the burstbuckers definatly need a pio cap cos wiithout them they are just far too bright but with a pio they smooth out and gain some growl..

Excellent point! I'm replacing the caps in my guitars before evaluating the pups. I've discovered that some pups that didn't sound good to me before do now after good PIO caps are installed (thanks Jonsey). I would recommend to anyone thinking about new pups change the caps and/or wiring (I prefer '50s style) first and then decide. Save some money and find great tone!

Kickstand · 07-28-2010, 05:43 PM

Wow! Now who can tell me where to get some bees?

Indyclone · 07-29-2010, 11:37 AM

Vintage Original .022uF 400v Sprague Bumble Bee capacitors

Jonesyblues Custom Shop on ebay 1/2 Off S&H for MLPF Members

Kickstand · 07-29-2010, 12:05 PM

Bummer, no .022's left...

Indyclone · 07-29-2010, 02:25 PM

you could get 2 .010's (maybe even rated at .011) and run them in parallel... giving you 0.22.

jonesy · 07-29-2010, 03:08 PM

A lot of the 1950's Sprague .010 Bees I have actually read between .010-.017 uf so I have been metering them in pairs for LP's like .011-.012 for the neck and .014-.016 for the bridge and that seems to be working out great for most people.

I have sold 40-50 of these Bees here at MLPF and on ebay like that with no complaints. That's what you are hearing in this Tone test.

snaredrum · 07-30-2010, 11:23 AM

i prefer jonesy's .010 bees to any other cap i've ever heard. love them. even in the treble position, there isn't an unusable sound anywhere in the dial.

Indyclone · 07-30-2010, 11:34 AM

while I'm not using bees, a .015 cap in both positions rolls off enough for me.

jonesy · 07-30-2010, 11:37 AM

I have an .010 Bee that actually reads .012 uf in one of my Tele's and the roll-off is perfect IMO.

I have a pair of .010 Vitamin Q's in my SG. I love the lower value caps, less mud better mid curve.

onehippie · 08-03-2010, 06:49 AM

good comparison had similar results
the stock reminded me of thinned oil paint while the bees and wiring was like right of the tube with a bit of toothyness as the tone was rolled back im a 2.5 on the tone kinda guy 5 souned nice too on your clip
yeah with my 50s pw harness/switch and 22 gudeman pio caps from Jonesy i technically also received 2 new pickups in the bargain that still baffles me. in a way you save money

axslinger · 08-03-2010, 03:40 PM

Nice difference. The Bees take out the harshness and really smooth things out.

Question: How do Bees sound in comparison to Orange Drops?

Ax

5F6-A · 08-04-2010, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by axslinger

Nice difference. The Bees take out the harshness and really smooth things out.

Question: How do Bees sound in comparison to Orange Drops?

Ax

IME bees sound significantly better than ODs

dazzypig · 08-05-2010, 03:46 PM

Wow a new sticky! And a really good one too!!!

The Bees clip sounded better, but I have a suggestion on the audio that make make it a bit fairer.

This isn't a critique on you're playing at all, just in the interest of making sure the tone samples are similar. But one contributing factor to the difference in the brightness of the tone seems to be that the stock cap's sample is played with higher strings included for the intro where as on the Bees example they are left dead (like on the original recording, which your ears are tuned too).

By having the stock cap sample with the harsh high strings sounding it does seem to accentuate the brightness of the cap.

Thanks again for putting it up though man, makes me wonder why it hasn't already been done! Great idea!

ElectricGuitarist33 · 08-06-2010, 07:45 PM

Can anybody point me in the direction of somebody who can wire me up a 50's setup to drop right into my LP Studio?

VastHorizon · 08-06-2010, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElectricGuitarist33

Can anybody point me in the direction of somebody who can wire me up a 50's setup to drop right into my LP Studio?

Send this dude a message:
My Les Paul Forums - View Profile: jonesy

ElectricGuitarist33 · 08-06-2010, 07:49 PM

Yeah, Jonesy. I couldn't remember his name. Thanks man. That was quick.

04-23-2010, 05:54 AM	#31 (permalink)
Bes628 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 782 Thanks: 0 Thanked 14 Times in 5 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison imo the bee's def sound better. Stock were kind of harsh, opposite of the bee's. also the bee's had a more defined low end i know that might look like scrambled junk...but hopefully people understood what i was trying to say. edit: i guess i was trying to say the tone was more round. Last edited by Bes628; 04-23-2010 at 06:34 AM.

04-28-2010, 05:30 AM	#32 (permalink)
Shai`tan Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Edmonton, Canada Posts: 1,156 Thanks: 175 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison The 1st stock clip sounded harsh. The Bees sounded smooth/round to my ears. And more balanced/natural. That was a pretty cool test. Thx.

05-15-2010, 05:15 PM	#34 (permalink)
tazzboy Bartlett Retrospec Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Oregon Posts: 12,037 Thanks: 406 Thanked 237 Times in 92 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Yeah I have been going back and forth on getting some bee's myself. __________________

05-15-2010, 05:25 PM	#35 (permalink)
LPGeoff Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 2,022 Thanks: 116 Thanked 43 Times in 13 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Stock sounded harsh and warbly. Thx Vast. Loved the sound of the 50's setup. __________________ It's never as good, or as bad, as it seems...

05-19-2010, 12:52 PM	#36 (permalink)
deepblue Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 4,683 Thanks: 194 Thanked 134 Times in 47 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Bees for sure...Nicer bottom end and sounded much more rock 'n roll than stock. __________________ __________________________________________________ _______________________________________

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05-28-2010, 02:57 PM	#37 (permalink)
zoork_1 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Sweden Posts: 600 Thanks: 7 Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Jepp, to my ears stock sounded harsh. Thanks for the demonstration! /p

05-29-2010, 05:25 AM	#38 (permalink)
Floyd Pink Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Third Stone Posts: 103 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Good demonstration! I had very similar results when i switched to cts 500k audio tapers, K40Y-9 pio caps and 50's wiring. Love the open sound. However, the 50's wiring seems to roll of the volume much faster than stock/modern wiring, leaving position 1-4 useless. Any suggestions as to how you solve this?

05-29-2010, 11:32 AM	#39 (permalink)
Gryphon Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 125 Thanks: 1 Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison I think that's more to do with the 500k pots. Others will know better than me, but I think many LPs come with 300k stock. If you swapped out the pots at the same time as the rest, that might be it. Measure the resistance of your old pots to be sure. __________________ 06 Classic Player 60s Strat 91 Les Paul Std (Ebony) 86 Yamaha SG1200S 91 Marshall JCM900 MkIII

05-30-2010, 09:39 PM	#40 (permalink)
UpToEleven59 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 104 Thanks: 4 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison wow. just wow. Am I the only person completely baffled by the tone from the bees?? I had no idea those caps would make that big of a difference __________________ "why can't you just make ten louder and have that be the loudest?" ".....this goes to eleven"

05-31-2010, 03:33 PM	#42 (permalink)
phlz_8 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: TEXAS Posts: 536 Thanks: 2 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Bees definitely are amazing.

07-28-2010, 05:43 PM	#46 (permalink)
Kickstand Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 596 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Wow! Now who can tell me where to get some bees?

07-29-2010, 11:37 AM	#47 (permalink)
Indyclone Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 3,567 Thanks: 52 Thanked 101 Times in 27 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Vintage Original .022uF 400v Sprague Bumble Bee capacitors Jonesyblues Custom Shop on ebay 1/2 Off S&H for MLPF Members __________________

07-29-2010, 12:05 PM	#48 (permalink)
Kickstand Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 596 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Bummer, no .022's left...

07-29-2010, 02:25 PM	#49 (permalink)
Indyclone Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 3,567 Thanks: 52 Thanked 101 Times in 27 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison you could get 2 .010's (maybe even rated at .011) and run them in parallel... giving you 0.22. __________________

07-29-2010, 03:08 PM	#50 (permalink)
jonesy TONE FREAK Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Indiana, USA Posts: 15,404 Thanks: 332 Thanked 1,221 Times in 175 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison A lot of the 1950's Sprague .010 Bees I have actually read between .010-.017 uf so I have been metering them in pairs for LP's like .011-.012 for the neck and .014-.016 for the bridge and that seems to be working out great for most people. I have sold 40-50 of these Bees here at MLPF and on ebay like that with no complaints. That's what you are hearing in this Tone test. __________________ "Pro Guitar Wiring Upgrades Built & Designed by a Guitar Player with over 33 years of Experience" Jonesyblues.com for Professional Guitar Wiring Upgrades & DIY Kits Questions? Email to: jonesyblues@yahoo.com or Call 1- 574-249-8816 Aged Parts, Vintage Tone Caps & Wire in my ebay store Jonesyblues Youtube channel Jimmy Page Wiring.com GOD ROCKS!

07-30-2010, 11:23 AM	#51 (permalink)
snaredrum V.I.P. Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Nottingham, England Posts: 16,135 Thanks: 152 Thanked 141 Times in 50 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison i prefer jonesy's .010 bees to any other cap i've ever heard. love them. even in the treble position, there isn't an unusable sound anywhere in the dial. __________________ www.facebook.com/themadelinerust

07-30-2010, 11:34 AM	#52 (permalink)
Indyclone Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 3,567 Thanks: 52 Thanked 101 Times in 27 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison while I'm not using bees, a .015 cap in both positions rolls off enough for me. __________________

07-30-2010, 11:37 AM	#53 (permalink)
jonesy TONE FREAK Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Indiana, USA Posts: 15,404 Thanks: 332 Thanked 1,221 Times in 175 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison I have an .010 Bee that actually reads .012 uf in one of my Tele's and the roll-off is perfect IMO. I have a pair of .010 Vitamin Q's in my SG. I love the lower value caps, less mud better mid curve. thiswastheonlyusernameleft likes this. __________________ "Pro Guitar Wiring Upgrades Built & Designed by a Guitar Player with over 33 years of Experience" Jonesyblues.com for Professional Guitar Wiring Upgrades & DIY Kits Questions? Email to: jonesyblues@yahoo.com or Call 1- 574-249-8816 Aged Parts, Vintage Tone Caps & Wire in my ebay store Jonesyblues Youtube channel Jimmy Page Wiring.com GOD ROCKS!

08-03-2010, 06:49 AM	#54 (permalink)
onehippie Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 3,643 Thanks: 164 Thanked 64 Times in 5 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison good comparison had similar results the stock reminded me of thinned oil paint while the bees and wiring was like right of the tube with a bit of toothyness as the tone was rolled back im a 2.5 on the tone kinda guy 5 souned nice too on your clip yeah with my 50s pw harness/switch and 22 gudeman pio caps from Jonesy i technically also received 2 new pickups in the bargain that still baffles me. in a way you save money

08-03-2010, 03:40 PM	#55 (permalink)
axslinger Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 1,307 Thanks: 7 Thanked 32 Times in 12 Posts	Question Nice difference. The Bees take out the harshness and really smooth things out. Question: How do Bees sound in comparison to Orange Drops? Ax __________________ 2013 Gibson SG Standard THD Flexi 50 Avatar 2x12 Bunches of Pedals Southpaw Pedalboard

08-05-2010, 03:46 PM	#57 (permalink)
dazzypig Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: England , UK Posts: 1,816 Thanks: 20 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Wow a new sticky! And a really good one too!!! The Bees clip sounded better, but I have a suggestion on the audio that make make it a bit fairer. This isn't a critique on you're playing at all, just in the interest of making sure the tone samples are similar. But one contributing factor to the difference in the brightness of the tone seems to be that the stock cap's sample is played with higher strings included for the intro where as on the Bees example they are left dead (like on the original recording, which your ears are tuned too). By having the stock cap sample with the harsh high strings sounding it does seem to accentuate the brightness of the cap. Thanks again for putting it up though man, makes me wonder why it hasn't already been done! Great idea! __________________ Why put of 'till tomorrow what needn't be done 'till next week?

08-06-2010, 07:45 PM	#58 (permalink)
ElectricGuitarist33 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 314 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Can anybody point me in the direction of somebody who can wire me up a 50's setup to drop right into my LP Studio?

08-06-2010, 07:49 PM	#60 (permalink)
ElectricGuitarist33 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 314 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Vintage Bees and 50's Wiring Tone Test/Comparison Yeah, Jonesy. I couldn't remember his name. Thanks man. That was quick.

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