Wiring Library

[sidepartings26]

Originally Posted by jonesy

No apologies needed, but if you would have called me on my cell phone like I offered, you would have saved us both a lot of time, and everyone her would not be reading our "Thicko-Posts" etc. that was a joke son

You are over thinking this wiring stuff a little bit, just wire it like we discussed earlier, you should be fine. What I think I was trying to say is, I run my ground from switch to bridge volume pot, then the ground wire carries it to the bridge tone, then it goes to the input jack.
You show wire from switch going to bridge tone pot then input jack. It will work either way.

Cool didn't realise you sent cell. I get it now. I am an overthinker. OCD. And I don't mean the pedal. Which by the by is good, but the 1987x is fine without it

Sorry for taking up your time and to the forum at large. I plan to stick around though after I fix it; just in a less annoying way

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by sidepartings26

Cool didn't realise you sent cell. I get it now. I am an overthinker. OCD. And I don't mean the pedal. Which by the by is good, but the 1987x is fine without it

Sorry for taking up your time and to the forum at large. I plan to stick around though after I fix it; just in a less annoying way

Hey bro it's all good, I gotta give you a lot of credit for doing it over until you get it right. That is pretty much how I learned

1-574-806-4118 is my cell. call me if you get stuck. I am not teaching tonight
and should be around, leave me a number on my voice mail if you don't get me
and I will call you back for sure

[Drudeboy]

Originally Posted by jonesy

You will probably wont find another wiring diagram for that set-up
What don't you understand???

ok I think I can make it out, I would need to change the master vol/tone connections for 50's style though?

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by Drudeboy

ok I think I can make it out, I would need to change the master vol/tone connections for 50's style though?

Well if you are trying to go for 50's style wiring in any form or fashion this is not the diagram you want to use. Even if you connect the cap to the center lug on volume(upper right) it will kinda look like 50's Vol/Tone circuit but on true 50's LP wiring leads from switch are connected to the center lug of volume just like cap.

This diagram has the switch leads to the individual wiring. The 50's wiring is a bit over hyped and works well in some guitars. I have my 06' LP wired modern and it sounds much thicker and warmer.
Switched from 50's to Modern Wiring

[siore]

Originally Posted by Cacophonous

Nice thread!!! I do not understand anything about electronics... but I do have a Les Paul copy, japanese Burny, 1983 ... and I just bought SUHR Doug Aldrich PUPs ... how do I install them? I might be confused but I think the wiring is different from every example here... they have two wires that should be welded together (white and red) and taped, which leaves three wires, one bare, one green and one black. I´ll attach a picture of the original wiring... would you guys help me figure how I should change it ?

Originally Posted by jonesy

Looks to be a variation of the Gibson 50's wiring, but with the caps tied back to tone pots in more modern fashion. First thing I would do if you are not totally gutting the old pots etc. is get those little green chiclet caps out of there. Replace them with some better Tone caps and wire them from tone pots to volume pots as shown in diagrams below. IMO That in itself will be major Tone upgrade. You may want to consider replacing your jap pots with some quality CTS Pots. Just as easy to do it all now then have to go back and do it later. On Humbuckers with 4 wires generally the two taped off(red & white on duncans)are for coil splitting mods, the others are just hot, neg. & ground wires.


Thanks, jonesy

I have the same. Caps tied to the back of the tone pots, and to the outside lug. Then my switch wires are on the outside lugs of the volume pots. See below.



So it's 50s wiring/independent volumes, but with the caps tied back? Why tie it back anyway, and introduce new wires (shown in blue) in the process?

[jonesy]

There are many ways to wire a 2 v 2 t circuit with 3 way switch. the way your guitar looks is like many modern import guitars are wired up. Here is the diagram I use for 50's wiring, but it may or may not improve the sound of your guitar.

50's wiring allows bit more treble, and that may make your guitar sound a little harsh or bitey. You have to tinker and experiment if you really want to find what works best for your playing style and what sounds best to your ear.
Having the caps tied back to Tone pots is the way seymour duncan shows it in his diagrams?

[neils]

Funny I was just about to ask about variations on wiring and the variation the poster listed above.

I have a guitar with 2 P90's. I have an RS kit and '50's wiring in it now. I was cleaning up my bench and I found the OE Epiphone wiring. It has 2 small unknown unlabeled brownish caps that run from the mid lug on the tone pot to the body/ground of the tone pot.

This does what and why? And this is the same way Seymour Duncan shows 2 P90's wired on his site.

The RS kit is .22 Grey Tigers, 500K super vol pots and 250K audio tone pots.
Stock was 4 500K pots and these ? caps. I have standard '50's wiring in it now.

Neil

[lowe]

how big are the stock pots on an epiphone les paul custom? anyone know?

[shadowsong]

I just aquired a rather lovely honey burst plus top epi lp standard. The guy who had it sold it for 200 bucks so i got rather lucky. He had changed out some dead pots with the wrong pots and the top hat knobs didn't fit over the new pots so i got the right pots, dug my old soldering iron, and went to work. The bridge pickup was no big deal but the neck pickup is giving me a bit of trouble and I was wondering if maybe one of you guys could help. The wiring diagrams just don't seem to help with my issue.

firstly I'm not new to wiring electric guitars. I have been in and out of strat type guitars for years and recently managed to pull off ibanez split 5 wiring however - the les paul is a different beast altogether. The neck pickup itself is no big deal - the hot goes to the first lead on the neck volume pot the ground goes to the case of the pot. The tone pot has a similar set up with one wire coming off of it with two connections, one going to the first lead and the second coming off the case which if i recall before i desoldered everything these connections mirror the neck pickup - the connection coming off of the lead on the volume pot goes to the lead where the hot of the neck pickup goes and the other connection goes to the case.

Next is the quick connector harness thing coming off of the switch. I think this is where i'm messing up but i'm not sure - Every diagram i've seen has one connection here but the wire has two connections like a guitar pickup. One of them appears to be a hot which i am wiring to the second lead of the volume pot and the next is a braided cable like a ground so i am wiring it to the case.

what happens is nothing - the neck pickup doesn't work at all. Any ideas?

[sidepartings26]

[/QUOTE]

On this picture the ground wire from the switch seems to go straight to the jack (or vice versa depending on how you look at it). The ground wire isn't grounded to a pot on its way through the cavity.

This is confusing me (see above!! - don't, it will confuse you too). Does it need to stop at a pot for grounding or can it go switch -> jack directly?

[jonesy]

There are lot's of LP wiring diagrams already posted, I think you should find them and study them. If you cant find what you are looking for let me know.

peace, jonesy

[sidepartings26]

Ok man I have drawn 2 complete diagrams.

Which one will work?

[jonesy]

The 1st one looks ok from what I can see, the second does not complete ground loop.
Here is a diagram I use, caps are wired a bit differently but don't worry about that, look at switch wires.(switch is different style than what you have shown).

[sidepartings26]

So the wire coming from the switch ground lug needs to be sort of 'plugged in' to the ground loop that is going on with the pots; before it gets to the jack?

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by sidepartings26

So the wire coming from the switch ground lug needs to be sort of 'plugged in' to the ground loop that is going on with the pots; before it gets to the jack?

Yes, IMO that completes the circuit. Your ground wires from your pickups ground to the back of the pots, and that is also how the tone blends into the circuit so you need that ground loop for all that to work properly .

[sidepartings26]

Originally Posted by sidepartings26

How come that doesn't happen in this picture then. The wires from the jack bypass the cavity.

That's why I'm confused

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by sidepartings26

How come that doesn't happen in this picture then. The wires from the jack bypass the cavity.

That's why I'm confused

Well, let's see... you can't actually see the switch(or input jack for that matter), so how do you know the braided isn't grounded together like in this pic and grounded to the pots that way??

The ground has to loop, trust me I have wired up a few guitars before.

[GLP4me]

Originally Posted by jonesy

Well, let's see... you can't actually see the switch(or input jack for that matter), so how do you know the braided isn't grounded together like in this pic and grounded to the pots that way??

The ground has to loop, trust me I have wired up a few guitars before.

So Jonesy, what you're saying is that the braided ground wire from the input jack, when it crosses the treble volume braided wire that goes to the switch, are connected together somehow when they cross each other, right? (in this pic above)

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by GLP4me

So Jonesy, what you're saying is that the braided ground wire from the input jack, when it crosses the treble volume braided wire that goes to the switch, are connected together somehow when they cross each other, right? (in this pic above)

Yes sir, IMO that seems to be the case. I don't wire it that way, but it is an older way Gibson has done it. I think the LP's with the metal plate that have a central grounding point in the middle of the plate are kind of wired the same way.

[GLP4me]

Originally Posted by jonesy

Yes sir, IMO that seems to be the case. I don't wire it that way, but it is an older way Gibson has done it. I think the LP's with the metal plate that have a central grounding point in the middle of the plate are kind of wired the same way.

Quite interesting. How long did Gibson wire that way Jonesy?

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by GLP4me

Quite interesting. How long did Gibson wire that way Jonesy?

Can't say for sure as far as exact years go, but I would say they started out that way back in the 50's, and then switched up when they started installing the metal grounding plates in the 60's n 70's?

Wiring changed over the years and IMO varied from guitar to guitar, model to model. Someone else may have a little more detailed info. on exact years etc.

Gibson has gone through several changes in tone caps but they have all been .02/.022 50's Bumble Bees. 60's Black beauties. 70's large ceramic disc caps, 80's-Present small ceramic disc caps.

The latest change I am aware of in Gibson LP wiring is the new PCB circuit board in the new LP Standards, it still has the little 223 ceramic disc caps soldered to it though.

[sidepartings26]

Originally Posted by jonesy

Yes sir, IMO that seems to be the case. I don't wire it that way, but it is an older way Gibson has done it. I think the LP's with the metal plate that have a central grounding point in the middle of the plate are kind of wired the same way.

The metal plate was in mine which I think is a year 2000 model. It was basically wired so that the ground and hot go from the jack to a little fork poking out of the grounding plate. from there both ground and jack went to the switch seperately as part of '4 way pickup wire'. By that I mean two hots from each volume pot the earth and the ground from the ground plate fork all wrapped in foil and then tubing.

But the foil surrounding these wires was soldered to the bridge tone pot and also to the earth prong of the switch thus 'pluggin in' to the earth loop as Jonesy was suggesting above.

Does this mean then that the shielded wire I am going to run from the jack (gibson style silver colour) all the way to the switch needs not only to be soldered onto a bridge pot but soldered in such a way to the switch that the wire touches the lug, but so does the shielding?

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by sidepartings26

The metal plate was in mine which I think is a year 2000 model. It was basically wired so that the ground and hot go from the jack to a little fork poking out of the grounding plate. from there both ground and jack went to the switch seperately as part of '4 way pickup wire'. By that I mean two hots from each volume pot the earth and the ground from the ground plate fork all wrapped in foil and then tubing.

But the foil surrounding these wires was soldered to the bridge tone pot and also to the earth prong of the switch thus 'pluggin in' to the earth loop as Jonesy was suggesting above.

Does this mean then that the shielded wire I am going to run from the jack (gibson style silver colour) all the way to the switch needs not only to be soldered onto a bridge pot but soldered in such a way to the switch that the wire touches the lug, but so does the shielding?

Dude, this is not Rocket Science and you are over thinking it and making this way to complicated. You have several drawings and all the information you need to complete your LP wiring.

Go wire it up and see what happens, if you follow my instructions I guarantee it will work. You seem to be doubting what I am telling you for some reason, or maybe you should take it to a tech??

[sidepartings26]

lol.

I've got the skills down I need now, soldering etc

But now I want to do a 'perfect' install. So I don't want to take out the soldering iron and be desoldering or resoldering anything later on. I'm trying to be sure before I start as opposed to a see what happens; cause then if I have to change something it's a messy job...

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by sidepartings26

lol.

I've got the skills down I need now, soldering etc

But now I want to do a 'perfect' install. So I don't want to take out the soldering iron and be desoldering or resoldering anything later on. I'm trying to be sure before I start as opposed to a see what happens; cause then if I have to change something it's a messy job...

Understandable bro, I agree it good to be prepared before you begin. IMO You can talk about how to swim all day long, but at some point you need to jump in the water and go for it.

Making mistakes and correcting them is an essential part of the learning process IMHO, God knows that is how I learned

[Drudeboy]

The way I understand it is, as long as everything that needs to be connected to ground is, in any way, connected, it doesn't matter how you do it. Like on the metal plate, all the grounds from the pots, jack, switch, pu's just all come together and join there.

I suppose in theory you could connect a wire, insulated or not, to each ground on each part, ie. a wire from each pu ground, a wire from each pot case and lug that requires a connection to ground and one from the switch, then connect all these wires together and have one single wire from this bunch to the jack ground, it would work the same. If you metered this with a multimeter set on beep for continuity, and placed probes to measure between any two pot casing, it would beep.

It doesn't really matter what route the ground takes, it doesn't matter if you dont have a loop of ground outer braid going in a circle from pot to pot, as long as it all meets up at the jack ground, as each pot will have a physical connection to the ground, and to each others ground.

The different layouts on drawings or photos are just different ways of achieving the same thing (as opposed to a circuit diagram)

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by Drudeboy

The way I understand it is, as long as everything that needs to be connected to ground is, in any way, connected, it doesn't matter how you do it. Like on the metal plate, all the grounds from the pots, switch, pu's just all come together and join there.

[FourT6and2]

Ok, I've read through this thread and many others and I still can't find the answers to my questions. I have a 1979 Les Paul Custom. It looks like someone has been into the electronics before, judging from the horrible soldering job. I am going to be replacing the pots, switches, and input jack with new ones. The originals (?) are scratchy and the sweep sucks. I think they are 250-300k pots, but not sure. I like the guitar's sound, it's very dark and mellow. I'd like to keep it that way. But, I was thinking about going with RS Guitar Works kit. Probably the modern kit, even though the pots would be 500k. Unless there are better alternatives out there.

However, my guitar is currently wired to, what looks like, a modern style hybrid? I haven't found any diagrams or pictures that match the way my guitar is wired. Any insights would be appreciated. The guitar is not grounded, but it is shielded by a big metal cover that fits over the electronics cavity and the 3 way switch sits inside another metal cup-like piece that lines its cavity and it is grounded to that. However, the guitar, itself, is not grounded to the strings or bridge or anything. It doesn't really need it, though.

The bridge's tone control works differently than the neck's. The bridge's has a sort of "Q Filter" effect, almost like a wah pedal in the heel down position, when the tone control is all the way off. It's very cool and very subtle.

Anyway, any advice on how to wire up the guitar if I get new pots and such? Also, the input jack is some weird assembly that has the same shielded back as a pot, it's not a typical jack like I've seen.

My other question is how would the guitar sound wired up in the different configurations such as the Modern wiring, vintage wiring, 50's wiring, and etc.? Notice how there is no ground wire connecting all the pots and the caps are connecting the respective volume pot with its tone pot. Whereas, in the RS Modern kit, the caps are connecting the two tone pots together.

It seems there are many, many different ways to wire the guitar to a basic stock configuration (not talking about all the weird special ways for master tone/volue, parallel/series, and etc.) So, I'm a little lost as to how I should wire the guitar.

Here is a pic. I can get more detailed ones if needed.

[jonesy]

Lot's of posts in Tone Freaks on wiring, pots, caps etc.

[Drudeboy]

Originally Posted by FourT6and2

snipped

Here is a pic. I can get more detailed ones if needed.

This looks pretty much like stock wiring to me (the cap connections look stock from what I can make out) using the central grounding point on the plate, The pot chassys on the tones controls are grounded by them being bolted to the ground plate, rather than any grounding shield soldered to them.

Your guitar is grounded, all this means is that there is a phyical connection between the strings and the ground of the wiring. Easy to double check this, get a mutilmeter on continuity beep setting, touch your strings with one probe and a pot chassy with the other, then listen.

If your strings aren't connected to the ground, they should be, normally by a piece of wire that connects to the bridge from ground anywhere in the wiring harness.